New clownfish died. Can someone tell me why?

BennJabb · 08/11/2012, 02:01 AM

I'm new to the hobby and don't know much so please take it easy on me. I have both a 75 gallon tank and a 3 gallon pico. This week I bought two clownfish, an Austrailian Black Percula and an Occellaris Clownfish, from a lfs and decided to put them in the 3 gallon pico for a short period of time(1 week tops). The fish were acclimated first by leaving the bag they came in in the water for 1 hour and then they were released into a bucket for drip acclimation. The Black Percula was very energetic and explored the tank throughout the day, while the Ocellaris seemed abnormally pale and mostly hid in the corner of the tank. When it came feeding time I fed PE Mysis shrimp and although the Black Percula seem to not like the food very much he still ate a few shrimp. However the Ocellaris did not leave the corner he was sitting in. The next day I turn on the light and notice the Ocellaris is swimming strangely. He was almost vertical and was not moving very much. Every once in a while the Black Percula would go over and nip at the Ocellaris. I believed this be a normal thing because the Black Percula was the more dominant of the two. When the Ocellaris was being nipped at he would not swim away nor respond normally. This day I decided to change it up and feed the fish pellet food. The Balck Percula seemed to love the pellets and ate a bunch, but again the Ocellaris did not even go for the food. That night I turned off the light and left the tank alone for a few hours. When I came back to the tank, the Ocellaris was dead on the sand. Can anyone tell me what may have been wrong with the fish?
Here's a list of things to note:
-One clown is A. Percula and the other was A. Ocellaris.(Don't know if this is a problem.)
-The Ocellaris did not eat any type of food for the time i had it.
-The Ocellaris seemed to vary in paleness throught the day and night.
-The Ocellaris would have periods of heavy breathing and then shortly after would breathe normally.
-All levels in the tank were tested to be zero after the clown died.
-Temperature of the tank remained a stable 78 F

kenc87 · 08/11/2012, 03:18 AM

I am not 100% confident but from what I know mixing the two different types of clowns isn't a good idea and usually doesn't end well. Also putting them in a 3 gallon could have made the situation worse. Of course I'm assuming the tank was fully cycled and able to handle the waste produced by the fish.

Denbf58 · 08/11/2012, 05:42 AM

a 3 g tank is to small to to use as a qt that side it could be any thing form a parasight to stress that made the fish die

kimon201 · 08/11/2012, 06:52 AM

Well I have no idea if it is ok to mix the clowns like that, but it sounds to me like the fish you bought wasn't healthy. From now on, always make sure to ask the person at your LFS to feed the fish before you buy it.

sjwitt · 08/11/2012, 07:05 AM

Since the black one didn't show evidence of distress, I'd agree with kimon201 that the fish wasn't healthy to start... that's not uncommon. Spend time in the LFS and observe the fist before you buy, usually you can tell which aren't healthy to start with and as said above ask to see it feed before you buy.

Another note, 3 g is too small for QT, especially since QT should be several weeks to make sure you don't introduce disease into your Display AND to make sure the fish are eating before they go into the DT.

Being new doesn't mean you have to make the usual mistakes... there are many stickies on acclimation and quarantine so do yourself (and the fish) a favor and read up on proper QT before you buy anymore fish. Read some of the fish disease posts and you'll see why you should quarantine properly, every time.

Gary Majchrzak · 08/11/2012, 07:10 AM

we may never know the true reason why the ocellaris died.

Do not mix clownfish species.

I'm all for QT but a 3 gallon pico isn't any good for it. I would place your percula in the larger aquarium ASAP if it's ready (cycled).

Get fishes out of their transport bags ASAP.

Many LFS run their S.G. lower than a reef aquarium so a slow acclimation in a bucket can be a good thing.

Don't expect a new fish to eat right away. Give them time to acclimate to their new surroundings. Uneaten fish food can quickly become a problem- especially in 3 gallons of water.

How long did the LFS have the ocellaris before you purchased it? I'm not leaning towards the fish being unhealthy. It's sounds more like a mishandling problem to me.

bnumair · 08/11/2012, 07:11 AM

i think there are 2 factors here. first fish being not healthy soon as u put it in the tank. also temp acclimation should be 15-30 min. with bag never opened. soon as that bag is opened after 30-45 mins the water start becoming toxic.
secondly those 2 species do not mix. a dominant fish will hurt the other and 3 gal being a small tank will also factor in higher stress levels.

BennJabb · 08/11/2012, 02:04 PM

Thanks for the input everyone. I don't remeber the Ocellaris ever looking too great. The Percula seems fine and will be moved to the 75 gallon this week.

