I'm a newbie and I'm frustrated (long)

lakwriter · 12/27/2006, 06:35 PM

I have a 29g Eclipse system that I set up about 2 months ago after about 10 mos. of planning and researching. Here are my specs:

35# LR, 40# LS (the LR was fully cured when I added it)
Hagen AquaClear 50 PH
Marineland 200w heater
the pump that came with the Eclise system
I am currently using the carbon filter cartridge, but not the BioWheel
I am using filtered SW from LFS
Lighting: 2 t5, 18 watt bulbs - 1 daylight, 1 actinic on 12-hour cycle
LED moon lights at night

Livestock:
3 green chromis
2 ocellaris clowns
5 astrea snails
2 nassarius snails
6 tiny blue-legged hermits

My frustration is this: I received this system as a gift and I am trying to retrofit it in various ways to improve it. Unfortunately, there was just no way to share my prior research with my mother before she bought the system and she meant well. It cannot be returned. Its a decent start, but I continue to have trouble...

I wanted to add a protein skimmer, so I bought a used AquaC Remora HOT skimmer with the MJ 1200 pump. I cut my hood to allow for the space needed for the skimmer. After a day of operation, I had to do something about the noise and found the paper towel mod which worked great for the water noise, but did diddly for the humming sound apparently coming from the pump. Long story short, I got sick of listening to it and tired of playing with it, so I removed it from the tank and put back in the Eclipse pump. I am afraid I am stressing my fish.

I am trying to feed the absolute minimum and the inverts are doing a great job controlling alge and diatom growth. I am doing weekly 2.5 gallon water changes. My water tests are okay, ammonia 0, ph 8.2, salinity 1.022, nitrites .05ppm. I can't get an accurate nitrate reading b/c of the nitrites. I had hoped adding the skimmer would help with this.

I do not have the luxury of space, nor a sump or refugium. Do you have any advice to help me? I'd always wanted a SW tank after several years of FW as a kid, and I'm trying so hard to provide a good environment, but I'm getting discouraged, which I know just makes matters worse.

sir_dudeguy · 12/27/2006, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Long story short, I got sick of listening to it and tired of playing with it, so I removed it from the tank and put back in the Eclipse pump

first, all skimmers will take at least 4 or so days to break in. Most for a week even, or possibly more. But deffinately not one day. So you didnt even allow for yours to break in before you removed it. I've got the same skimmer and it is silent. It was noisy for the first week or so but now that its been running for 9 months its completely quiet..

you say your water is testing out ok...not completely tho. You should not have any nitrite, and your SG should be more like 1.025 if you want inverts/corals. and i dont really see why you cant get a proper reading of nitrates if you've got nitrites...Are you using salifert brand test kits? If not, i'd strongly suggest it because they're the most accurate ones unless you wanna pay hundreds for lab equipment

But if you're 100% positive your nitrite readings are correct, then that would indicate that the cycle never finished.

niloc16 · 12/27/2006, 07:20 PM

my remora took about 3 weeks before it was quiet enough so that it wasnt annoying.

Drew Reed · 12/27/2006, 07:29 PM

To Reef Central

newtanksmell · 12/27/2006, 07:34 PM

I am unfamiliar with the Ecplipse system but understand some of your frustration with an all-in-one As I have a BC 29. I have done a number of modifications. Choices were extremely limited.

I would recommend a couple of things, and remember, I'm also new to saltwater side of things.

The first thing you need is to develop confidence in your testing. Without being 100% confident in your readings, there is no way to take corrective action.

The first thing to do is take all of your readings. Salinity, PH, Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates. Wash all of your test vials out prior to testing. Follow the instructions to the letter. Follow the time to the letter. Write down your results.

Next, take a healthy water sample down to the best LFS in your area. Typically they will charge you a couple of bucks but it is worth it. Write down their results and take them home. Compare them to your results.

You will find discrepancies. Some test kits are not as accurate as others. Further, if the test kit is old, if the contents have been comtaminated, if they cooked in a box on the dock, they could give inaccurate readings.

I have found hydrometers to be horribly inaccurate. I have 2. One reads .002 over at all times and the other reads .005 under.

