Canister with overflow and sump

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:14 PM

Hello,
I tried searching this but I did not find any body with my unique situation. so here is the question :
I have a 55g bow front with a 10g sump and a overflow box.
on the tank I have a tetra whisper 30-60 and in the sump I have bio balls and phosphate sponge and a protein skimmer and a heater.

I want to get a canister perferebly this one :http://www.amazon.com/Cascade%C2%AE-...=1VZA4JT86BLCA

and get rid of the whisper (it recently killed my only fish; got stock in the tube)

I want to use the sump with the canister meaning I want to use the same over flow box to bring the water down go through the sump filtration and use the return pump from the sump to the canister and from the canister go back to the tank.

I wanna know if this is a good idea at all and what are the pros and cons of it.

here are other information regarding my tank :

55 gallon bow front
around 50 lb live rock
around 20 lb live sand

sump is hand made from california fairly small
there is a protein skimmer seaclone 100 in it
there is barely any room for any thing else.

I have notice that even though some say it might not be needed that the whisper does make a difference in my water clarity.

I am new to the hobby and website but have been doing a lot of research so please feel free to advise

there is nothing else in my thank (fish, coral) after the clown fish that a friend gave to my got stock in the filter and died

thank you for the help.

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 10:19 PM

what you going to use the canister for? Secondly, the canister will become pressurized and by prone to leak from its seams.....IMO...not a good idea

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:21 PM

just as a form of filtration. what do you recommend to use for filteration beside the sump and the skimmer that I have?
similar to the whisper but in a in-sump format?

Lazcar45 · 05/05/2011, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurntOutReefer

what you going to use the canister for? Secondly, the canister will become pressurized and by prone to leak from its seams.....IMO...not a good idea

^^+1 Spend your money elsewhere, Canisers end up being more problems than what their worth, Plus they can be a PITA to clean,

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:26 PM

well what do you guys recommend in combination with my sump. bc I do not think that my sump is strong enough to handle my tank. do you guys recommend any HOB over anything else?
what do you guys think of the marineland biowheel?
or any other quite ones?

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 10:27 PM

Then run the sump and canister as seperate systems. Put GFO and Phosban/Chemipure etc in canister........BTW...I'm a big fan of running LR Rubble in canisters...thats what I have run for over 10 years....NO issue's..........

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:28 PM

how would that work?
like have two inputs and outputs to my tank?

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 10:30 PM

overflow box for the sump with the return to tank. The canister runs its own lines....

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:39 PM

so it would be total of four pipes on top of the tank?
1 overflow 1 sump return 2 canister?

and also what did you think of this canister? its got a lot of good reviews for really good price!

http://www.amazon.com/Cascade%C2%AE-...=1VZA4JT86BLCA

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 10:44 PM

correct on "pipes".
I'm a Fluval or in a pinch Rena XP fan......so I cant recommend anything else.

zirabius · 05/05/2011, 10:54 PM

thanks a lot for your help and fast responses!

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 10:57 PM

have fun...and take it slow....

JukeFish · 05/05/2011, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurntOutReefer

overflow box for the sump with the return to tank. The canister runs its own lines....

Or just run the canister on the sump, e.g. canister taking water from, and returning water to the sump.

BurntOutReefer · 05/05/2011, 11:43 PM

wont work in sump as canister's require gravity for intake, as the (impeller) is a "push" and not a "pull".....unless the sump is at least 24" higher then the canister

bigmikey · 05/06/2011, 12:17 AM

Imo you should just use the money for the canister filter and buy a bigger sown. Wait for petco to have the dollar a gallon sale and make your own. You could run your chemi pure carbon or whatever into the filter sock too.

plaidnstripes · 05/06/2011, 04:54 AM

Sown?

potterjon · 05/06/2011, 07:36 AM

Look into a reactor from bulk reef supply for that sump. Mount it under the stand an run gfo and carbon in it. Forget the canister filter, they will leak eventually.

zirabius · 05/06/2011, 09:04 AM

I have no idea what a reactor is? what are its benefits?
and would that replace the HOB filter?

and I also have never heard of sown?

