My first major loss

[conk12301]

I've had my first major meltdown in my 36 gallon reef in the seven months its been up and running.

Last week I had two fire gobies disappear. Assuming they died and the CUC got rid of the remains. I had no idea what the cause was. Checked all my params and everything was fine... until I checked my salinity. It was at 1.019. I guess I left it slip somehow gradually and it finally killed two fish.

Well when I realized this, in a bit of a panic, I decided to make a heavy mix of salt water and dump it in to up the salinity. It upped the salinity a little too fast. Back up to 1.026 in one 5 gallon change. I thought it would take 2-3 changes to get it back up in the right range.

Well, today I have two corals that are rotting down to the skeleton (an acan and a candy cane) AND my duncan, hammer and gonioporria arent opening up. Is it safe to assume this disaster be because of the sudden salinity drop and jump?

Nothing else has changed in the tank except for the fact that I changed out my sandbed yesterday as well. perhaps this could have disturbed the corasls?

[snorvich]

Nothing good ever happens quickly. Sorry for your loss. However SG of 1.019 would not have killed your firefish. What kind of top is on the tank?

[sandwi54]

the salinity going down to 1.019 should not be the reason that the gobies died. fish can take salinity as low as 1.008. something else must have gone wrong. how exactly did the salinity go from 1.025 to 1.019? salt does not evaporate.

[conk12301]

I got my own RO DI unit for the first time a month ago. So I've been a beginner at making my own water and I suspect the salinity wasn't where it should be, so the first couple water changes maybe have lowered the salinity.

Is there anything I could do at this point to bring back the corals? They look "half dead" not quite goners yet though.

[Jabberwock]

Many corals are surprisingly resilient. I've had acans that I thought had melted away completely return after weeks of good, slow-paced maintenance.

Are you using a hydrometer (minimum) or refractometer (best) to measure your salinity? If you are using the former, then I advise upgrading to the later. Also remember that there are other chemicals such as calcium, alk, and magnesium mixed in with the salt... If you make a fast upward salinity change you are likely also spiking your system's alkalinity, which is bad for coral health - and another reason to keep up with your water changes... especially if you do not have a system in place for alk/cal/mag replenishment. Generally - and you know this for sure now - any major/fast change is bad for your system's health.

If you keep your salinity stable in your make-up water and keep on your water changes you should see them recover, assuming that all other factors (lighting, water flow, ect) are also good. Target feeding once or twice per week with a small amount of frozen food like mysis shrimp should help them recover/grow faster.

Also, you probably have some spikes in phosphate/nitrates/nitrites if a couple of fish were lost in the tank... Again, water changes will help this.

[conk12301]

My acan and candy cane are pretty much withered down to the skeleton (all in 2 days) at this point. And my duncan, gonioporria, hammer and devil's hand are now opening up. My GSP and kenya tree seem just fine. And the fish seem fine.

Is there something I should be doing other than waiting? All params checked out okay. I am almost afraid to do a water change since the movement and floating debris might just cause more stress.

Any idea what this could be or what I do next?

[crawlerman]

do nothing, just let it be. you just did a water change two days ago so there is no need to do one right away. Just let everything settle. Never change anything fast

[conk12301]

Another day with no corals opening. Starting to get concerned that I'm going to lose my corals.

Would could be stressing corals that wouldn't be bothering the fish?

[Meshmez]

you said you changed out your sandbed? that could release all kinds of stuff....

[conk12301]

I am at a full week with no corals opening since I changed out my sand bed and started using my own RO/DI water.

I can't figure this out for the life of me.

I have done 2 35% WCs since the sand bed change. FIgured maybe the new sand released some dust into the water that stressed the corals. Two WCs later and still no corals opening.

Which makes me wonder if maybe it's the RO/DI water. It's brand new and right from BRS.

Ugh. Any tips? I want to make sure this isn't the end of my reef.

[freetareef]

was it a dsb?

what are your parameters right now?

I have had a few gobies jump out on me, do you have a lid?

if you poured the heavy salt mix directly in your tank you may have "burned" your corals...

[hollister]

Yes changeing the SB will cause this easy. Why did you change it.
Whats used for water flow in there?

And yes always make changes slowly.

[conk12301]

It was not a DSB. I changed it out because it was so thin to begin with already 6 months of siphoning out algae that it was pretty nonexistent. So I replaced the SB with new fresh sand but didn't want to dump fesh clean stand right on top of dirty old sand.

I do think a couple of my WCs since I got the RO/DI have been a little thick with salt. The water looks a little white and cloud compared to the pre-mixed water I was getting from the LFS. When I pour my homemade made water in the tank turns a touch cloudy for a couple hours and then clears right up. What is the best way to make sure they mix better. So far I've been scooping salt into my 5-gallon jug, filling half way, capping it, shaking it up, and then filling it back up to the top before shaking again.

