Help, please, I need some advice on buying a used tank!

alaska clowns · 10/08/2009, 11:19 PM

I have the opportunity to buy a used 55 gallon; it has been neglected for a while - the seller can't remember when he last did a water change, albeit he only has 4 small fish in the tank. He has about 30 pounds of live rock in the tank and a protein skimmer; it doesn't have any GHA and no significant cyano. He didn't know what nitrates were, so I imagine that he has never used any sort of a test kit. Can you tell me.................if the nitrates are high, do they absorb significantly into the rock to render it useless? Thank you for any advice that you can give me!

Michael · 10/08/2009, 11:27 PM

it sounds ok, if there is no algae or bacterias present and all 4 fish seem healthy then you can improve water quality quite easily, how much does he want for everything?

Reefugee · 10/08/2009, 11:28 PM

Yes - the nitrate can be absorbed into the rock and slow leach out. However, it will leach out over time. It doesn't render the live rock useless though. It's just your going to have high nitrate for a while, but over time it will be fine.

DC_40gallon · 10/08/2009, 11:32 PM

I wouldn't give more than $200 for everything. Considering your best bet will be to transfer the fish into a holding/quarantine container and I would break down the tank and scrub it and scrap it down real good (don't use any form of soap) and then fill that sucker up with fresh RO/DI water, turn on the skimmer and maybe even put on a hang on the back power filter with charcoal media just to be on the safe side and let that rock and substrate soak up some quality nutrients out of the water. Let that run for 2 weeks (keep an eye on the fish for temp, water change needs, etc) and do weekly 10% water change on the tank from day one and ALWAYS do it with or without fish.

After 2-3 weeks with 10% or 5 gallon water changes, do a test for the basics and all should be good, put those fish back in and appreciate the aquarium that needs some much needed TLC.

lordofthereef · 10/08/2009, 11:39 PM

What kind of fish are they? How long has he had them? If it has been a while and the tank doesn't look like utter crap I am willing to bet that parameters are just fine and no really all that polluted.

DC_40gallon · 10/08/2009, 11:55 PM

Never thought about that. If fish are in there now then it's not too bad parameters

some people just get lucky in the
ecosystem of their tanks

alaska clowns · 10/09/2009, 12:05 AM

Thank you so much, everyone for your help. The fish he has are a tomato clown, a damsel, and two engineer gobies.... the clown and damsel would have to go to the LFS because they wouldn't get along with what I have. He has had them in there for about 4 years, he said. He is asking $300, and the deal comes with power compact lights and a brand new HOB refugium (with light and pump and miracle mud - that he hasn't even set up yet). What I'm figuring is, that even though 300 sounds like a lot, it would cost me at least half that to buy a set of lights and have them shipped up here to Alaska. Not to mention the refugium. I would have expected cyano to be all over the place, but there wasn't - would that be a good sign? I had my husband go take pictures while I put the kids to bed, I wish I would have had him bring home a water sample too.
Thanks again!

fox2589 · 10/09/2009, 12:07 AM

i would cook half the rock at a time.. while doing the water changes and scrubs-drew

DC_40gallon · 10/09/2009, 12:07 AM

Oh hell with the lights buy that mother!

DC_40gallon · 10/09/2009, 12:09 AM

I would buy that if it was at my opportunity like it is with you and I don't need or have room for all of that stuff with a 55gal

alaska clowns · 10/09/2009, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fox2589

i would cook half the rock at a time.. while doing the water changes and scrubs-drew

How do you cook rocks? Does that mean boil them, to sterilize them?

PRDubois · 10/09/2009, 02:10 AM

If there is no GHA or bubble algae or other visual problems then I would not bother with cooking the rock. just use it. Keep it wet when moving it to prevent any die off.

DO NOT use the sand he has unless you rinse it.

COOKING ROCK = Putting the rock in a container with a lid so it is dark. Running a powerhead and heater of 4 to 6 weeks to kill off any algae and dead stuff.