You are essentially calibrating your test kits and your hydrometer, as silly as it sounds.

Now about the nitrites. I'm not an expert but it sounds to me like something is cycling. Amon. is being converted to trites but not yet to trates. Your system contains more waste than your live rock/system can keep up with at this point. You need to fire that skimmer back up. It will help pull waste out of the tank.

While most people would recommend that you allow tank to complete the cycle you have to protect the health of your fish.

If you don't have a friend that can take your fish for the time being, I'd start with a 10% water change. Make sure that your ph, salinity and temperature match.

Most importantly, hang in there and stay positive. If you truly garner great pleasure in SW tanks as I do, it's worth fighting for. Don't give up.

It's like detective work. Once you identify the problem, you look for the source of the problem. Sometimes it's not glaringly obvious.

Whatever changes you make, DO SO SLOWLY !!!!! I hope this helps.

lakwriter · 12/27/2006, 07:37 PM

I am using the Red Sea tests. The instructions say that if any nitrites are present, then the nitrate tests will be skewed. I'll look into the Salifert kits.

I'm not looking to add corals for a long time, maybe a year.

I bought the skimmer used, so I'm a little confused why it would still be breaking in. It doesn't seem to be the skimmer thats making the bulk of the noise...its the pump. Its vibrating a lot.

kass03 · 12/27/2006, 07:38 PM

Hmmm I got my remora used and it was always silent.

Are you sure the pump was'nt resting on something or the tank top touching the pipe to make it hum?
The only time mine hums is if I bump my light to close and it rests on the pipe that goes into the water on the pump.

And yes nitrites should be 0.
It's best to shoot for 0 on nitrates also but a little nitrate say under 20 shouldnt affect anything but maybe some SPS.

kass

lakwriter · 12/27/2006, 08:19 PM

I just checked the pump in a tub of freshwater and it made the same noise and vibration as it did on my tank. So its not from being attached to anything. I also checked the impeller and it appears to be fine and not clogged or anything.

bertoni · 12/27/2006, 08:40 PM

Salifert tests also have nitrite-nitrate interference issues, I think. I much prefer them to Red Sea test kits, though, which were bad enough that I had to return my set.

This article will help calibrate your hydrometer:

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-06/rhf/index.php

I would recommend getting a refractometer or a conductivity meter when finances permit. Hydrometers tend to be touchy.

I agree with the water changes. If you haven't done any for a while, a few 20% changes would be a good idea. For the long haul, 10% a week would be useful, especially without a skimmer. I've never found a quiet skimmer, although that pump might be defective or dirty. You might try disassembling and cleaning it, if you haven't done that yet.

I wouldn't worry too much about the nitrite, and I'd get a second opinion, since I don't trust Red Sea kits. Nitrite is not toxic in any case.

kass03 · 12/27/2006, 08:45 PM

When you checked the pump in the tub was it resting on anything say the bottom of the tub? Try it just hanging from the chord not touching anything and it should'nt make alot of noise.

I have mine in my 55 gal resting on a live rock. It does vibrate a little but doesnt make any noise. I put a few rocks under it just to keep it from coming off the pipe/tube.
Seems to me now that I think of it the person I got it from modded it a little by using a pvc pipe with a small piece of hose connected to the pump instead of just the stock hose.
I still don't think it should make noise though. I also have the mj 1200 on mine.

kass

sir_dudeguy · 12/27/2006, 08:49 PM

Quote:

I bought the skimmer used, so I'm a little confused why it would still be breaking in.

no it will still have to break in. If it has been dry for any time, it will have to break in.

lakwriter · 12/27/2006, 08:53 PM

it wasn't resting on anything. I was dangling it from the cord when I tested it in the tub.

Other than removing the impeller and cleaning it and the hole where it fits, how might I clean the powerhead in case its somehow clogged?

sir_dudeguy · 12/27/2006, 09:03 PM

did you try some vinegar to clean it out? What iv'e done is just get a gallon of vinegar from walmart (white vinegar) and just save it for aquarium use. Just stick the powerhead in somehow and turn it on for a minute. I did that and it got lots cleaner.

