How many of you guys use a rubbermaid trash can for RO?DI storage?

zero26 · 08/31/2009, 07:04 PM

Just curious, I am running a generic 32 gal trash can. Saw the 40 sticker on the rubbermaid trash can

badwrasse · 08/31/2009, 07:13 PM

generic 35gal for $12 at lowes

PRDubois · 08/31/2009, 07:21 PM

Lots of people use them

powers2001 · 08/31/2009, 07:47 PM

40 sticker? You're not meaning $40, are you?

I'll be using a trash can too. Haven't figured on how I will plumb it though.

BackSpin · 08/31/2009, 08:36 PM

You have to watch that cheep cans will not leech out toxins over time, Brute cans arent cheep but are FDA approved for food and are safe for storage, I held my breath when buying mine to since the one next to it was less then half. LOL

allactiondan · 08/31/2009, 08:45 PM

I use a rubbermade "brute" garbage can. Expensive, yes. Is my tank worth more then 50 bucks, yes.
For all the money you have invested in your tank, whats an other 40 bucks...

badwrasse · 08/31/2009, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BackSpin
You have to watch that cheep cans will not leech out toxins over time, Brute cans arent cheep but are FDA approved for food and are safe for storage, I held my breath when buying mine to since the one next to it was less then half. LOL

really i did not know this does anyone half something to read or a link on this

jason2459 · 08/31/2009, 08:50 PM

I use the gray rubermaid for mixing salt water and a cheap generic gray bucket with the HDPE label for ATO ro/di water.

Flipper62 · 08/31/2009, 08:58 PM

The Brute trash cans have been used for a long time. There has been talk ( All The Time ) that there not safe...... And you need to use a Food Safe Container.

If you check out the specs on the can......or better yet, check their website. It says

USDA Meat & Poultry Equipment Group Listed and assist in complying with HACCP guidelines.

I do agree that if it doesn't say food safe, I wouldn't use it. Plastic containers are made from petroleum.....Not Good. However if it is formulated with other chemicals that make it FOOD SAFE.....then it should be fine

zero26 · 08/31/2009, 09:21 PM

What kind of toxins could it leech?

Flipper62 · 08/31/2009, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by zero26
What kind of toxins could it leech?

It all depends on how its made. Its just like water tubing. Its made from petroleum.....some are just for watering....like a garden hose & others say ( SAFE FOR DRINKING WATER ).

In any case.....IMO, I only use containers that say FOOD SAFE

bfuqua · 08/31/2009, 09:33 PM

I vote Brute cans. I have had these for 3 years and they are still going strong.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pi...&id=1377166422

sedor · 08/31/2009, 09:43 PM

I use the cheaper version rubbermaid roughneck as well. I've been meaning to upgrade to a BRUTE for a long time now.

Flipper62 · 08/31/2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ryandlf
I use the cheaper version rubbermaid roughneck as well. I've been meaning to upgrade to a BRUTE for a long time now.

If the Roughneck cans are not food safe ( I dont know ).......Dont scrap them. Use them for your scrap water comming out of the tank in your water changes.

MGDMIRAGE · 09/01/2009, 12:51 AM

Are there any smaller containers that can be used safely? 10 gallon or so range, i'd get two food safe 5 gallon buckets but that means another powerhead and another heater etc, not to mention more clutter.

alaska clowns · 09/01/2009, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by badwrasse
really i did not know this does anyone half something to read or a link on this

A similar discussion came up a while ago and someone gave this link, which I bookmarked. Most plastic jugs, buckets, whatever have this triangle on the bottom and the number inside the triangle indicates whether or not the plastic is safe... we've changed out our 5 gallon drinking water bottles for ones that have a 1 or a 2, and I can't remember the other acceptable number. But things like 7 or higher I guess are bad, if I understand it correctly, and leak toxins into the water.
Hope that's helpful.

http://trusted.md/blog/vreni_gurd/20..._water_bottles

BackSpin · 09/01/2009, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BackSpin
You have to watch that cheep cans will not leech out toxins over time, Brute cans arent cheep but are FDA approved for food and are safe for storage, I held my breath when buying mine to since the one next to it was less then half. LOL

Let me restate this before a war breaks out you can use cheeper cans but want to make shure of what they are made of like noted Brute cans are food safe and HDPE is also a safe bet cheep cans are molded petro based plastic that will break down overtime, I think it was best put in this hobby whats another $50 bucks.. LoL I will try to find the artical on leaching for everyone..

