Auto Top Off Question

fengxzhang · 06/08/2012, 11:47 PM

Currently, I have a ATO system using a float valve in the sump and it's connected directly to the outlet line of the RO/DI unit. The pressure build up basically stops the RO/DI unit once water is at the right level. Just last night, I noticed the sump was overflowing because the float valve failed to shut off. I'm looking for a better system.

I have been looking at autotopoff.com and the JBJ models, but all requires me to have a reservoir. Is there a system that will allow me to connect my ATO directly to the outlet of the RO/DI unit without having a reservoir?

I also have an Apex Neptune system controlling almost everything else, how could I use the Apex system to control the ATO without having to use a reservior?

Thanks!

devildog999 · 06/09/2012, 04:43 AM

You should be able to use the tank mount or sump mount with this from autotopoff.... http://autotopoff.com/solenoid/. Just have the RO/DI line attach to it then have the line go from the output side into your sump. Plug it into the actual float and you will be good. They also have a optical version that might give you more comfort.

sammy77 · 06/09/2012, 06:31 AM

It is always safer to have a reservoir for your ato versus directly directly from your RO/DI in case of a failure. That way if you have some type of failure, you are only gonna dump whatever is in your reservoir instead of much more.

EricSIny · 06/09/2012, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammy77

It is always safer to have a reservoir for your ato versus directly directly from your RO/DI in case of a failure. That way if you have some type of failure, you are only gonna dump whatever is in your reservoir instead of much more.

+1

While it may be easier to just plumb it straight from your RODI the risk of failure is still there. None of these system are foolproof reguardless of the float switch used. IMO better safe then sorry, its not just a risk of flooding your home but also killing your livestock.

SimonSKL · 06/09/2012, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammy77

It is always safer to have a reservoir for your ato versus directly directly from your RO/DI in case of a failure. That way if you have some type of failure, you are only gonna dump whatever is in your reservoir instead of much more.

+1

Whether you are going to use a float valve or float switch controlled by your controller, it will fail eventually. It happened to me. A reservoir is a fail-safe way to guard against crashing your tank.

Reeftanker · 06/09/2012, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simonskl

+1

whether you are going to use a float valve or float switch controlled by your controller, it will fail eventually. It happened to me. A reservoir is a fail-safe way to guard against crashing your tank.

+3

seasmurf · 06/09/2012, 07:51 AM

I have my RO?DI system feed two 15 gallon reservoirs. I drilled a hole in the bottom of them nd installed bulkhedas and faucets. Now, should I have a membrane problem and lose my RO system, I have over a week of rereve capacity and I can use the faucets to make up salt water for my weeklywater changes.

Dubya_R_X · 06/09/2012, 05:12 PM

Using the RO/DI unit to directly top off will result in water not being as pure due to it sitting in the membrane. I've always disposed of the initial water from the RO/DI every time using it.

fengxzhang · 06/09/2012, 10:41 PM

Thanks for all the input. My TDI meter shows 0ppm, the water goes through a DI unit after the membrane. Is there another way to measure the purity of the water?

It seems that everyone is in favor of an reservoir for very good reasons. I do have a 30 gallon reserve for my RO/DI water that's cycled through on a bi weekly bases for water changes. I also have another 15 gallons of already mixed water handy for emergencies. I think I'm safe in having enough water for a 110 gallon system. Thoughts?

The area where I have the storage it's not accessible to be used at an auto top off. That's why I'm trying to feed the water directly from my RO/DI unit. I do it for a couple of reasons. 1. The inability to have storage near the tank for top off. 2. The ease of having the top off come directly from the source and not worried about the top of reservoir running dry.

I do understand the possibility of nuking the tank. As my float valve type ATO failed me for the first time in 2 years, hence I'm asking about a better solution. I plan to have a couple of water senors attached to my Apex Neptune. If the sump is overflowing or if the overflow from the tank is overflowing, the water sensors will tell my ATO to shut off, preventing the tank from being nuked. I have a slower RO/DI unit hooked up to the ATO. I hope having a solenoid type valve (to generate enough pressure to stop the RO unit) attached to a new float valve will give me double the protection, right?

I understand there is no perfect system, I'm just trying to figure out the best way to do this as I take frequent trips away from home. My friends feed my fish, but they don't have to worry much about adding water to the reservoir and etc.

mal7887 · 06/10/2012, 04:45 AM

I went with AVAST Marine Works auto top off kit that hooks up directly to the apex. Though my top off is hooked up to a 5 gallon reservoir. Using sensors and timers via virtual outlets there are a lot of ways to mitigate damage. In my setup I allow my top off pump to only run for a maximum of 5 minutes, if the full level sensor is not tripped in 5 minutes then it has to wait for another 60 minutes before it can top off again. Then if on the second top off attempt it doesn't fill to where it trips the sensor within 5 minutes it shuts off and the alarm sounds and I also get an email. I have it set so it won't try to fill again for 180 minutes so I have plenty of time to intervene or disable the top off via mobile, etc.

fengxzhang · 06/10/2012, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mal7843

I went with AVAST Marine Works auto top off kit that hooks up directly to the apex. Though my top off is hooked up to a 5 gallon reservoir. Using sensors and timers via virtual outlets there are a lot of ways to mitigate damage. In my setup I allow my top off pump to only run for a maximum of 5 minutes, if the full level sensor is not tripped in 5 minutes then it has to wait for another 60 minutes before it can top off again. Then if on the second top off attempt it doesn't fill to where it trips the sensor within 5 minutes it shuts off and the alarm sounds and I also get an email. I have it set so it won't try to fill again for 180 minutes so I have plenty of time to intervene or disable the top off via mobile, etc.