-sorry newb
- and I was originally thinking about "in and out" from the sump but the BurntOutReefer brings a good point as it may not work bc of the gravity...

do I need another filter beside my sump? I think read it some where that It might not be even necessary to have a HOB filter if there is a sump and plenty of live rock and live sand and HOB's are mainly for freshwater

ryeguyy84 · 05/06/2011, 01:15 PM

a reactor is a fluidized media holder. all you would need is a small power head (I use a maxijet 400) and a reactor. the 2littlefishes reactor is great, that's what I use.

I'm new to the reactor scene but I think it's more efficient than a canister filter because the water is forced through the media. I've seen some people daisy chain 2 or more of them. one for phosban, another for carbon, etc etc.

ryeguyy84 · 05/06/2011, 01:16 PM

also I keep mine in the sump, so there's no extra hoses in the DT

bigmikey · 05/06/2011, 05:02 PM

Sown? Hahaha ooops I meant get a bigger ONE

IridescentLily · 05/06/2011, 07:01 PM

What do you have for flow? Do you have a powerhead?
Also, do you have fish or corals in your tank?

After talking to some experienced reefers, the consensus is to take the money you were going to spend on the canister, and spend it on a more efficient skimmer.
Believe me, you'll get more benefit.
Here's a link to a really good one for your size tank.
http://www.marinedepot.com/Reef_Octo...1-FIPS-vi.html

I had a canister in addition to a good skimmer when i had my 55g fish-only tank and it worked really well.
That said, if it were me I'd spend it on a skimmer.

briankmarsh1980 · 05/06/2011, 07:12 PM

You don't need a canister or any kind of HOB filter at all!!!!!

And if you don't change the pads every couple days you are going to have major problems

They serve no purpose in a reef tank

zirabius · 05/11/2011, 09:17 PM

thanks for the advise yall! I appreciate it!

pmrossetti · 05/11/2011, 10:23 PM

rock/sand in your tank is your filter, no canister or hob needed.

05/05/2011, 10:14 PM	#1
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	Canister with overflow and sump Hello, I tried searching this but I did not find any body with my unique situation. so here is the question : I have a 55g bow front with a 10g sump and a overflow box. on the tank I have a tetra whisper 30-60 and in the sump I have bio balls and phosphate sponge and a protein skimmer and a heater. I want to get a canister perferebly this one :http://www.amazon.com/Cascade%C2%AE-...=1VZA4JT86BLCA and get rid of the whisper (it recently killed my only fish; got stock in the tube) I want to use the sump with the canister meaning I want to use the same over flow box to bring the water down go through the sump filtration and use the return pump from the sump to the canister and from the canister go back to the tank. I wanna know if this is a good idea at all and what are the pros and cons of it. here are other information regarding my tank : 55 gallon bow front around 50 lb live rock around 20 lb live sand sump is hand made from california fairly small there is a protein skimmer seaclone 100 in it there is barely any room for any thing else. I have notice that even though some say it might not be needed that the whisper does make a difference in my water clarity. I am new to the hobby and website but have been doing a lot of research so please feel free to advise there is nothing else in my thank (fish, coral) after the clown fish that a friend gave to my got stock in the filter and died thank you for the help.

05/06/2011, 07:01 PM	#22
IridescentLily Editor-Reefkeeping mag Join Date: May 2008 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Posts: 3,858 Blog Entries: 5	What do you have for flow? Do you have a powerhead? Also, do you have fish or corals in your tank? After talking to some experienced reefers, the consensus is to take the money you were going to spend on the canister, and spend it on a more efficient skimmer. Believe me, you'll get more benefit. Here's a link to a really good one for your size tank. http://www.marinedepot.com/Reef_Octo...1-FIPS-vi.html I had a canister in addition to a good skimmer when i had my 55g fish-only tank and it worked really well. That said, if it were me I'd spend it on a skimmer. __________________ ~April Editor-Reefkeeping Magazine

05/06/2011, 07:12 PM	#23
briankmarsh1980 I'm a member of **!!!!!! Join Date: May 2010 Location: Maricopa, Arizona Posts: 2,127	You don't need a canister or any kind of HOB filter at all!!!!! And if you don't change the pads every couple days you are going to have major problems They serve no purpose in a reef tank __________________ My skim don't stink _______________________________________________________________ 210 gallons with stuff!!!!!!!