Mavrk · 08/11/2012, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BennJabb

an Austrailian Black Percula and an Occellaris Clownfish...
-One clown is A. Percula and the other was A. Ocellaris.(Don't know if this is a problem.)

Umm... I don't believe there is really an "Austrailian Black Percula", they might be sold as such, but I am pretty sure it is a black/white ocellaris. Can you post a picture?

BennJabb · 08/11/2012, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mavrk

Umm... I don't believe there is really an "Austrailian Black Percula", they might be sold as such, but I am pretty sure it is a black/white ocellaris. Can you post a picture?

Aquacon Sells it:
http://www.aquacon.com/Clownfish_saltwaterfish.html
It's right under the Ocellarisl.

izzy123 · 08/12/2012, 04:16 AM

Bennjabb, I have to say that I think it's great that you where so honest about the 3G tank, I think you knew it was too small from the getgo.

The ONLY way the pro's over here on RC can give you a correct answer, is to give them ALL the info, the good and the bad.

Learn from your mistake, get a bigger QT and observe the fish at the lfs before you buy them.

Good luck and happy reefing

BennJabb · 08/16/2012, 09:13 PM

Other clownfish has been moved to the 75 gallon and he looks great.

kbacon · 08/17/2012, 12:10 AM

Was there an anemone with him? Did you check kh and salinity after acclimating?

Chris27 · 08/17/2012, 06:28 AM

You shouldn't have any trouble keeping those two fish together, provided they are both juveniles. We've done it 100 times over in the store, and have had a black and white pair up with a regular ol' clown quite regularly. While they may have different names, they are all essentially the same fish, just crossbred (mother nature / man) to have the different coloring.

I certainly wouldn't recommend mixing a cinnamon or clarkii with a perc, but a perc with a ocellaris is fine....if they are two females though...you'll be in trouble no matter if they are the same species or not.

As for why it died, it's impossible to diagnose without a picture and some test results, and even then it's difficult. Some fish just don't like traveling and don't live long during the trek.

coreenm · 08/30/2012, 04:31 PM

I went through 5 clown fish, all percs, before I got a stable mated pair that didn't die on me (or get eaten by the rose bubble-tip anemone, which is NUTS). But the pair I have now are about 3 years old and doing great in the bubble coral they adopted as home.

08/11/2012, 02:01 AM	#1
BennJabb Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Maryland Posts: 63	New clownfish died. Can someone tell me why? I'm new to the hobby and don't know much so please take it easy on me. I have both a 75 gallon tank and a 3 gallon pico. This week I bought two clownfish, an Austrailian Black Percula and an Occellaris Clownfish, from a lfs and decided to put them in the 3 gallon pico for a short period of time(1 week tops). The fish were acclimated first by leaving the bag they came in in the water for 1 hour and then they were released into a bucket for drip acclimation. The Black Percula was very energetic and explored the tank throughout the day, while the Ocellaris seemed abnormally pale and mostly hid in the corner of the tank. When it came feeding time I fed PE Mysis shrimp and although the Black Percula seem to not like the food very much he still ate a few shrimp. However the Ocellaris did not leave the corner he was sitting in. The next day I turn on the light and notice the Ocellaris is swimming strangely. He was almost vertical and was not moving very much. Every once in a while the Black Percula would go over and nip at the Ocellaris. I believed this be a normal thing because the Black Percula was the more dominant of the two. When the Ocellaris was being nipped at he would not swim away nor respond normally. This day I decided to change it up and feed the fish pellet food. The Balck Percula seemed to love the pellets and ate a bunch, but again the Ocellaris did not even go for the food. That night I turned off the light and left the tank alone for a few hours. When I came back to the tank, the Ocellaris was dead on the sand. Can anyone tell me what may have been wrong with the fish? Here's a list of things to note: -One clown is A. Percula and the other was A. Ocellaris.(Don't know if this is a problem.) -The Ocellaris did not eat any type of food for the time i had it. -The Ocellaris seemed to vary in paleness throught the day and night. -The Ocellaris would have periods of heavy breathing and then shortly after would breathe normally. -All levels in the tank were tested to be zero after the clown died. -Temperature of the tank remained a stable 78 F

08/11/2012, 05:42 AM	#3
Denbf58 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: selden N.Y. Posts: 885	a 3 g tank is to small to to use as a qt that side it could be any thing form a parasight to stress that made the fish die __________________ Life is good Current Tank Info: 75gal reef ready koralia 3, 30g sump, 4b 48" t5s lighting, 29g reef with breeding pair clowns 55g reef 55g freshwater

