Bubble Master 200 / 250 noise comparisons

[johns]

Bubble Master 200 and 250 models-

How noisy are these skimmers compared to the typical needle wheel impeller models (ER, ASM, etc)?

How about compared to one another 200 vs 250?

[klam114]

Much more quiet. The air noise on the BM250 is more noisy than BM200, but then it's pulling around 1,800lph between 2 pumps. Any pump vibration noise when the skimmer is brand new will work itself out as the skimmer breaks in and becomes really quiet. The only real noise is splashing as the water returns to the sump from the exhaust, but that can easily be remedied. If you are considering for either of your current setups, the BM200 is oversized already, no need for a BM250 or that's severly oversized.

[johns]

klam114-
thanks for the info. i was under the impression these skimmers came with silencer mechanisms for the air intakes. was i wrong about this? and regardless, cant you insert the air intakes into some sort of 'muffler'.

I am more concerned about pump noise, as that can usually be much more difficult to work out.

Oh, and I didn't update my current tanks yet. My new setup is actually right on the verge of either skimmer. It is a 185G peninsula with 30G in the sump and a 70G grow out tank plumbed along with. So about 285G. Maybe closer to 250G or a little below with all the rock.

[klam114]

Some think that even with the silencer, it's a bit noisy. On my BM200, no problems with noise. In fact, I've seen a lot of owners remove the filter floss from the silencer.

The BM250 would give you room for overstocking, heavy feeding or works better if you have a SPS dominated tank. If you're planning on a FOWLR tank or lighter bioload, the BM200 will do it.

[lvpd186]

The only real "noise" that I hear from my BM250 is the sound of water splashing. klam114 is right in saying that it is an easy problem to fix, I just haven't found it to be that big of a problem to worry about.

[johns]

lvpd186-

so you dont hear the air intake noise?
a bit different than what klam114 says

[lvpd186]

Mine is an in-wall setup so I can't really hear the air intake. When I am in the fish room (I like the sound of that, but my wife has the nerve to call it the laundry room ) and I put the water return under water (by adding an elbow) I can hear the air intake, I just wouldn't call it loud. I can't hear it on the tank side of the wall, but I'm not sure how loud it would be in a typical stand under the tank.

[mavgi]

johns :

for 30 gallon sump go with the BM200 .

IMO if you can afford that change to bigger sump at least 50 gallon and go with the BM250 .

the BM200 will perform well on 185 gallon but with the BM250 you will be able to run more water thru the skimmer and after cycle of some month the system will be more clean .

i run BM250 on 120 gallon the skimmer perfrom very well there is no overskimming in my tank i feed 2 time (heavy) and the skimmer work great .

lvpd186 :

there is a way to cut all the noise , here what i did for test :

1. i mod my pumps with 3 layer of mesh .

2. skimmer was in 9" depth (water level in the sump).

3. i take out the "T" and change the air pipe 3 time longer.

no splash or air noise and the skimmer work very well .

this skimmer have a lot of way or option to work with and the perfromance always great .

[johns]

mavgi-

i'm not sure why the size of the sump should dictate which model skimmer to get? should i just go by total water volume?

My sump sits in a cabinet behind the tank, and it pretty much has to stay the size it is.

[mavgi]

Originally posted by johns
mavgi-

i'm not sure why the size of the sump should dictate which model skimmer to get? should i just go by total water volume?

My sump sits in a cabinet behind the tank, and it pretty much has to stay the size it is.

the reason i said that because i don't know if the BM250 can fit in your 30 gallon sump (footprint) and if this sump divided i don't think you will have the space for it unless the sump have the space and i don't know that.

[johns]

It's a custom made acrylic sump tank. The overall dimensions are about 40 x 16.5 x 16. The water level was set at 10 inches with the baffles.

The chamber I want to keep the skimmer in is baffled off to make it bout 16.5 x 12. It seems like either model should fit. To be honest, I have been more concerned about noise more than anything, since the current skimmer I use is a bit noisy for me.

