Rapid Coral Death

mattgoof · 10/20/2009, 12:01 PM

After having my 55-gallon tank for 6 months with nothing but a pair of ocellaris clowns, an emerald crab and a few hermits and snails, I decided to take the plunge into corals. I monitored all my levels 2-3 times a week and read 8.3 ph 0ppm amm, 0 nitrite and 2.5 nitrate for two weeks, then picked up a reef kit and over the next 3 weeks got a fairly consistent but slowly rising kh of 8-9, calcium around 640ppm and an initial phosphate level of 10 ppm which I drove to 0 using phosguard.

1 week ago, I bought my first coral, a 4-inch tall kenya tree coral, that I had been watching in my LFS under standard flourescents for those 3 weeks and seemed quite healthy. From my research, I knew it would be unhappy for the first few days and hoped it would rapidly become even stronger under my compact flourescents. What happened was quite the opposite. After three days, the coral was still limp and stayed retracted. The next day, I noticed it had nearly halved in length and now, only the first centimeter or so remains and is now black.

I am struggling with what happened to the poor guy. I have a few possible explanations and am wondering what you guys think is most likely.

1) The girl at the LFS briefly exposed it to air and I was unable to tell if she touched the coral itself at any point. I wore gloves when handling it myself and made sure to remove it from the bag while it was underwater and handle only the small rock it was attached to.

2) Predation by the emerald crab, although I rarely see him to begin with but he has been near the front of the tank (which is where the coral was) for the last 2 days.

3) I've heard phosguard could leech things that soft corals don't particularly like

4) Some other, unmeasurable water parameter. I do 10-gallon changes every 2-3 weeks using instant ocean, since it's all that's available here. My LFS told me that it should contain enough trace elements to support these corals, as they do not add supplements and their corals seem to be fine.

I am leaning towards improper handling, but I would like to know what you all think.

stingythingy45 · 10/20/2009, 12:17 PM

"fairly consistent but slowly rising kh of 8-9, calcium around 640ppm"

This doesn't make sense.
I would say you have water parameter issues.I also would not dose any phosguard.
I've had leathers exposed to the air for long periods of time while ffrragging them without any problems.Are you aware that leather's will molt when stressed?

Toddrtrex · 10/20/2009, 12:18 PM

Been a long time since I have had a "kenya tree coral" but, I really doubt that it being exposed to the air caused any of what you are seeing.

What lights do you have?

What is your salinity?

I suspect that your Alk really isn't at 8-9 if your calcium is at 640 -- that is very high, should be around 400-450.

How long did it take you to get the phosphates down to 0? What test kit were/are you using for that? 10 PPM would be off the charts of the ones that I have used.

stingythingy45 · 10/20/2009, 12:19 PM

A phosphate level of 10 also seems off.I think the most I've ever heard of is like over 1.5 ppm.Most tanks are around .07.
Especially if your changing that much water out.

mattgoof · 10/20/2009, 01:29 PM

Oops. I didn't have my sheet with me here in class so I'm working off memory for now, but my phosphate was 1.0, not 10 and took a week to zero. I'm using the API liquid reagent tests.

My lights are two 65W white compact florescents and 1 55W actinic. The 4th ballast in my hood blew out and I'm searching for a suitable replacement.

My salinity is at 1.025.

As far as the contrasting calcium/hardness, it could be that I'm testing incorrectly or maybe one of my reagents is bad. I've never needed less than 26 drops to achieve the color change in the calcium test, but I'll have one of my roommates do a test without my influence and see what we get.

I'll also take the phosguard out and monitor my levels more closely over the next week to see what happens.

stingythingy45 · 10/20/2009, 01:57 PM

That sounds better.
Generally when the calcium is that high the alk is much lower.And that would explain the coral dying.
I'm not even sure calcium of 640 ppm can be reached without getting a snow storm.
If I recall 20 drops is just over 400 ppm on an API.
That's one thing about this hobby,we're basically blind without good test results.

mattgoof · 10/20/2009, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stingythingy45

That sounds better.
That's one thing about this hobby,we're basically blind without good test results.

Exactly, if there's anything I learned with freshwater it's use every test available. The only problem is that there's only 1 saltwater LFS that does tests and they only do the nitrate cycle and ph. I'm going to talk to some other reefers at the university and see if they can confirm my calcium and kh tests and let you all know when I get them confirmed/contradicted.

stingythingy45 · 10/20/2009, 02:19 PM

One thing I do that helps with test results.I have two of everything.
The API isn't very expensive.So I test with Salifert and back that up with API once a week.
I mostly double check Alk first and secondly Calcium.
Just curious,what salt mix are you using?Do you have a refractor or hydrometer?

mattgoof · 10/20/2009, 02:47 PM

I'm using instant ocean salt mix, although I've been researching their reef salt. I measure it with an old homebrewing floating hydrometer.

mattgoof · 10/20/2009, 08:27 PM

So, I used a friend's test kit earlier and got more or less the same thing. I got a kh of 10 on my stuff and 9.5 on his. My calcium read about 580ppm today while his gave me 540. I would consider those to be well enough within statistical error.

The real surprise was when he got out his refractometer. My bobbing hydrometer had been reading a sg of 1.025, but the refractometer gave 1.030. I think I have found my problem.

Also, we measured my magnesium since he had the kit and it's at 1440ppm.