BackSpin · 09/01/2009, 06:55 AM

"alaska clowns" link is a good one cheep plastics have been know to leach carcinogens in to water when exposed to heat or sunlight like PVA thats why the big hype about not using them to drink or for baby bottles, same line of why you want to steer clear of storeing your fish water in it, Just my thoughts Im no expert..

jason2459 · 09/01/2009, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BackSpin
Let me restate this before a war breaks out you can use cheeper cans but want to make shure of what they are made of like noted Brute cans are food safe and HDPE is also a safe bet cheep cans are molded petro based plastic that will break down overtime, I think it was best put in this hobby whats another $50 bucks.. LoL I will try to find the artical on leaching for everyone..

I figured the HDPE with the #2 recycled label 5g bucket I got would be fine as I get protein powder that are in containers that has the exact same label. Figured it must be food safe enough and should be fish safe enough.

BackSpin · 09/01/2009, 07:44 AM

Yea HDPE is one of the safe for today plastics used for food drink medicine, Ect. It is hard to find low grade in food related items, but when they make garbage cans they never think people would store any thing good in them so they take the cheep way out,

Hawkdl2 · 09/01/2009, 08:22 AM

After Eric Borneman recently reported on the effects of water from the ubiquitous Brute containers on sperm motility, I began to research what "FDA approved food safe", or similar labeling, means.

I spend a lot of time working with the FDA on biologics, so I know a lot of reviewers and have calls into some of them, though I don't know yet if they will be able to answer food container questions. In the meantime I read through a number of section of Title 21 CFR (code of federal regulations) to see what I could find on food containers.

What I have found is the FDA has a list of approved substances that may directly (additives) or indirectly (packaging) contact food. The list is fairly long but referenced in section of 21 CFR 177 - container seals.

The section references and shows a common list of "approved compounds". The list is remarkable in what "they" are allowed to feed us, but reflects the necessary allowances for trace (or not so trace) solvents, polymers, etc. that inevitably come into contact with our food during the manufacturing process.

The take home message is that the regulations, and "approved" labeling only means there are not sufficient levels of any of these numerous known toxic molecules to cause harm to humans when consumed in low to modest amounts. The regulations DO NOT mean to imply that they are not present or that nothing will leaching from a container, or that what does leach isn't toxic to sensitive organisms - sperm or corals, at the allowed levels.

Further, there is nothing in the regulations (that I have found) that specifically requires a container manufacturer to demonstrate consistency of the levels of each of the known approved contact agents if they are below acceptable levels. In other words, minor manufacturing changes could produce containers that have lot to lot variability in toxicity for these sensitive organisms and our reefs.

Lastly, I am confirming, but my research so far suggests there is no definable or demonstrable difference in "safety" between a Brute "approved" trash can and a $500 "potable water" container. Both are subject to the same regulations and both ostensibly meet the guidelines. I would speculate that a cheap "FDA approved" HDPE/LDPE container is made pretty much in the same way as an expensive HDPE/LDPE container meaning the trace contaminates and leaching may be similar.

badwrasse · 09/01/2009, 03:17 PM

just at home depot,.. all of the brute cans have a HDPE of 2,4or5 these are all ok its the HDPE #7 polycarbonate plastics that can leach BPA (water bottles) from what I have read so far.

badwrasse · 09/01/2009, 03:25 PM

hey zero i see that you are a union painter from st.louis thats kinda cool so am I

bobbyjeb · 09/01/2009, 04:02 PM

just don't get one with wheels on it. It looked like a good idea. Its not. I filled my big ol wheely with 20gals of water from walmart. I added the right amount of salt mix. put a water pump in and walked away. It tipped over into my 90gal stand. You can't get that stuff up...ever. Had to pull carpet, move tank, pull more carpet. paint, move tank, paint agian. No cash for new carpet, spent it on new can and more water!