Usefull if you buy rock that is:
Not Cycled
Rock that has been out of water and has Die off
Rock that has problems with Algae etc...

If his rock has no visual problems them it is Cycled LR and there is no need to Cycle it or "Cook" it.

alaska clowns · 10/09/2009, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRDubois

If there is no GHA or bubble algae or other visual problems then I would not bother with cooking the rock. just use it. Keep it wet when moving it to prevent any die off.

DO NOT use the sand he has unless you rinse it.

COOKING ROCK = Putting the rock in a container with a lid so it is dark. Running a powerhead and heater of 4 to 6 weeks to kill off any algae and dead stuff.

Usefull if you buy rock that is:
Not Cycled
Rock that has been out of water and has Die off
Rock that has problems with Algae etc...

If his rock has no visual problems them it is Cycled LR and there is no need to Cycle it or "Cook" it.

Thanks for explaining that! I didn't really see any GHA on his rock, so I think it'll be good. Can I just rinse the sand until the water runs clear? With cold or hot water, or does it matter?

PRDubois · 10/09/2009, 02:53 AM

Put the sand in 5 gal buckets.
Rinse with garden hose.
Push hose to bottom of bucket while you stur the sand with your hand.
Rinse till the water runs clear.
Drain the tap water out and use the sand.

This will get all the nasty stuff out of the sand.

PRDubois · 10/09/2009, 02:55 AM

I would also reuse 60% of the old water. this way it will be as you just did a water change.

Michael · 10/09/2009, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRDubois

If there is no GHA or bubble algae or other visual problems then I would not bother with cooking the rock.

totally agree, why cook the rock? no need at all from what ive read from the op's opening post

alaska clowns · 10/09/2009, 01:15 PM

Thank you so much, everyone for your help. If my husband gives the final OK I understand how to go about the process of taking the tank down and setting it back up. Now we better do it before it snows here so I can use the garden hose to rinse the sand

alaska clowns · 10/09/2009, 04:45 PM

What if the salinity in his tank is different than mine? I keep mine around 1.025, so I assume that his is probably a little lower than mine. Will it do any harm to his live rock to bring up his tank to the same salinity that I keep my tank at (by adding fresh salt water that has a little higher salinity), and then add my rock/sand/ water all in a short amount of time? Or would it be better to do everything slowly? Sorry, maybe I'm worrying too much. I'm trying to think of every angle, because I really like the way my existing aquarium and it's inhabitants (fish, corals, other inverts) are doing, so I want to prevent losing anything if I move to a larger tank. Thank you!

DC_40gallon · 10/09/2009, 05:26 PM

As long as you are within 1.023-1.026 the. It will just balance out to the median.

Just like if you put in rodi water as a top off or to lower a high salinity.

otrlynn · 10/09/2009, 06:19 PM

I would think that the only problem that you might have with adjusting the salinity of the new tank is if there are inverts in the tank. If there are, just bring the salinity up gradually, over a period of days. Though fish are more tolerant of this process, the engineer gobies will be less stressed if you make the change gradual. If you are transferring them to your current tank while you work on cleaning and setting up the new tank at your house, treat them as newly acquired fish and acclimate them just as you would any new fish.

droberts · 10/09/2009, 06:37 PM

after you bring it home you will clean tank,skimmer,filter,rocks,and sand. set it all up and fill with freshly maid water and allow it to cycle long before you have to worry about the fish and corals that will be going to it. just don't rush stocking it!! its gonna be tough looking at it empty as it cycles i know it was for me when i upgraded from a 55 to a 125 with a 65 sump. good luck

albano · 10/09/2009, 06:41 PM

I would suggest, rinsing sand with salt water (you could use some of the old water that was to be waste after the water change), so as NOT to kill any beneficial bacteria that is there, the point of rinsing is to remove dust/dirt that has built-up

10/08/2009, 11:19 PM	#1
alaska clowns Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Not so far north Posts: 564	Help, please, I need some advice on buying a used tank! I have the opportunity to buy a used 55 gallon; it has been neglected for a while - the seller can't remember when he last did a water change, albeit he only has 4 small fish in the tank. He has about 30 pounds of live rock in the tank and a protein skimmer; it doesn't have any GHA and no significant cyano. He didn't know what nitrates were, so I imagine that he has never used any sort of a test kit. Can you tell me.................if the nitrates are high, do they absorb significantly into the rock to render it useless? Thank you for any advice that you can give me!