Of course there are drain lines going into that chamber too, so it is a little bit tight, so I have honestly been wondering about this, and I'm glad you brought it up.

So thats a good point - I'm wondering when I see the footprints listed at ReefGeek are they pretty much accurate. Are these the actual dimensions of that bottom white plate that the skimmer sits on? Or are they more just like estimated dimensions of skimmer body/pump like a lot of other skimmers show.

Did anyone measure the exact dimensions of that bottom plate?

From ReefGeek website-
BM250 Dimensions: 14.2" x 9.5" x 20.8" (L x W x H)
BM200 Dimensions: 12.7" x 8.6" x 19.1" (L x W x H)

[mavgi]

i was able to put my BM250 on my other side of the sump :
11" W x 16" D i was needed to modify the drain pipe and you can't move the hand a lot in this area but the skimmer work very well .

i don't know what type of skimmer and pump you run now but the truth unless the splash you don't hear nothing when the cabinet door close.
as i said if you can change the air pipe (and i don't think a lot of ppl will complain about the air) and put in without the the "T" or add to it elbow you will cut the noise .

before i run skimmers with sedra pump , gen x pump and compare to the BM250 they make noise .

edit: my drain pipe make more noise then the skimmer.

[johns]

i was able to put my BM250 on my other side of the sump :
11" W x 16" D i was needed to modify the drain pipe and you can't move the hand a lot in this area but the skimmer work very well .

mavgi-
Could you clarify that a bit? Did you actually need 11 x 16 to fit the BM250 in there? Because of something specific to your setup, or was it due to mods needed for the skimmer?

If you really needed that much space it may not work for me. It's cutting it too close with 2 drain lines going in there as well. maybe would have to consider the BM200 after all.

[mavgi]

sorry , i will try better and there was mistake with the size .

i make compare between 2 skimmer i was need to move the BM250 to the other side of the sump (it was a fuge area before) because the other skimmer wasn't able to sit in the original skimmer area (i swap the BM250).

this area was laready exist from the begin with a baffle and the wide was 11" (the all sump it's 36" x 18" x 19H" ) the depth was 18" and not as i type before 16" (sorry about that) .

if your sump depth 16" and you have 2 drain pipe i think you will have problem to fit the BM250 .
it's all depend how you can play with the drain pipe and i am sure the pump's will be near to it the skimmer will not preform well at all (because you will not be able to put the side of the cup near to the drain pipe area at all) .

if the pump's will be near to the 2 drain pipe this skimmer will prduce 50% then what it's should do , and to be honest with you if you can't change the sump don't buy the BM250 (i don't like to said so but i am honest) .

i never test the BM200 and now because of that i also suggest to you to ask ppl that run BM200 about the noise because in this skimmer you can't work without the gate valve mod.

[klam114]

johns, if your bioload or feeding is not extra heavy, go with the BM200. The BM200 is also very quiet, since you mentioned that you are concerned about noise. I don't think the BM250 air draw is very noisy, but it is noisier than the BM200 as it is drawing a lot of air. Pumps are quiet once broken in and the water splashing won't be a problem as the BM200 runs with a gate valve that can run submerged.

but if you want to go a little bigger, or might upgrade in the future again, or intend to feed heavy or have a heavy bioload, by all means go with the BM250. for the power behind the BM250, I don't think the air draw is very noisy, definitely not as noisy asl other high end skimmers that I observed. You partitioned space for the skimmer should fit either unit.

[johns]

if your sump depth 16" and you have 2 drain pipe i think you will have problem to fit the BM250 .
it's all depend how you can play with the drain pipe and i am sure the pump's will be near to it the skimmer will not preform well at all (because you will not be able to put the side of the cup near to the drain pipe area at all) .

if the pump's will be near to the 2 drain pipe this skimmer will prduce 50% then what it's should do

mavgi-

thanks for you help so far. i really do appreciate it. I am having trouble visualizing what you are saying here though. I dont think I understand what you mean about the lower performance of this skimmer near the drain pipes.

