Having a fishroom 25 feet away

[quader94]

I can't stand having no room under my tank. I have a 75 gallon tank with a 30 gallon sump with a 10 gallon top off tank. My stand is stuffed. After cracking a baffle trying to get my skimmer out I decided I need more space. I'm only 17 and my parents wont let me have things on the sides of the tank so they let me use a spot.........25 ft away and in my basement

So I've saved up a decent amount of money and have this idea proposed
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the idea is:
Have two Brute trashcans ( already have one), one for holding RO and one for salt
40 Gallon breeder sump. I cant use my existing sump because I cant get it out without sliding the tank foward since the only way to remove the sump is through the back. Works out though because now I'll be able to get a bigger sump.

I'll keep my Octo Extreme 200 Skimmer, eventually I'll upgrade it to a Bubbleblaster pump since the sicce doesnt restart all the time

A much stronger pump, I've been looking around for a used pump on the forum that can handle lots of head pressure. I'm going 25-30ft horizontal and 10ft vertical.


I already bought a Dosing setup, but since I have no room under my tank and they don't want to have anything on the side of the tank.....its sitting in a box unused


I'm basically trying to get the tank as automated as possible because when I go away to college I want my dad to maintain the tank without having too much trouble


Whats everyones thoughts on this? How would you guys do it? thanks!

[fppf]

I have basically the same setup for a fish loaded 125. But, ah, I own the house so I can do whatever I want.

The long runs are a little bit of an issue that needs to be handled. I have a 30 plus foot run from my tank in the front of the house to the filters in the back corner. I did this to locate them in the mechanical area of my house. Also it is the lowest point of the basement so I don't care about water getting on the floor for cleaning or if something leaks, just goes in the sump pump. Also as an added bounus the wash sink is right there. So I added some valves to route the return into the wash sink. I then added a setup at the DT so I can just pull out a hose, flip some valves and clean the tank. Then I just add new water to the sump in the basement. No slopping buckets, hoses, and everything else through the house anymore.

I ran 2" PVC for both supply and return lines. On the return line you must provide a vent for it. Just like regular plumbing. If you don't have a vent it will back up then siphon then back up....

For a pump I'm using a little giant 4-MDQ-SC it has been running for 3 years 24/7 with no issues so far. It uses the least amount of power for the amount of head I'm pushing. I have about 14 feet of head. I'm going to buy and plumb in a backup just in case. I heat the tank in the basement, no circulator pump, no heat, dead fish.

The other thing you need to calculate out is the amount of water that is going to drain back when the pumps are off. The pipes hold a LOT of water. I have about 25-30 gallons of run back when my pump is off. I used a 35 gallon rubbermaid garbage can just to handle the run off. I don't like check valves, they seal at first, but then 3 years later when the power fails there is some junk in there and they don't seal.

Lastly, there is a heat loss issue as well. Don't about your basement but mine is cold all year. Add over 60 feet of pipe and all the fiter equipment your going to loose a lot of heat.

Here is a clip of my filter system and the new heater I made. Good luck with your project. And make sure your parents know you plan on drilling two 2 1/2" holes in the walls and floor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evzQmoWDfJw

[quader94]

Originally Posted by fppf

I have basically the same setup for a fish loaded 125. But, ah, I own the house so I can do whatever I want.

The long runs are a little bit of an issue that needs to be handled. I have a 30 plus foot run from my tank in the front of the house to the filters in the back corner. I did this to locate them in the mechanical area of my house. Also it is the lowest point of the basement so I don't care about water getting on the floor for cleaning or if something leaks, just goes in the sump pump. Also as an added bounus the wash sink is right there. So I added some valves to route the return into the wash sink. I then added a setup at the DT so I can just pull out a hose, flip some valves and clean the tank. Then I just add new water to the sump in the basement. No slopping buckets, hoses, and everything else through the house anymore.

I ran 2" PVC for both supply and return lines. On the return line you must provide a vent for it. Just like regular plumbing. If you don't have a vent it will back up then siphon then back up....

For a pump I'm using a little giant 4-MDQ-SC it has been running for 3 years 24/7 with no issues so far. It uses the least amount of power for the amount of head I'm pushing. I have about 14 feet of head. I'm going to buy and plumb in a backup just in case. I heat the tank in the basement, no circulator pump, no heat, dead fish.

The other thing you need to calculate out is the amount of water that is going to drain back when the pumps are off. The pipes hold a LOT of water. I have about 25-30 gallons of run back when my pump is off. I used a 35 gallon rubbermaid garbage can just to handle the run off. I don't like check valves, they seal at first, but then 3 years later when the power fails there is some junk in there and they don't seal.

Lastly, there is a heat loss issue as well. Don't about your basement but mine is cold all year. Add over 60 feet of pipe and all the fiter equipment your going to loose a lot of heat.