10/08/2009, 11:27 PM	#2
Michael NTTH Rookie Help Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Gloucester, England,UK Posts: 7,808 Blog Entries: 6	it sounds ok, if there is no algae or bacterias present and all 4 fish seem healthy then you can improve water quality quite easily, how much does he want for everything? __________________ Don't be afraid to ask questions, we in the new to the hobby are here to help you [For My Tank Spec,Photo Album,Articles and website, click on my name] MY Very Kindest and Warmest Regards , MIKE Current Tank Info: I have a 92 gal Corner Tank, and way too many pieces of equipment to list really, (proud member of the reef central corner club)

10/08/2009, 11:39 PM	#5
lordofthereef One reef to rule them all Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Leominster, MA Posts: 5,299	What kind of fish are they? How long has he had them? If it has been a while and the tank doesn't look like utter crap I am willing to bet that parameters are just fine and no really all that polluted. __________________ "A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than you love yourself" ~ Josh Billings Visit My Home page for current build thread (click my user name and select "Visit LordoftheReef's Homepage" in the drop down menu!

10/09/2009, 02:10 AM	#12
PRDubois Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Chester, VA Posts: 3,626	If there is no GHA or bubble algae or other visual problems then I would not bother with cooking the rock. just use it. Keep it wet when moving it to prevent any die off. DO NOT use the sand he has unless you rinse it. COOKING ROCK = Putting the rock in a container with a lid so it is dark. Running a powerhead and heater of 4 to 6 weeks to kill off any algae and dead stuff. Usefull if you buy rock that is: Not Cycled Rock that has been out of water and has Die off Rock that has problems with Algae etc... If his rock has no visual problems them it is Cycled LR and there is no need to Cycle it or "Cook" it. __________________ http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2534403 Current Tank Info: 225 gal Reef, 60 gal reef & 40b frag tank

10/09/2009, 02:53 AM	#14
PRDubois Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Chester, VA Posts: 3,626	Put the sand in 5 gal buckets. Rinse with garden hose. Push hose to bottom of bucket while you stur the sand with your hand. Rinse till the water runs clear. Drain the tap water out and use the sand. This will get all the nasty stuff out of the sand. __________________ http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2534403 Current Tank Info: 225 gal Reef, 60 gal reef & 40b frag tank

10/08/2009, 11:28 PM	#3
Reefugee Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Davis, CA Posts: 6,105	Yes - the nitrate can be absorbed into the rock and slow leach out. However, it will leach out over time. It doesn't render the live rock useless though. It's just your going to have high nitrate for a while, but over time it will be fine.

10/08/2009, 11:32 PM	#4
DC_40gallon Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,474	I wouldn't give more than $200 for everything. Considering your best bet will be to transfer the fish into a holding/quarantine container and I would break down the tank and scrub it and scrap it down real good (don't use any form of soap) and then fill that sucker up with fresh RO/DI water, turn on the skimmer and maybe even put on a hang on the back power filter with charcoal media just to be on the safe side and let that rock and substrate soak up some quality nutrients out of the water. Let that run for 2 weeks (keep an eye on the fish for temp, water change needs, etc) and do weekly 10% water change on the tank from day one and ALWAYS do it with or without fish. After 2-3 weeks with 10% or 5 gallon water changes, do a test for the basics and all should be good, put those fish back in and appreciate the aquarium that needs some much needed TLC.