How do you guys mix your salt? I don't have room to use a garbage can the way many people do.

Also if I did "burn" my corals... are they going to recover and start opening up again?

[Zalman]

You should be letting the salt mix for at least 24 hours before pouring it into your tank. Since your tank is smaller maybe try doing smaller water changes more often. 5 gal every 7-10 days would be fine. You must have a place to store a 5 gal bucket with a little power head in it no?

[Dustin1300]

Stop rushing things or you won't have a single form of life left in your tank!

1) How long do you mix the water before adding to tank?
2) What is the temperature of the NSW when introduced?
3) Using hydrometer or refractometer to measure the SG? If refractometer, have you calibrated?

As far as the SG being too low I would say that it can kill fish after longer exposure as it can lead to liver failure. I run a QT for 6 weeks on all new fish and run them at 1.009 SG but I bring them SLOWLY back up to 1.025. They can handle a drop in salinity but don't like a sudden raise in salinity from what I've read. Good luck and do much more research and have PATIENCE, PATIENCE, PATIENCE.

[conk12301]

Clearly, the problem was with my salt mixes. I didn't know they had to sit and mix for awhile before being used.

I set up an old 10 gallon tank with a HOB filter. I'm going to use that as my saltwater mixing tank. I'll let 10 gallons mix in the tank for a couple days before I do a WC from now on.

Will my "burned" corals recover, though? Anything I can do?

[89Foxbody]

Yes they can recover.

You can just use a 5 gallon bucket for your mixing bucket...or a brute trash can (what most will recommend).

Still, using your salt too soon is not going to kill your fish. I doubt that is the root of the problem.

[conk12301]

If it's not the salt mix, it has to be the sand bed change. Should I just continue with the water changes until whatever has been released by the sand bed is out of the water? It does look like the top of the water has a slight, slight dusting on it.

[89Foxbody]

A film on the surface of the water indicates either not enough flow or insufficient skimming.

[crashwl21]

man o man just relax

[00Warpig00]

Originally Posted by 89Foxbody

Yes they can recover.

Still, using your salt too soon is not going to kill your fish. I doubt that is the root of the problem.

Really? I'm a newb so maybe you can elaborate on this. It would seem to me that dumping in ~15% of the tank volume of extremely strongly mixed five minutes ago, still cloudy with salt, saltwater could kill some stuff in the tank. Maybe not the root of the original problem with the vanishing gobies since this mix was added after they vanished, but still seems like it could kill fish... not saying your wrong... I really don't know and would like to know more about why doing that wouldn't have the potential to kill any fish.

Nick

[conk12301]

Turned my skimmer up to full blast. The dust on top of the surface is now gone.

I'm also running a ton of carbon now. The guy at the LFS said it sounds like I got a bad bunch of sand or maybe I didn't rinse it thoroughly enough.

Ammonia and Nitrites are at 0. Nitrates at 15.

So weird that the corals are suffering by the fish are fine. I'm beginning to think the two dying gobies were from an unrelated problem. The corals deteriorated so quickly right after the sand bed change it had to be due to that.

Should I just keep doing water changes?

[sjwitt]

I honestly think the corals are suffering from the SG fluctuations ... most decidedly the sudden increase. It's not unusual for a burned coral to not extend for several weeks and they may not regrow in the burned areas but come back from less damaged spots. There's really nothing you can do about it now but wait and see.

Do your water changes, small and regular after 'aging' the new water. Make sure temperature and SG is close to that of the tank. You're running a skimmer so you have a sump, yes? If so, add the new water to the sump and let it mix with what's already in the sump and pump it up into the tank rather than adding new water directly to DT. Most of all just relax and have patience. They are going to have to heal on their own.

Oh, and I don't know how your tank is set up but you might want to check the sump for your gobies. I've had a couple of fish go up into the return and end up down in the sump. One sand sifting goby (pretty good sized) disappeared on me for a few weeks. Then one night I kept hearing something knocking around in the sump and there he was. Or, you might have a predator that hitched a ride on LR... you might want to check for that too.

[rovster]

I think there are a bunch of little things going on at once here. Bottom line is that there was too much done, all at once and too quickly.

On the subject of mixing salt water, I bought a few 5 gal buckets with lids at Home Depot and use them to store fresh and salt water. I also bought the cheapest powerhead and heater I could find and make sure I mix at least a day in advance. If the mix has already been done to the correct salinity, I still put the power head in there for a couple of hours while I match the temps. Good luck with everything and slow it up. It took me months to learn that, but I'm getting it now. Actually, I've noticed that the less i mess with the tank, the better things look. It's hard to avoid the temptation to mess with things. I've noticed that after I get back from a vacation or a long weekend, the tank looks awesome.

[sjwitt]

^^+1 Well said!