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05/05/2011, 10:19 PM	#2
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	what you going to use the canister for? Secondly, the canister will become pressurized and by prone to leak from its seams.....IMO...not a good idea

05/05/2011, 10:21 PM	#3
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	just as a form of filtration. what do you recommend to use for filteration beside the sump and the skimmer that I have? similar to the whisper but in a in-sump format?

05/05/2011, 10:26 PM	#5
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	well what do you guys recommend in combination with my sump. bc I do not think that my sump is strong enough to handle my tank. do you guys recommend any HOB over anything else? what do you guys think of the marineland biowheel? or any other quite ones?

05/05/2011, 10:27 PM	#6
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	Then run the sump and canister as seperate systems. Put GFO and Phosban/Chemipure etc in canister........BTW...I'm a big fan of running LR Rubble in canisters...thats what I have run for over 10 years....NO issue's..........

05/05/2011, 10:28 PM	#7
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	how would that work? like have two inputs and outputs to my tank?

05/05/2011, 10:30 PM	#8
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	overflow box for the sump with the return to tank. The canister runs its own lines....

05/05/2011, 10:39 PM	#9
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	so it would be total of four pipes on top of the tank? 1 overflow 1 sump return 2 canister? and also what did you think of this canister? its got a lot of good reviews for really good price! http://www.amazon.com/Cascade%C2%AE-...=1VZA4JT86BLCA

05/05/2011, 10:44 PM	#10
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	correct on "pipes". I'm a Fluval or in a pinch Rena XP fan......so I cant recommend anything else.

05/05/2011, 10:54 PM	#11
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	thanks a lot for your help and fast responses!

05/05/2011, 10:57 PM	#12
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	have fun...and take it slow....

05/05/2011, 11:43 PM	#14
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	wont work in sump as canister's require gravity for intake, as the (impeller) is a "push" and not a "pull".....unless the sump is at least 24" higher then the canister

05/06/2011, 12:17 AM	#15
bigmikey Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Daly City Posts: 63	Imo you should just use the money for the canister filter and buy a bigger sown. Wait for petco to have the dollar a gallon sale and make your own. You could run your chemi pure carbon or whatever into the filter sock too.

05/06/2011, 04:54 AM	#16
plaidnstripes Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Blacksburg Posts: 53	Sown?

05/06/2011, 07:36 AM	#17
potterjon Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Asheville,NC Posts: 933	Look into a reactor from bulk reef supply for that sump. Mount it under the stand an run gfo and carbon in it. Forget the canister filter, they will leak eventually.

05/06/2011, 09:04 AM	#18
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	I have no idea what a reactor is? what are its benefits? and would that replace the HOB filter? and I also have never heard of sown? -sorry newb - and I was originally thinking about "in and out" from the sump but the BurntOutReefer brings a good point as it may not work bc of the gravity... do I need another filter beside my sump? I think read it some where that It might not be even necessary to have a HOB filter if there is a sump and plenty of live rock and live sand and HOB's are mainly for freshwater

05/06/2011, 01:15 PM	#19
ryeguyy84 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: New Jersey Posts: 2,753	a reactor is a fluidized media holder. all you would need is a small power head (I use a maxijet 400) and a reactor. the 2littlefishes reactor is great, that's what I use. I'm new to the reactor scene but I think it's more efficient than a canister filter because the water is forced through the media. I've seen some people daisy chain 2 or more of them. one for phosban, another for carbon, etc etc.

05/06/2011, 01:16 PM	#20
ryeguyy84 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: New Jersey Posts: 2,753	also I keep mine in the sump, so there's no extra hoses in the DT

05/06/2011, 05:02 PM	#21
bigmikey Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Daly City Posts: 63	Sown? Hahaha ooops I meant get a bigger ONE

05/11/2011, 09:17 PM	#24
zirabius Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: TX Posts: 17	thanks for the advise yall! I appreciate it!

05/11/2011, 10:23 PM	#25
pmrossetti Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Cali. Posts: 3,199	rock/sand in your tank is your filter, no canister or hob needed.