Plan>B · 09/01/2009, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BackSpin
You have to watch that cheep cans will not leech out toxins over time, Brute cans arent cheep but are FDA approved for food and are safe for storage, I held my breath when buying mine to since the one next to it was less then half. LOL

Now is this all brute containers?

Any one know of a FDA 55 barrel that could be stackable?

08/31/2009, 07:04 PM	#1
zero26 MoneyPit Maestro Join Date: May 2009 Location: Washington MO Posts: 1,866	How many of you guys use a rubbermaid trash can for RO?DI storage? Just curious, I am running a generic 32 gal trash can. Saw the 40 sticker on the rubbermaid trash can

08/31/2009, 07:21 PM	#3
PRDubois Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Chester, VA Posts: 3,626	Lots of people use them __________________ http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2534403 Current Tank Info: 225 gal Reef, 60 gal reef & 40b frag tank

08/31/2009, 08:50 PM	#8
jason2459 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Iowa Posts: 9,671	I use the gray rubermaid for mixing salt water and a cheap generic gray bucket with the HDPE label for ATO ro/di water. __________________ rebuild and recovery log: No more red house, you'll have to click on my name and visit my homepage! You can check out my parameters at reeftronics dot net website and look for my username. Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. \| 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank

08/31/2009, 08:58 PM	#9
Flipper62 Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Naperville, Il. Business Owner, President & CEO Posts: 3,045	The Brute trash cans have been used for a long time. There has been talk ( All The Time ) that there not safe...... And you need to use a Food Safe Container. If you check out the specs on the can......or better yet, check their website. It says USDA Meat & Poultry Equipment Group Listed and assist in complying with HACCP guidelines. I do agree that if it doesn't say food safe, I wouldn't use it. Plastic containers are made from petroleum.....Not Good. However if it is formulated with other chemicals that make it FOOD SAFE.....then it should be fine __________________ If todays automobile had followed the same development as the computer, A Rolls Royce would cost $100.00. It would get a million miles per gallon, but it would explode once a year killing everyone inside." Current Tanks... 90 gal Reef... My awesome Office BioCube....( 180 was on hold ..no time ) ... The 180 gal has been sold...Yay..yay..yay. Hobby Experience: 19 years Reef...22 years FW Last edited by Flipper62; 08/31/2009 at 09:05 PM.

08/31/2009, 09:43 PM	#13
sedor Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 4,689	I use the cheaper version rubbermaid roughneck as well. I've been meaning to upgrade to a BRUTE for a long time now. __________________ Ryan

08/31/2009, 07:13 PM	#2
badwrasse Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: St. louis Posts: 1,203	generic 35gal for $12 at lowes __________________ GOT CRABS? Current Tank Info: 90gal RR,rock wall in progress, MRC sump, reef octopus XP2000I skimmer, marineland pro lighting 2-150w MH 4-54w T5's, hydor wavemaker with 2 #4 controllable pumps, and QuietOne 4000HH return pump.

08/31/2009, 07:47 PM	#4
powers2001 Moved On Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 224	40 sticker? You're not meaning $40, are you? I'll be using a trash can too. Haven't figured on how I will plumb it though.

08/31/2009, 08:36 PM	#5
BackSpin Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Springhill, FL. Posts: 106	You have to watch that cheep cans will not leech out toxins over time, Brute cans arent cheep but are FDA approved for food and are safe for storage, I held my breath when buying mine to since the one next to it was less then half. LOL

08/31/2009, 08:45 PM	#6
allactiondan Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 113	I use a rubbermade "brute" garbage can. Expensive, yes. Is my tank worth more then 50 bucks, yes. For all the money you have invested in your tank, whats an other 40 bucks...

08/31/2009, 09:21 PM	#10
zero26 MoneyPit Maestro Join Date: May 2009 Location: Washington MO Posts: 1,866	What kind of toxins could it leech?

08/31/2009, 09:33 PM	#12
bfuqua Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Houston Posts: 25	I vote Brute cans. I have had these for 3 years and they are still going strong. http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pi...&id=1377166422

09/01/2009, 12:51 AM	#15
MGDMIRAGE Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Spokane Washington Posts: 131	Are there any smaller containers that can be used safely? 10 gallon or so range, i'd get two food safe 5 gallon buckets but that means another powerhead and another heater etc, not to mention more clutter.