10/20/2009, 12:01 PM	#1
mattgoof Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 36	Rapid Coral Death After having my 55-gallon tank for 6 months with nothing but a pair of ocellaris clowns, an emerald crab and a few hermits and snails, I decided to take the plunge into corals. I monitored all my levels 2-3 times a week and read 8.3 ph 0ppm amm, 0 nitrite and 2.5 nitrate for two weeks, then picked up a reef kit and over the next 3 weeks got a fairly consistent but slowly rising kh of 8-9, calcium around 640ppm and an initial phosphate level of 10 ppm which I drove to 0 using phosguard. 1 week ago, I bought my first coral, a 4-inch tall kenya tree coral, that I had been watching in my LFS under standard flourescents for those 3 weeks and seemed quite healthy. From my research, I knew it would be unhappy for the first few days and hoped it would rapidly become even stronger under my compact flourescents. What happened was quite the opposite. After three days, the coral was still limp and stayed retracted. The next day, I noticed it had nearly halved in length and now, only the first centimeter or so remains and is now black. I am struggling with what happened to the poor guy. I have a few possible explanations and am wondering what you guys think is most likely. 1) The girl at the LFS briefly exposed it to air and I was unable to tell if she touched the coral itself at any point. I wore gloves when handling it myself and made sure to remove it from the bag while it was underwater and handle only the small rock it was attached to. 2) Predation by the emerald crab, although I rarely see him to begin with but he has been near the front of the tank (which is where the coral was) for the last 2 days. 3) I've heard phosguard could leech things that soft corals don't particularly like 4) Some other, unmeasurable water parameter. I do 10-gallon changes every 2-3 weeks using instant ocean, since it's all that's available here. My LFS told me that it should contain enough trace elements to support these corals, as they do not add supplements and their corals seem to be fine. I am leaning towards improper handling, but I would like to know what you all think.

10/20/2009, 12:17 PM	#2
stingythingy45 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: MA Posts: 3,296	"fairly consistent but slowly rising kh of 8-9, calcium around 640ppm" This doesn't make sense. I would say you have water parameter issues.I also would not dose any phosguard. I've had leathers exposed to the air for long periods of time while ffrragging them without any problems.Are you aware that leather's will molt when stressed? __________________ Bob Current Tank Info: 90 gallon,mixed Reef,2-250 watt Optix 3 pendants(Phoenix 14K)2-54 watt T5 Super actnics ,ASM G-2 Gate/recirc mods,70 gal. basement sump,20L ref

10/20/2009, 12:18 PM	#3
Toddrtrex Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Carol Stream, IL Posts: 23,162	Been a long time since I have had a "kenya tree coral" but, I really doubt that it being exposed to the air caused any of what you are seeing. What lights do you have? What is your salinity? I suspect that your Alk really isn't at 8-9 if your calcium is at 640 -- that is very high, should be around 400-450. How long did it take you to get the phosphates down to 0? What test kit were/are you using for that? 10 PPM would be off the charts of the ones that I have used. __________________ Click my name and then "visit toddrtrex's homepage" for tank pictures Current Tank Info: 210g reef and 65g reef

10/20/2009, 12:19 PM	#4
stingythingy45 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: MA Posts: 3,296	A phosphate level of 10 also seems off.I think the most I've ever heard of is like over 1.5 ppm.Most tanks are around .07. Especially if your changing that much water out. __________________ Bob Current Tank Info: 90 gallon,mixed Reef,2-250 watt Optix 3 pendants(Phoenix 14K)2-54 watt T5 Super actnics ,ASM G-2 Gate/recirc mods,70 gal. basement sump,20L ref

10/20/2009, 01:57 PM	#6
stingythingy45 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: MA Posts: 3,296	That sounds better. Generally when the calcium is that high the alk is much lower.And that would explain the coral dying. I'm not even sure calcium of 640 ppm can be reached without getting a snow storm. If I recall 20 drops is just over 400 ppm on an API. That's one thing about this hobby,we're basically blind without good test results. __________________ Bob Current Tank Info: 90 gallon,mixed Reef,2-250 watt Optix 3 pendants(Phoenix 14K)2-54 watt T5 Super actnics ,ASM G-2 Gate/recirc mods,70 gal. basement sump,20L ref

10/20/2009, 01:29 PM	#5
mattgoof Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 36	Oops. I didn't have my sheet with me here in class so I'm working off memory for now, but my phosphate was 1.0, not 10 and took a week to zero. I'm using the API liquid reagent tests. My lights are two 65W white compact florescents and 1 55W actinic. The 4th ballast in my hood blew out and I'm searching for a suitable replacement. My salinity is at 1.025. As far as the contrasting calcium/hardness, it could be that I'm testing incorrectly or maybe one of my reagents is bad. I've never needed less than 26 drops to achieve the color change in the calcium test, but I'll have one of my roommates do a test without my influence and see what we get. I'll also take the phosguard out and monitor my levels more closely over the next week to see what happens.

10/20/2009, 02:19 PM	#8
stingythingy45 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: MA Posts: 3,296	One thing I do that helps with test results.I have two of everything. The API isn't very expensive.So I test with Salifert and back that up with API once a week. I mostly double check Alk first and secondly Calcium. Just curious,what salt mix are you using?Do you have a refractor or hydrometer? __________________ Bob Current Tank Info: 90 gallon,mixed Reef,2-250 watt Optix 3 pendants(Phoenix 14K)2-54 watt T5 Super actnics ,ASM G-2 Gate/recirc mods,70 gal. basement sump,20L ref

10/20/2009, 02:47 PM	#9
mattgoof Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 36	I'm using instant ocean salt mix, although I've been researching their reef salt. I measure it with an old homebrewing floating hydrometer.

10/20/2009, 08:27 PM	#10
mattgoof Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 36	So, I used a friend's test kit earlier and got more or less the same thing. I got a kh of 10 on my stuff and 9.5 on his. My calcium read about 580ppm today while his gave me 540. I would consider those to be well enough within statistical error. The real surprise was when he got out his refractometer. My bobbing hydrometer had been reading a sg of 1.025, but the refractometer gave 1.030. I think I have found my problem. Also, we measured my magnesium since he had the kit and it's at 1440ppm.