Plumbing: PVC vs Hose

clugo · 06/20/2011, 11:04 AM

Hello.

Just wondering your preference, success/failed stories when doing your plumbing. Do you prefer total or mostly PVS plumbing with elbows, etc or, do you prefer using as much hosing as possible?

Let me know your thoughts? And, why you prefer one over the other.

Thanks alot.

Reefahholic · 06/20/2011, 11:11 AM

i like hard plumbing because i plan on running my tank long term and PVC is better for long term in my opinion.

it sucks to cut and glue, but once you have it completed, it's gonna be years before you'll ever need to do it again.

good luck my friend...

clugo · 06/20/2011, 11:16 AM

thanks alot.

Did you paste or glue?

Reefahholic · 06/20/2011, 11:19 AM

everybody gets their cement from lowes mostly.

if you want a really good brand, weld on is good. about anything works well. just remember that you have about 5 seconds before you can't move it! lol it drys quick..

aleonn · 06/20/2011, 12:11 PM

I also prefer hard plumbing with PVC, as it's easy and more leak-proof IMO. Use a lot of unions so that you have flexibility to clean the pipes or change their design.

Reefahholic · 06/20/2011, 12:19 PM

Yes yes, unions are great. Look at my recent post about plumbing, you'll see unions everywhere. This allows u to take apart ur pipe and clean it. Also, make sure u put a union just above ur return pump so you can clean or replace that pump.

clugo · 06/20/2011, 12:52 PM

Thanks for the all the great info. I'm going PVC.

vorm · 06/20/2011, 12:55 PM

It should be noted that you get better flow through the plumbing using hose, as elbows, unions and other fitting restrict flow a lot more.

jeff@zina.com · 06/20/2011, 01:31 PM

I do both, depending on what's appropriate. I almost always use hose for at least short sections, even if just for noise isolation. Plus I have a habit of moving stuff and it's easier to snip a hose than saw out the framework to move PVC. And I don't get my PVC cement at Lowes. Home Depot is closer.

Jeff

Dr Colliebreath · 06/20/2011, 03:14 PM

I have done it both ways and prefer flexible tubing /hose. Easier to do, no reason for any leaks, and I never wanted to take my tubing out. I will cut and replace the tubing if necessary.

SkullV · 06/20/2011, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aleonn

I also prefer hard plumbing with PVC, as it's easy and more leak-proof IMO. Use a lot of unions so that you have flexibility to clean the pipes or change their design.

Using "a lot" of unions will seriously reduce flow. Have you ever looked inside a union vs. a standard section of straight PVC? It is much smaller in diameter.

lordofthereef · 06/20/2011, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reefahholic

PVC is better for long term in my opinion.

Just curious what you are basing this on? I am not sure there is a right or wrong answer, but what makes a flexible hose less appropriate long term?

carlos413 · 06/20/2011, 06:10 PM

tagging along this is good stuff.

0 tds · 06/20/2011, 06:22 PM

Just mesured a 1.5" pipe and union. The pipe was 1.59 and the union was 1.49(inside). Thats 0.1" smaller on the union.

0 tds · 06/20/2011, 06:30 PM

I just ran a head loss test from the Head Loss calculator.

Vertical length in feet = 5
Horizontal length in feet = 3
Pipe diameter in inches = .75
pump = Eheim1250
Number of 90 degree elbows = 2
Number of ball valves = 1
Number of pipe exits = 1
Number of pipe entrances = 1

Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then added 1 union

Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then calculated with 10 unions

Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then calculated with 15 unions

New result = 2.25 PSI / 135 GPH.

I would say add all the unions you want!!!!!

mightymizz · 06/20/2011, 06:55 PM

Unions traditionally have a smaller diameter in their middle section than where the water flows in and out of the union.

Most people actually get a union one size larger than what their running and the use reducers down to the preferred diameter so that no restrictions are in the line.

I run 1" pipe, so I buy a 1 1/4" or whatever it is and use a reducer down to 1".

Reefahholic · 06/20/2011, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordofthereef

Just curious what you are basing this on? I am not sure there is a right or wrong answer, but what makes a flexible hose less appropriate long term?

PVC is more durable than flex hose in my opinion.

