sump and return pump questions? what do you guys think?

joel913 · 12/27/2011, 02:36 AM

so, this is my first post on here, and just wanted to say hi to everyone. im starting a 125 gallon SW tank and just wanted to see what you guys thought about the 55 gallon sump tank i am about to build. the first chamber to the left, is the overflow, im going to have two filter socks and my skimmer in that chamber. the chamber to the very right side will be my refuge, i plan i having a bare bottom with lots of cheato algee. and now the middle section, my return. i have a huggeeeee pump that i have left over from an old pond i use to have, it was just a replacement pump so its brand new, i just took it out of the box a little while ago. the problem is, its a 5600 GPH pump... i heard you can dial a pump down to a dribble, can i do that with this monster?? so let me know what you think and if i should change anything. definitively open to ideas so let me know. =)

Ron Reefman · 12/27/2011, 07:17 AM

If you aren't feeding a manifold with that pump, but just return flow and the skimmer (as in your drawing) I think you may be choking the pump back too much. With 2 drain lines feeding the sump and each being 1" (for example) you will only have about 1200gph (at best) comming from the DT. That's only 20% of what the pump is rated for. Choking it back that much may (I'm not positive as it depends on the pump) make it run hotter than if it were running closer to 5600gph. You could relieve some of that backpressure by adding a loop out to the skimmer side of the sump that is just to increase the flow thru the pump. You could run a manifold that could fed a chiller, GFO reactor or any other add-ons you'd like to have.

joel913 · 12/27/2011, 01:08 PM

i was debating on whether or not to add a a pipe from the return back over to the overflow but couldn't figure out if it would be a good idea or not, it wouldn't hurt though i guess, right? and the manifold is a great idea, i don't think i will be able to do any extras like that for a while, but it would we a good idea to have it there if i need to expand in the future. other then that, will this sump design work out??

DonaldLL · 12/27/2011, 01:26 PM

Joel how much flow do you want thru the sump? If you will abide by the 3x to 5x rule of thumb, you're only talking about ~700 gph max. If you choke down a pump to 10% it seems that will come with a price like, heat, electricity, decreased lifespan? I have no data but this is what I see is just an inefficient operation there. How about just buying a return pump rated at 1000 gph, dial it back to 60%, spend about $165 and be done with it? Perhaps someone else can back me up with data to confirm or discredit my opinion... 'cause this is just my humble opinion.

joel913 · 12/28/2011, 12:35 AM

i was thinking about doing the max flow rate i can get through my overflow holes. thers (2) 2 inch holes on the bottom of the tank. im thinking i can get a good amount through there. i know its more then whats recommended, but ive read some stuff saying that, for exaple, a 2 inch overflow will do 1000 GPH (thats not a correct number, just used it for this expample) which means two 2 inch pipes will do around 2000 GPH. which means the tank will cycle 48,000 gallons a day, or cycle the tank about 385 times a day, so chances are the skimmer and refuge will both have all the water thru them many times a day. but was just an example i read on a website. im not sure if thats right or not??

mjm7757 · 12/28/2011, 01:59 AM

Just want to make sure but do the holes have 2" bulkheads? Also, even if you can run a high volume of water through your sump, that doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing, it reduces the dwell time that is necessary for efficient operation of your skimmer and refugium.

12/27/2011, 07:17 AM	#2
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	If you aren't feeding a manifold with that pump, but just return flow and the skimmer (as in your drawing) I think you may be choking the pump back too much. With 2 drain lines feeding the sump and each being 1" (for example) you will only have about 1200gph (at best) comming from the DT. That's only 20% of what the pump is rated for. Choking it back that much may (I'm not positive as it depends on the pump) make it run hotter than if it were running closer to 5600gph. You could relieve some of that backpressure by adding a loop out to the skimmer side of the sump that is just to increase the flow thru the pump. You could run a manifold that could fed a chiller, GFO reactor or any other add-ons you'd like to have. __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

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12/27/2011, 01:08 PM	#3
joel913 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 47	i was debating on whether or not to add a a pipe from the return back over to the overflow but couldn't figure out if it would be a good idea or not, it wouldn't hurt though i guess, right? and the manifold is a great idea, i don't think i will be able to do any extras like that for a while, but it would we a good idea to have it there if i need to expand in the future. other then that, will this sump design work out??

12/27/2011, 01:26 PM	#4
DonaldLL Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 197	Joel how much flow do you want thru the sump? If you will abide by the 3x to 5x rule of thumb, you're only talking about ~700 gph max. If you choke down a pump to 10% it seems that will come with a price like, heat, electricity, decreased lifespan? I have no data but this is what I see is just an inefficient operation there. How about just buying a return pump rated at 1000 gph, dial it back to 60%, spend about $165 and be done with it? Perhaps someone else can back me up with data to confirm or discredit my opinion... 'cause this is just my humble opinion.

12/28/2011, 12:35 AM	#5
joel913 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 47	i was thinking about doing the max flow rate i can get through my overflow holes. thers (2) 2 inch holes on the bottom of the tank. im thinking i can get a good amount through there. i know its more then whats recommended, but ive read some stuff saying that, for exaple, a 2 inch overflow will do 1000 GPH (thats not a correct number, just used it for this expample) which means two 2 inch pipes will do around 2000 GPH. which means the tank will cycle 48,000 gallons a day, or cycle the tank about 385 times a day, so chances are the skimmer and refuge will both have all the water thru them many times a day. but was just an example i read on a website. im not sure if thats right or not??

12/28/2011, 01:59 AM	#6
mjm7757 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 60	Just want to make sure but do the holes have 2" bulkheads? Also, even if you can run a high volume of water through your sump, that doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing, it reduces the dwell time that is necessary for efficient operation of your skimmer and refugium.