Your new tank....how to judge fish v inverts.

Sk8r · 02/04/2007, 11:35 AM

This analogy occurred to me while I was answering another question and I think it's a valuable one.
People are always asking "Can I have?" and "How much?" and here is a really good rule of thumb...

This will show what's going on in your cycle and setup.

Draw a pyramid. Divide it into 3 even parts, top, middle, bottom.

The bottom of your pyramid is the bacteria in your sand and rock: the nitrate conversion bacteria: it runs on poo, and produces nitrogen bubbles that float to the surface and go away. It should be the biggest part of your tank. That's why you have 3-4 inches of sandbed and 1-2 lbs of live rock per gallon.

The middle tier of your pyramid is the invertebrates: that's the bristleworms, sponges, dusters, hermits, snails, and corals, too, that eat the particles the bottom tier just broke down: they feed on light and on poo, and the corals are the top end of that lot: they absorb any nutrition left in the detritus.

The very peak of your pyramid is your fish, that eat something injected into the tank, convert it to poo, and feed the two tiers below. Do you notice the relative size of this section of the pyramid? This is the safe ratio of fish to the other two sections, and anything exceeding this will be increasingly chancy, requiring larger and larger injections of biomass for everything else to convert---especially if the fish miss eating it. Do you see why overfeeding is a problem? But if you keep your fish load within this section, your tank tends to be far more stable.

A real good skimmer helps back up the first tier, sort of broadens the base of your pyramid and thus increases every other section. But it can't do everything.

I just thought this little analogy might help you 'see' your tank in a new, proportional way, and provide a model to help newbies understand how one section has to balance against another.

crazy4salt · 02/04/2007, 12:42 PM

Great post!

Where were you a year ago? lol

Sk8r · 02/04/2007, 12:44 PM

Thanks!

School of hard knocks, here!

crazy4salt · 02/04/2007, 12:51 PM

Here too,

Finally have everything settled down.

I think maybe they should make a sticky of this thread, or at least the first post. It really does put things in an easier to understand prospective for "newbies".

It can be overwhelming when you are first starting out and have zero idea what to do when, and why.

Sk8r · 02/04/2007, 04:11 PM

Yep, just about everybody starts out microfocusing on the area of their particular interest, and getting way ambitious in a particular area. THen ya learns!

kookerson · 02/04/2007, 04:56 PM

Great analogy! Im gonna be remembering this one! : )

Sk8r · 02/04/2007, 05:33 PM

THanks---for me, it also serves as a reminder not to let attrition deplete my inverts who are supposed to be helping out the sandbed. I have most of my original hermits, one of the peps, both of the conches, but it's probably about time to replenish the hermits...

cowboyswife · 02/04/2007, 05:48 PM

Very great thread! I never thought about it that way, so thank you! *applause*

Scooter12ga · 02/05/2007, 04:33 PM

Cheers to you! For those literary challenged persons in cyberspace I've converted Sk8r's description into a handy-dandy visual aid. Enjoy!

02/04/2007, 11:35 AM	#1
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Your new tank....how to judge fish v inverts. This analogy occurred to me while I was answering another question and I think it's a valuable one. People are always asking "Can I have?" and "How much?" and here is a really good rule of thumb... This will show what's going on in your cycle and setup. Draw a pyramid. Divide it into 3 even parts, top, middle, bottom. The bottom of your pyramid is the bacteria in your sand and rock: the nitrate conversion bacteria: it runs on poo, and produces nitrogen bubbles that float to the surface and go away. It should be the biggest part of your tank. That's why you have 3-4 inches of sandbed and 1-2 lbs of live rock per gallon. The middle tier of your pyramid is the invertebrates: that's the bristleworms, sponges, dusters, hermits, snails, and corals, too, that eat the particles the bottom tier just broke down: they feed on light and on poo, and the corals are the top end of that lot: they absorb any nutrition left in the detritus. The very peak of your pyramid is your fish, that eat something injected into the tank, convert it to poo, and feed the two tiers below. Do you notice the relative size of this section of the pyramid? This is the safe ratio of fish to the other two sections, and anything exceeding this will be increasingly chancy, requiring larger and larger injections of biomass for everything else to convert---especially if the fish miss eating it. Do you see why overfeeding is a problem? But if you keep your fish load within this section, your tank tends to be far more stable. A real good skimmer helps back up the first tier, sort of broadens the base of your pyramid and thus increases every other section. But it can't do everything. I just thought this little analogy might help you 'see' your tank in a new, proportional way, and provide a model to help newbies understand how one section has to balance against another. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

02/04/2007, 12:44 PM	#3
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Thanks! School of hard knocks, here! __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

02/04/2007, 04:11 PM	#5
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Yep, just about everybody starts out microfocusing on the area of their particular interest, and getting way ambitious in a particular area. THen ya learns! __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

02/04/2007, 05:33 PM	#7
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	THanks---for me, it also serves as a reminder not to let attrition deplete my inverts who are supposed to be helping out the sandbed. I have most of my original hermits, one of the peps, both of the conches, but it's probably about time to replenish the hermits... __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

02/05/2007, 04:33 PM	#9
Scooter12ga Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 294	Cheers to you! For those literary challenged persons in cyberspace I've converted Sk8r's description into a handy-dandy visual aid. Enjoy! __________________ ~Mike & 'Z' Current Tank Info: 75g, 55g sump/fuge, 440w VHO

02/04/2007, 12:42 PM	#2
crazy4salt Topsy Turvy Child Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: PA Posts: 266	Great post! Where were you a year ago? lol

02/04/2007, 12:51 PM	#4
crazy4salt Topsy Turvy Child Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: PA Posts: 266	Here too, Finally have everything settled down. I think maybe they should make a sticky of this thread, or at least the first post. It really does put things in an easier to understand prospective for "newbies". It can be overwhelming when you are first starting out and have zero idea what to do when, and why.

02/04/2007, 04:56 PM	#6
kookerson Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,017	Great analogy! Im gonna be remembering this one! : )

02/04/2007, 05:48 PM	#8
cowboyswife Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Deltona FL Posts: 2,187	Very great thread! I never thought about it that way, so thank you! applause