Flex hose can get cut, torn, chewed by my dog, etc.

I personally like PVC because of the uniform look and strength. It can't get kinked or loose it's shape. I like things that are stout and hold up for years.

crvz · 06/21/2011, 08:10 AM

I'll use oversized PVC on my drains (increased it at the point of the bulkhead), but for my returns I generally run hoses to eliminate head loss.

SkullV · 06/21/2011, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0 tds

I just ran a head loss test from the Head Loss calculator.

Vertical length in feet = 5
Horizontal length in feet = 3
Pipe diameter in inches = .75
pump = Eheim1250
Number of 90 degree elbows = 2
Number of ball valves = 1
Number of pipe exits = 1
Number of pipe entrances = 1

Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then added 1 union

Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then calculated with 10 unions

Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH.

I then calculated with 15 unions

New result = 2.25 PSI / 135 GPH.

I would say add all the unions you want!!!!!

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showpo...14&postcount=8

clugo · 06/21/2011, 08:19 AM

I agree. Using hose for the return is preferable.

SkullV · 06/21/2011, 08:49 AM

I Prefer to use PVC for everything. I have an oversized pump so a little head loss from 2 90* fittings is not an issue.

I always incorporate a section of SpaFlex into the return portion of the PVC to soak up vibration and allow for a little play when I am removing the pump via the ONE true union incorporated into the pipe.

noahm · 06/21/2011, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reefahholic

PVC is more durable than flex hose in my opinion.

Flex hose can get cut, torn, chewed by my dog, etc.

I personally like PVC because of the uniform look and strength. It can't get kinked or loose it's shape. I like things that are stout and hold up for years.

Are you referring to vinyl hose, or flex PVC?, because if you put enough force to kink, tear flex PVC, or chew through it on your rigid plumbing, the rigid would be totally in shambles. I guarantee your dog chewing/pulling on rigid PVC will cause way more damage than flex PVC. Vinyl hose does have drawbacks due to the hose clamps and kinkability, cutablility but flex PVC has none of those issues and is just as durable.

I personally will only use rigid PVC where some rigidity is required like standpipes. Flex PVC reduces vibrations, and allows for some play in removing return pumps etc, but there is nothing wrong with rigid either.

mcrist · 06/21/2011, 11:57 AM

I consider PVC and flexible PVC as one in the same and all other types of hoses as other option. I only use PVC for all my plumbing unless it for testing/short term use.

Neroon · 06/21/2011, 08:37 PM

I recently plumbed a 180. Initially I used all rigid PVC, but it was loud. I was really surprised by how much the water flow echoed, especially for the drain. I ended up using flex PVC (aka SpaFlex at Home Depot) for the drain and the part of the plumbing that connects the to the return pump. The rest of the return plumbing includes some valves for reactors and a tee to the refugium. That part is rigid. This setup is MUCH quieter for me. My experience...

06/20/2011, 11:04 AM	#1
clugo Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 537	Plumbing: PVC vs Hose Hello. Just wondering your preference, success/failed stories when doing your plumbing. Do you prefer total or mostly PVS plumbing with elbows, etc or, do you prefer using as much hosing as possible? Let me know your thoughts? And, why you prefer one over the other. Thanks alot.

06/21/2011, 08:10 AM	#18
crvz Team RC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: houstonia Posts: 7,989	I'll use oversized PVC on my drains (increased it at the point of the bulkhead), but for my returns I generally run hoses to eliminate head loss. __________________ -Chris- You don't win friends with salad. "Look! They're trying to learn for free!" ... "Use your phony guns as clubs!" Current Tank Info: rectangluar? wet?

06/21/2011, 11:57 AM	#23
mcrist Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania Posts: 1,598	I consider PVC and flexible PVC as one in the same and all other types of hoses as other option. I only use PVC for all my plumbing unless it for testing/short term use. __________________ Mark Current Tank Info: 450 Gallon Peninsula

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06/20/2011, 11:11 AM	#2
Reefahholic Moved On Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: League City, Texas Posts: 3,974	i like hard plumbing because i plan on running my tank long term and PVC is better for long term in my opinion. it sucks to cut and glue, but once you have it completed, it's gonna be years before you'll ever need to do it again. good luck my friend...