10/08/2009, 11:55 PM	#6
DC_40gallon Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,474	Never thought about that. If fish are in there now then it's not too bad parameters some people just get lucky in the ecosystem of their tanks

10/09/2009, 12:05 AM	#7
alaska clowns Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Not so far north Posts: 564	Thank you so much, everyone for your help. The fish he has are a tomato clown, a damsel, and two engineer gobies.... the clown and damsel would have to go to the LFS because they wouldn't get along with what I have. He has had them in there for about 4 years, he said. He is asking $300, and the deal comes with power compact lights and a brand new HOB refugium (with light and pump and miracle mud - that he hasn't even set up yet). What I'm figuring is, that even though 300 sounds like a lot, it would cost me at least half that to buy a set of lights and have them shipped up here to Alaska. Not to mention the refugium. I would have expected cyano to be all over the place, but there wasn't - would that be a good sign? I had my husband go take pictures while I put the kids to bed, I wish I would have had him bring home a water sample too. Thanks again!

10/09/2009, 12:07 AM	#8
fox2589 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Indiana Posts: 557	i would cook half the rock at a time.. while doing the water changes and scrubs-drew

10/09/2009, 12:09 AM	#10
DC_40gallon Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,474	I would buy that if it was at my opportunity like it is with you and I don't need or have room for all of that stuff with a 55gal

10/09/2009, 02:55 AM	#15
PRDubois Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Chester, VA Posts: 3,626	I would also reuse 60% of the old water. this way it will be as you just did a water change. __________________ http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2534403 Current Tank Info: 225 gal Reef, 60 gal reef & 40b frag tank

10/09/2009, 01:15 PM	#17
alaska clowns Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Not so far north Posts: 564	Thank you so much, everyone for your help. If my husband gives the final OK I understand how to go about the process of taking the tank down and setting it back up. Now we better do it before it snows here so I can use the garden hose to rinse the sand

10/09/2009, 04:45 PM	#18
alaska clowns Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Not so far north Posts: 564	Another question about buying a used tank.... What if the salinity in his tank is different than mine? I keep mine around 1.025, so I assume that his is probably a little lower than mine. Will it do any harm to his live rock to bring up his tank to the same salinity that I keep my tank at (by adding fresh salt water that has a little higher salinity), and then add my rock/sand/ water all in a short amount of time? Or would it be better to do everything slowly? Sorry, maybe I'm worrying too much. I'm trying to think of every angle, because I really like the way my existing aquarium and it's inhabitants (fish, corals, other inverts) are doing, so I want to prevent losing anything if I move to a larger tank. Thank you!

10/09/2009, 05:26 PM	#19
DC_40gallon Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,474	As long as you are within 1.023-1.026 the. It will just balance out to the median. Just like if you put in rodi water as a top off or to lower a high salinity.

10/09/2009, 06:19 PM	#20
otrlynn Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Chester County PA Posts: 1,508	I would think that the only problem that you might have with adjusting the salinity of the new tank is if there are inverts in the tank. If there are, just bring the salinity up gradually, over a period of days. Though fish are more tolerant of this process, the engineer gobies will be less stressed if you make the change gradual. If you are transferring them to your current tank while you work on cleaning and setting up the new tank at your house, treat them as newly acquired fish and acclimate them just as you would any new fish.

10/09/2009, 06:37 PM	#21
droberts Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: stow ohio Posts: 1,277	after you bring it home you will clean tank,skimmer,filter,rocks,and sand. set it all up and fill with freshly maid water and allow it to cycle long before you have to worry about the fish and corals that will be going to it. just don't rush stocking it!! its gonna be tough looking at it empty as it cycles i know it was for me when i upgraded from a 55 to a 125 with a 65 sump. good luck

10/09/2009, 06:41 PM	#22
albano SALTWATER since '73 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Katonah, NY/ San Fernando Ca./ Sea Isle City NJ Posts: 6,210	I would suggest, rinsing sand with salt water (you could use some of the old water that was to be waste after the water change), so as NOT to kill any beneficial bacteria that is there, the point of rinsing is to remove dust/dirt that has built-up