12/27/2006, 06:35 PM	#1
lakwriter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 562	I'm a newbie and I'm frustrated (long) I have a 29g Eclipse system that I set up about 2 months ago after about 10 mos. of planning and researching. Here are my specs: 35# LR, 40# LS (the LR was fully cured when I added it) Hagen AquaClear 50 PH Marineland 200w heater the pump that came with the Eclise system I am currently using the carbon filter cartridge, but not the BioWheel I am using filtered SW from LFS Lighting: 2 t5, 18 watt bulbs - 1 daylight, 1 actinic on 12-hour cycle LED moon lights at night Livestock: 3 green chromis 2 ocellaris clowns 5 astrea snails 2 nassarius snails 6 tiny blue-legged hermits My frustration is this: I received this system as a gift and I am trying to retrofit it in various ways to improve it. Unfortunately, there was just no way to share my prior research with my mother before she bought the system and she meant well. It cannot be returned. Its a decent start, but I continue to have trouble... I wanted to add a protein skimmer, so I bought a used AquaC Remora HOT skimmer with the MJ 1200 pump. I cut my hood to allow for the space needed for the skimmer. After a day of operation, I had to do something about the noise and found the paper towel mod which worked great for the water noise, but did diddly for the humming sound apparently coming from the pump. Long story short, I got sick of listening to it and tired of playing with it, so I removed it from the tank and put back in the Eclipse pump. I am afraid I am stressing my fish. I am trying to feed the absolute minimum and the inverts are doing a great job controlling alge and diatom growth. I am doing weekly 2.5 gallon water changes. My water tests are okay, ammonia 0, ph 8.2, salinity 1.022, nitrites .05ppm. I can't get an accurate nitrate reading b/c of the nitrites. I had hoped adding the skimmer would help with this. I do not have the luxury of space, nor a sump or refugium. Do you have any advice to help me? I'd always wanted a SW tank after several years of FW as a kid, and I'm trying so hard to provide a good environment, but I'm getting discouraged, which I know just makes matters worse.

12/27/2006, 07:20 PM	#3
niloc16 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: mission Posts: 212	my remora took about 3 weeks before it was quiet enough so that it wasnt annoying. __________________ colin Current Tank Info: 265gal system 75gal sump

12/27/2006, 07:34 PM	#5
newtanksmell Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Arizona Posts: 825	I am unfamiliar with the Ecplipse system but understand some of your frustration with an all-in-one As I have a BC 29. I have done a number of modifications. Choices were extremely limited. I would recommend a couple of things, and remember, I'm also new to saltwater side of things. The first thing you need is to develop confidence in your testing. Without being 100% confident in your readings, there is no way to take corrective action. The first thing to do is take all of your readings. Salinity, PH, Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates. Wash all of your test vials out prior to testing. Follow the instructions to the letter. Follow the time to the letter. Write down your results. Next, take a healthy water sample down to the best LFS in your area. Typically they will charge you a couple of bucks but it is worth it. Write down their results and take them home. Compare them to your results. You will find discrepancies. Some test kits are not as accurate as others. Further, if the test kit is old, if the contents have been comtaminated, if they cooked in a box on the dock, they could give inaccurate readings. I have found hydrometers to be horribly inaccurate. I have 2. One reads .002 over at all times and the other reads .005 under. You are essentially calibrating your test kits and your hydrometer, as silly as it sounds. Now about the nitrites. I'm not an expert but it sounds to me like something is cycling. Amon. is being converted to trites but not yet to trates. Your system contains more waste than your live rock/system can keep up with at this point. You need to fire that skimmer back up. It will help pull waste out of the tank. While most people would recommend that you allow tank to complete the cycle you have to protect the health of your fish. If you don't have a friend that can take your fish for the time being, I'd start with a 10% water change. Make sure that your ph, salinity and temperature match. Most importantly, hang in there and stay positive. If you truly garner great pleasure in SW tanks as I do, it's worth fighting for. Don't give up. It's like detective work. Once you identify the problem, you look for the source of the problem. Sometimes it's not glaringly obvious. Whatever changes you make, DO SO SLOWLY !!!!! I hope this helps. __________________ What in the name of corn on the cob is going on here ? - Buffalobunch Current Tank Info: 120g,40g sump,15g ref. 15g DIY ATO, 2x Seio 1100s w/ cont, 2x250 Ham HQI w/ 14K Phoenix, 440 ARO VHO, ASM G3 modded, MDQX4,MDC2 CL. And a buttload of PVC.