To make sure you understand my sump area completely, let me clarify - the skimmer section of my sump is 16.5" x 12" and has a water depth of 10". There are 2 drain lines fed into that area as well - they are connected via spa flex tubing so I can move them around a little, but they do take up some room for sure.

I appreciate your help. I wouldn't want to spend the extra money on the larger model if it would really be a problem.

Another question- does the BM250 have 2 separate air intakes for each pump, or are they tied together somehow?

[klam114]

The BM skimmer behave better is the pump input area is as calm as possible. So, I think what mavgi is saying is that you need to face the pumps on the opposite side where the overflow plumbing feeds into the skimmer compartment. Yes, the 2 air hose on the BM250 inserts into the silencer side by side. You can try the BM skimmer at 10" sump waterlevel and if skimming too wet and no further adjustment to lower the bubble breaking level within the skimmer, you may need to raise the skimmer with a short stand so that the sump waterlevel is about 6"-8" compared to the skimmer. Either skimmer will work for you, just depends on what you plan to keep and what your future plans are. Skimmers aren't like electronics, they don't get cheaper over time.

[johns]

The BM skimmer behave better is the pump input area is as calm as possible.

OK. Let me give a few more details. The water level in this skimmer/drain section of the sump is very consistent. I use 1" spa flex tubing for the drain lines coming from the bulkheads in the overflow. Each spa flex drain line ends in a PVC elbow which then connects into a vertical 'standpipe' that is enlarged out to 2" PVC and extends down to the bottom of the sump. The top of the standpipe has a hole drilled for air to exit out. This enlarged PVC standpipe minimizes the bubbles and turbulence that enters in this drain section. There are usually only small/minor bubbles exiting at the bottom of the drain standpipe.

So with that in mind, is there still a big issue with performance of this skimmer in the drain section. What exactly causes the problems?

I'm still undecided between BM200 and BM250. I'm leaning towards the BM200 because 1) cheaper 2) less chance of any bothersome noise 3) my bioload (although the bioload in the 185 display might be considered heavy, the load in the sump/grow-out will probably be rather low, so overall, for the total 250-285G, it might be more like a med bioload).

However, I have heard that the BM200 has more performance issues than the BM250. So my other question is, are there more modifications, generations coming down the road for the BM200? I could wait a few months for the latest and best changes to come along if any are planned right now.

[Creetin]

A gate valve has taken care of the issue's with the 200's
I have been getting great results with my 250 and my sump is quite turbulent in the skimmer area so i dunno. I wouldnt think i could get better performance if it was calm. I could try that and see though.

[johns]

Creetin-

What do you think of any noise issues with your skimmer? Especially pump noise that you cant do much about.

[klam114]

There was really no performance issue (in my opinion) with the BM200. I know that the experts in the BM skimmer arena, my local dealer being one of them, have suggested to ATi to use the fully potential of the Sicci pump, rather down trim down the meshpad to reduce the strength behind the pump to adjust for a smaller skimmer like the BM200. ATi responded and did modify the skimmer body to accomodate the full potential of the Sicci pump. I know that my local dealer never liked the adjustable T exhaust, he's always prefer something like a ball/gate valve mod instead and it's really only about $10-$15 extra in cost. When ATi modify the BM200, now the adjustable T could not give full range of adjustment to the internal waterlevel of the skimmer, so the ball/gate valve was reintroduced to take care of the adjustment. It was a very simple fix and I know that my local dealer has said that over and over again from day 1. I am lucky as my ball valve mod is more of a convenience than a necessity. My local dealer has told me on 2 different shipments now, that there isn't any improvements planned for the BM200. But you just never know as ATi reacts to new owners suggestions and complaints very quickly and a change can take place and not even be mentioned.

[johns]

Oops. Just saw your response in the other thread, klam114

OK. One more thing.

Are there differences in material construction between the BM200/BM200? I understand there is 2 pumps vs 1, slightly different footprints. But is there different acrylic used - thicker, anything? or are materials basically the same.

BTW, Thanks for all your help so far