Here is a clip of my filter system and the new heater I made. Good luck with your project. And make sure your parents know you plan on drilling two 2 1/2" holes in the walls and floor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evzQmoWDfJw

thanks for the info

You made a good point about needing extra heat, looks like another heater is on the list

I did the calculation of the amount of water in the pipes
I found out the calculation of the amount of water

radius x radius x pi = area of pipe

area x length= cubic inches

231 cubic inches = one gallon

so both my drain and return are 1"

so .5 x .5 x 3.14 = .785

1 foot = 12 inches, I got approx 60 feet of pipe so 60 x 12 = 720

.785 x 720 = 565.2

565.2 / 231 = 2.45 gallons

not bad at all, a 40 breeder could hold that but I do kind of want a bigger sump

[fppf]

I would highly recommend doing calculations for your flow and velocities. 1" pipe over a long run may generate a lot of head pressure depending on how much you want to flow.

[slief]

It's a great idea! While I had plenty of room under my tank and beside it in a closet for my sumps, skimmer and other lifesupport, the chiller was another story. When I purchased my house in 97. It was new and had a dirt backyard. The day after closing escrow, the landscapers were here digging an 18" deep trench around the perimeter of the house from the backyard then along the side of the house to the garage where I wanted my chiller. Its a 50' distance. We burried 4 runs of 1" flex PVC. Two for the chiller (1 in and 1 out) and 2 spare lines just in case I needed them down the line. Its been running that way since along with my original chiller. All it takes is the right pump and ample space.

Very nice tank room and design! I cant wait to see it finished!

[quader94]

Originally Posted by fppf

I would highly recommend doing calculations for your flow and velocities. 1" pipe over a long run may generate a lot of head pressure depending on how much you want to flow.

Ive done a few of them, I dont need a pump to pump that much water to the display. I only have 1 1" hole to work with

[quader94]

Originally Posted by slief

It's a great idea! While I had plenty of room under my tank and beside it in a closet for my sumps, skimmer and other lifesupport, the chiller was another story. When I purchased my house in 97. It was new and had a dirt backyard. The day after closing escrow, the landscapers were here digging an 18" deep trench around the perimeter of the house from the backyard then along the side of the house to the garage where I wanted my chiller. Its a 50' distance. We burried 4 runs of 1" flex PVC. Two for the chiller (1 in and 1 out) and 2 spare lines just in case I needed them down the line. Its been running that way since along with my original chiller. All it takes is the right pump and ample space.

Very nice tank room and design! I cant wait to see it finished!

man I cant imagine having something 50ft away, the pump must be huge!

I have been considering running double lines but I have a drop ceiling in my basement. If I run into an issue, I take a tile out and problem solved lol


thanks, same here. Finding a pump has been an issue, everytime I PM someone with wanting extra info on the pump, the pumps sold

[slief]

Originally Posted by quader94

man I cant imagine having something 50ft away, the pump must be huge!

I have been considering running double lines but I have a drop ceiling in my basement. If I run into an issue, I take a tile out and problem solved lol


thanks, same here. Finding a pump has been an issue, everytime I PM someone with wanting extra info on the pump, the pumps sold

For years I used a dedicated Iwaki 100RLT which was a complete waste. It pulled from the sump went to the chiller and returned to the sump. Now its T'd off my return pump via a gate valve. The chiller needs 500-600GPH and is at the same level as the sump it draws from. My return pump (Reeflo Hammerhead) at my 6' head has more than enough for that and the 90% left over at the head.

As for your pump. Don't cut corners. A Reeflo pressure pump or mid sized Iwaki may just be your best bet. The Iwakis tend to heat the water more and are a bit noisier but are work horses and will last forever. The Reeflo pumps are quieter and more efficient but may need an occasional seal. You pay for piece of mind.

[fppf]

Originally Posted by quader94

Ive done a few of them, I dont need a pump to pump that much water to the display. I only have 1 1" hole to work with

The size of the hole in the tank has nothing to do with what size pipe you should use. The size of pipe depends on how much flow you need, how long the pipe is, and how much pressure loss you can tolerate. The larger the pressure loss in the pipe the more your pump will need to work, and the more energy it will use.

As a the pipe gets longer and longer it will generate more and more pressure drop. If your trying to get anymore then 500 GPH 1" most likely will yield bad results. Also, as a rule of thumb, every 90 adds a foot of head.

[Harry_Y]

I have to agree with fppf on this

smaller lines will induce friction and increase you head pressure

I run basement sump and it is probably going through 20+ feet of
flex pipe, hard elbows etc also increase your required head pressure

When selecting a pump you will want a Pressure pump
something like the Panworld 150 PS as an example.

Personally if it was me I would save my money
and wait until you had a place of your own.

Seems like a lot of money and effort to go through to just tear it down
in a couple of years (unless you are planning on leaving it behind.