09/01/2009, 06:55 AM	#18
BackSpin Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Springhill, FL. Posts: 106	"alaska clowns" link is a good one cheep plastics have been know to leach carcinogens in to water when exposed to heat or sunlight like PVA thats why the big hype about not using them to drink or for baby bottles, same line of why you want to steer clear of storeing your fish water in it, Just my thoughts Im no expert..

09/01/2009, 07:44 AM	#20
BackSpin Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Springhill, FL. Posts: 106	Yea HDPE is one of the safe for today plastics used for food drink medicine, Ect. It is hard to find low grade in food related items, but when they make garbage cans they never think people would store any thing good in them so they take the cheep way out,

09/01/2009, 08:22 AM	#21
Hawkdl2 Mad Scientist Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Claremont, Ca Posts: 2,233	After Eric Borneman recently reported on the effects of water from the ubiquitous Brute containers on sperm motility, I began to research what "FDA approved food safe", or similar labeling, means. I spend a lot of time working with the FDA on biologics, so I know a lot of reviewers and have calls into some of them, though I don't know yet if they will be able to answer food container questions. In the meantime I read through a number of section of Title 21 CFR (code of federal regulations) to see what I could find on food containers. What I have found is the FDA has a list of approved substances that may directly (additives) or indirectly (packaging) contact food. The list is fairly long but referenced in section of 21 CFR 177 - container seals. The section references and shows a common list of "approved compounds". The list is remarkable in what "they" are allowed to feed us, but reflects the necessary allowances for trace (or not so trace) solvents, polymers, etc. that inevitably come into contact with our food during the manufacturing process. The take home message is that the regulations, and "approved" labeling only means there are not sufficient levels of any of these numerous known toxic molecules to cause harm to humans when consumed in low to modest amounts. The regulations DO NOT mean to imply that they are not present or that nothing will leaching from a container, or that what does leach isn't toxic to sensitive organisms - sperm or corals, at the allowed levels. Further, there is nothing in the regulations (that I have found) that specifically requires a container manufacturer to demonstrate consistency of the levels of each of the known approved contact agents if they are below acceptable levels. In other words, minor manufacturing changes could produce containers that have lot to lot variability in toxicity for these sensitive organisms and our reefs. Lastly, I am confirming, but my research so far suggests there is no definable or demonstrable difference in "safety" between a Brute "approved" trash can and a $500 "potable water" container. Both are subject to the same regulations and both ostensibly meet the guidelines. I would speculate that a cheap "FDA approved" HDPE/LDPE container is made pretty much in the same way as an expensive HDPE/LDPE container meaning the trace contaminates and leaching may be similar. __________________ Larry Current Tank Info: 120g mixed reef.

09/01/2009, 03:17 PM	#22
badwrasse Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: St. louis Posts: 1,203	just at home depot,.. all of the brute cans have a HDPE of 2,4or5 these are all ok its the HDPE #7 polycarbonate plastics that can leach BPA (water bottles) from what I have read so far. __________________ GOT CRABS? Current Tank Info: 90gal RR,rock wall in progress, MRC sump, reef octopus XP2000I skimmer, marineland pro lighting 2-150w MH 4-54w T5's, hydor wavemaker with 2 #4 controllable pumps, and QuietOne 4000HH return pump.

09/01/2009, 03:25 PM	#23
badwrasse Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: St. louis Posts: 1,203	hey zero i see that you are a union painter from st.louis thats kinda cool so am I __________________ GOT CRABS? Current Tank Info: 90gal RR,rock wall in progress, MRC sump, reef octopus XP2000I skimmer, marineland pro lighting 2-150w MH 4-54w T5's, hydor wavemaker with 2 #4 controllable pumps, and QuietOne 4000HH return pump.

09/01/2009, 04:02 PM	#24
bobbyjeb Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: athens, tn Posts: 99	just don't get one with wheels on it. It looked like a good idea. Its not. I filled my big ol wheely with 20gals of water from walmart. I added the right amount of salt mix. put a water pump in and walked away. It tipped over into my 90gal stand. You can't get that stuff up...ever. Had to pull carpet, move tank, pull more carpet. paint, move tank, paint agian. No cash for new carpet, spent it on new can and more water!