Awesome! Does the AVAST unit allow you to feed the RO/DI unit directly into the float valve type? It's a solenoid type of valve capable of pressure to stop the RO unit?

WestTexasReefer · 06/10/2012, 07:30 PM

I use the Level Loc system from Bulk Reef Supply. It has a float valve and an electric selanoid for redundancy. It won't put water in the tank unless it has power to it. I have the power supply connected to a timer so water can only flow in 3 times a day for 3 minutes at a time.

fengxzhang · 06/11/2012, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestTexasReefer

I use the Level Loc system from Bulk Reef Supply. It has a float valve and an electric selanoid for redundancy. It won't put water in the tank unless it has power to it. I have the power supply connected to a timer so water can only flow in 3 times a day for 3 minutes at a time.

Can't find the Level Loc System on BRS. Can you post a link?

06/08/2012, 11:47 PM	#1
fengxzhang Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Kansas City Posts: 67	Auto Top Off Question Currently, I have a ATO system using a float valve in the sump and it's connected directly to the outlet line of the RO/DI unit. The pressure build up basically stops the RO/DI unit once water is at the right level. Just last night, I noticed the sump was overflowing because the float valve failed to shut off. I'm looking for a better system. I have been looking at autotopoff.com and the JBJ models, but all requires me to have a reservoir. Is there a system that will allow me to connect my ATO directly to the outlet of the RO/DI unit without having a reservoir? I also have an Apex Neptune system controlling almost everything else, how could I use the Apex system to control the ATO without having to use a reservior? Thanks!

06/09/2012, 06:31 AM	#3
sammy77 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: IL Posts: 373	It is always safer to have a reservoir for your ato versus directly directly from your RO/DI in case of a failure. That way if you have some type of failure, you are only gonna dump whatever is in your reservoir instead of much more. __________________ 220gal FOWLR When you're down....look up....get up....and don't ever give up! Current Tank Info: 220gal FOWLR

06/09/2012, 07:51 AM	#7
seasmurf Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Pepperell, MA Posts: 53	ATO with reservoir I have my RO?DI system feed two 15 gallon reservoirs. I drilled a hole in the bottom of them nd installed bulkhedas and faucets. Now, should I have a membrane problem and lose my RO system, I have over a week of rereve capacity and I can use the faucets to make up salt water for my weeklywater changes.

06/10/2012, 04:45 AM	#10
mal7887 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Tampa Posts: 643	I went with AVAST Marine Works auto top off kit that hooks up directly to the apex. Though my top off is hooked up to a 5 gallon reservoir. Using sensors and timers via virtual outlets there are a lot of ways to mitigate damage. In my setup I allow my top off pump to only run for a maximum of 5 minutes, if the full level sensor is not tripped in 5 minutes then it has to wait for another 60 minutes before it can top off again. Then if on the second top off attempt it doesn't fill to where it trips the sensor within 5 minutes it shuts off and the alarm sounds and I also get an email. I have it set so it won't try to fill again for 180 minutes so I have plenty of time to intervene or disable the top off via mobile, etc. __________________ Matt Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining. Current Tank Info: 190

06/10/2012, 07:30 PM	#12
WestTexasReefer Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Lubbock, Texas Posts: 243	I use the Level Loc system from Bulk Reef Supply. It has a float valve and an electric selanoid for redundancy. It won't put water in the tank unless it has power to it. I have the power supply connected to a timer so water can only flow in 3 times a day for 3 minutes at a time. __________________ Jeff Current Tank Info: 180 gallon brick with Aqua Illumination LED lights

06/09/2012, 04:43 AM	#2
devildog999 That Guy Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: New Braunfels, TX Posts: 457	You should be able to use the tank mount or sump mount with this from autotopoff.... http://autotopoff.com/solenoid/. Just have the RO/DI line attach to it then have the line go from the output side into your sump. Plug it into the actual float and you will be good. They also have a optical version that might give you more comfort.

06/09/2012, 05:12 PM	#8
Dubya_R_X Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 77	Using the RO/DI unit to directly top off will result in water not being as pure due to it sitting in the membrane. I've always disposed of the initial water from the RO/DI every time using it.

06/09/2012, 10:41 PM	#9
fengxzhang Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Kansas City Posts: 67	Thanks for all the input. My TDI meter shows 0ppm, the water goes through a DI unit after the membrane. Is there another way to measure the purity of the water? It seems that everyone is in favor of an reservoir for very good reasons. I do have a 30 gallon reserve for my RO/DI water that's cycled through on a bi weekly bases for water changes. I also have another 15 gallons of already mixed water handy for emergencies. I think I'm safe in having enough water for a 110 gallon system. Thoughts? The area where I have the storage it's not accessible to be used at an auto top off. That's why I'm trying to feed the water directly from my RO/DI unit. I do it for a couple of reasons. 1. The inability to have storage near the tank for top off. 2. The ease of having the top off come directly from the source and not worried about the top of reservoir running dry. I do understand the possibility of nuking the tank. As my float valve type ATO failed me for the first time in 2 years, hence I'm asking about a better solution. I plan to have a couple of water senors attached to my Apex Neptune. If the sump is overflowing or if the overflow from the tank is overflowing, the water sensors will tell my ATO to shut off, preventing the tank from being nuked. I have a slower RO/DI unit hooked up to the ATO. I hope having a solenoid type valve (to generate enough pressure to stop the RO unit) attached to a new float valve will give me double the protection, right? I understand there is no perfect system, I'm just trying to figure out the best way to do this as I take frequent trips away from home. My friends feed my fish, but they don't have to worry much about adding water to the reservoir and etc.