12/27/2006, 07:37 PM	#6
lakwriter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 562	I am using the Red Sea tests. The instructions say that if any nitrites are present, then the nitrate tests will be skewed. I'll look into the Salifert kits. I'm not looking to add corals for a long time, maybe a year. I bought the skimmer used, so I'm a little confused why it would still be breaking in. It doesn't seem to be the skimmer thats making the bulk of the noise...its the pump. Its vibrating a lot. __________________ And this, too, shall pass... 29 g FOWLR 37# LR, 35# LS 2 green chromis 2 ocellaris clowns a very social peppermint shrimp and various snails and hermits

12/27/2006, 08:19 PM	#8
lakwriter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 562	I just checked the pump in a tub of freshwater and it made the same noise and vibration as it did on my tank. So its not from being attached to anything. I also checked the impeller and it appears to be fine and not clogged or anything. __________________ And this, too, shall pass... 29 g FOWLR 37# LR, 35# LS 2 green chromis 2 ocellaris clowns a very social peppermint shrimp and various snails and hermits

12/27/2006, 07:29 PM	#4
Drew Reed Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bear lake, MI Posts: 252	*To Reef Central*

12/27/2006, 07:38 PM	#7
kass03 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Kaukauna, Wi Posts: 2,937	Hmmm I got my remora used and it was always silent. Are you sure the pump was'nt resting on something or the tank top touching the pipe to make it hum? The only time mine hums is if I bump my light to close and it rests on the pipe that goes into the water on the pump. And yes nitrites should be 0. It's best to shoot for 0 on nitrates also but a little nitrate say under 20 shouldnt affect anything but maybe some SPS. kass

12/27/2006, 08:40 PM	#9
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Salifert tests also have nitrite-nitrate interference issues, I think. I much prefer them to Red Sea test kits, though, which were bad enough that I had to return my set. This article will help calibrate your hydrometer: http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-06/rhf/index.php I would recommend getting a refractometer or a conductivity meter when finances permit. Hydrometers tend to be touchy. I agree with the water changes. If you haven't done any for a while, a few 20% changes would be a good idea. For the long haul, 10% a week would be useful, especially without a skimmer. I've never found a quiet skimmer, although that pump might be defective or dirty. You might try disassembling and cleaning it, if you haven't done that yet. I wouldn't worry too much about the nitrite, and I'd get a second opinion, since I don't trust Red Sea kits. Nitrite is not toxic in any case. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

12/27/2006, 08:45 PM	#10
kass03 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Kaukauna, Wi Posts: 2,937	When you checked the pump in the tub was it resting on anything say the bottom of the tub? Try it just hanging from the chord not touching anything and it should'nt make alot of noise. I have mine in my 55 gal resting on a live rock. It does vibrate a little but doesnt make any noise. I put a few rocks under it just to keep it from coming off the pipe/tube. Seems to me now that I think of it the person I got it from modded it a little by using a pvc pipe with a small piece of hose connected to the pump instead of just the stock hose. I still don't think it should make noise though. I also have the mj 1200 on mine. kass

12/27/2006, 08:53 PM	#12
lakwriter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 562	it wasn't resting on anything. I was dangling it from the cord when I tested it in the tub. Other than removing the impeller and cleaning it and the hole where it fits, how might I clean the powerhead in case its somehow clogged? __________________ And this, too, shall pass... 29 g FOWLR 37# LR, 35# LS 2 green chromis 2 ocellaris clowns a very social peppermint shrimp and various snails and hermits

12/27/2006, 09:03 PM	#13
sir_dudeguy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 10,841	did you try some vinegar to clean it out? What iv'e done is just get a gallon of vinegar from walmart (white vinegar) and just save it for aquarium use. Just stick the powerhead in somehow and turn it on for a minute. I did that and it got lots cleaner. __________________ TAKE...LUCK!!!