06/20/2011, 11:16 AM	#3
clugo Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 537	thanks alot. Did you paste or glue?

06/20/2011, 11:19 AM	#4
Reefahholic Moved On Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: League City, Texas Posts: 3,974	everybody gets their cement from lowes mostly. if you want a really good brand, weld on is good. about anything works well. just remember that you have about 5 seconds before you can't move it! lol it drys quick..

06/20/2011, 12:11 PM	#5
aleonn Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 4,041	I also prefer hard plumbing with PVC, as it's easy and more leak-proof IMO. Use a lot of unions so that you have flexibility to clean the pipes or change their design.

06/20/2011, 12:19 PM	#6
Reefahholic Moved On Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: League City, Texas Posts: 3,974	Yes yes, unions are great. Look at my recent post about plumbing, you'll see unions everywhere. This allows u to take apart ur pipe and clean it. Also, make sure u put a union just above ur return pump so you can clean or replace that pump.

06/20/2011, 12:52 PM	#7
clugo Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 537	Thanks for the all the great info. I'm going PVC.

06/20/2011, 12:55 PM	#8
vorm Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 210	It should be noted that you get better flow through the plumbing using hose, as elbows, unions and other fitting restrict flow a lot more.

06/20/2011, 01:31 PM	#9
jeff@zina.com Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Naples, FL Posts: 3,345	I do both, depending on what's appropriate. I almost always use hose for at least short sections, even if just for noise isolation. Plus I have a habit of moving stuff and it's easier to snip a hose than saw out the framework to move PVC. And I don't get my PVC cement at Lowes. Home Depot is closer. Jeff

06/20/2011, 03:14 PM	#10
Dr Colliebreath Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: DC Vicinity Posts: 1,813	I have done it both ways and prefer flexible tubing /hose. Easier to do, no reason for any leaks, and I never wanted to take my tubing out. I will cut and replace the tubing if necessary.

06/20/2011, 06:10 PM	#13
carlos413 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Chicopee Massachusetts Posts: 427	tagging along this is good stuff.

06/20/2011, 06:22 PM	#14
0 tds Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: St Augustine Fl Posts: 138	Just mesured a 1.5" pipe and union. The pipe was 1.59 and the union was 1.49(inside). Thats 0.1" smaller on the union.

06/20/2011, 06:30 PM	#15
0 tds Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: St Augustine Fl Posts: 138	I just ran a head loss test from the Head Loss calculator. Vertical length in feet = 5 Horizontal length in feet = 3 Pipe diameter in inches = .75 pump = Eheim1250 Number of 90 degree elbows = 2 Number of ball valves = 1 Number of pipe exits = 1 Number of pipe entrances = 1 Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH. I then added 1 union Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH. I then calculated with 10 unions Same Result = 2.25 PSI / 136 GPH. I then calculated with 15 unions New result = 2.25 PSI / 135 GPH. I would say add all the unions you want!!!!!

06/20/2011, 06:55 PM	#16
mightymizz Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Oregon Posts: 304	Unions traditionally have a smaller diameter in their middle section than where the water flows in and out of the union. Most people actually get a union one size larger than what their running and the use reducers down to the preferred diameter so that no restrictions are in the line. I run 1" pipe, so I buy a 1 1/4" or whatever it is and use a reducer down to 1".

06/21/2011, 08:19 AM	#20
clugo Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 537	I agree. Using hose for the return is preferable.

06/21/2011, 08:49 AM	#21
SkullV They Got My Number Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 6,898	I Prefer to use PVC for everything. I have an oversized pump so a little head loss from 2 90* fittings is not an issue. I always incorporate a section of SpaFlex into the return portion of the PVC to soak up vibration and allow for a little play when I am removing the pump via the ONE true union incorporated into the pipe.

06/21/2011, 08:37 PM	#24
Neroon Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 44	I recently plumbed a 180. Initially I used all rigid PVC, but it was loud. I was really surprised by how much the water flow echoed, especially for the drain. I ended up using flex PVC (aka SpaFlex at Home Depot) for the drain and the part of the plumbing that connects the to the return pump. The rest of the return plumbing includes some valves for reactors and a tee to the refugium. That part is rigid. This setup is MUCH quieter for me. My experience...