08/11/2012, 07:10 AM	#6
Gary Majchrzak Team RC Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 41,560	we may never know the true reason why the ocellaris died. Do not mix clownfish species. I'm all for QT but a 3 gallon pico isn't any good for it. I would place your percula in the larger aquarium ASAP if it's ready (cycled). Get fishes out of their transport bags ASAP. Many LFS run their S.G. lower than a reef aquarium so a slow acclimation in a bucket can be a good thing. Don't expect a new fish to eat right away. Give them time to acclimate to their new surroundings. Uneaten fish food can quickly become a problem- especially in 3 gallons of water. How long did the LFS have the ocellaris before you purchased it? I'm not leaning towards the fish being unhealthy. It's sounds more like a mishandling problem to me. __________________ over 24 years experience with multiple types of marine aquarium systems see Upstate Reef Society Forum on RC and FB GOOGLE JUNIOR'S REEF Current Tank Info: 84x24x30 265g reef past TOTM honors

08/11/2012, 07:11 AM	#7
bnumair Dr. Reef at ur service Join Date: May 2009 Location: Tulsa, Ok, USA Posts: 7,751 Blog Entries: 15	i think there are 2 factors here. first fish being not healthy soon as u put it in the tank. also temp acclimation should be 15-30 min. with bag never opened. soon as that bag is opened after 30-45 mins the water start becoming toxic. secondly those 2 species do not mix. a dominant fish will hurt the other and 3 gal being a small tank will also factor in higher stress levels. __________________ Water Quality: NO3 0,Phos 0,Cal 440,Alk 7.5,Mag 1300 "Reef Fast, You Crash, Reef Slow, You Pass" Mike's Reef 3:16 Current Tank Info: 350g DT,95g sump, 50g Frag tank, 4800gph return 4x Sea swirls. 6x AI Vega Color. 200# Pukani rock, dual recirculating skimmer, Biopellet, GFO Carbon rx's, Cal rx. Closed loop. 1.5hp chiller, genesis renew. Apex & RKE

08/17/2012, 06:28 AM	#14
Chris27 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 4,452	You shouldn't have any trouble keeping those two fish together, provided they are both juveniles. We've done it 100 times over in the store, and have had a black and white pair up with a regular ol' clown quite regularly. While they may have different names, they are all essentially the same fish, just crossbred (mother nature / man) to have the different coloring. I certainly wouldn't recommend mixing a cinnamon or clarkii with a perc, but a perc with a ocellaris is fine....if they are two females though...you'll be in trouble no matter if they are the same species or not. As for why it died, it's impossible to diagnose without a picture and some test results, and even then it's difficult. Some fish just don't like traveling and don't live long during the trek. __________________ Fill your tank with $5 bills, add gasoline and light it on fire.....only then will you know the real cost of reefing. Current Tank Info: 180 Mixed Reef

08/11/2012, 03:18 AM	#2
kenc87 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Ypsilanti, MI Posts: 610	I am not 100% confident but from what I know mixing the two different types of clowns isn't a good idea and usually doesn't end well. Also putting them in a 3 gallon could have made the situation worse. Of course I'm assuming the tank was fully cycled and able to handle the waste produced by the fish.

08/11/2012, 06:52 AM	#4
kimon201 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Delray Beach, FL Posts: 25	Well I have no idea if it is ok to mix the clowns like that, but it sounds to me like the fish you bought wasn't healthy. From now on, always make sure to ask the person at your LFS to feed the fish before you buy it.

08/11/2012, 07:05 AM	#5
sjwitt Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: USA, East Coast Posts: 896	Since the black one didn't show evidence of distress, I'd agree with kimon201 that the fish wasn't healthy to start... that's not uncommon. Spend time in the LFS and observe the fist before you buy, usually you can tell which aren't healthy to start with and as said above ask to see it feed before you buy. Another note, 3 g is too small for QT, especially since QT should be several weeks to make sure you don't introduce disease into your Display AND to make sure the fish are eating before they go into the DT. Being new doesn't mean you have to make the usual mistakes... there are many stickies on acclimation and quarantine so do yourself (and the fish) a favor and read up on proper QT before you buy anymore fish. Read some of the fish disease posts and you'll see why you should quarantine properly, every time.

08/11/2012, 02:04 PM	#8
BennJabb Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Maryland Posts: 63	Thanks for the input everyone. I don't remeber the Ocellaris ever looking too great. The Percula seems fine and will be moved to the 75 gallon this week.

08/12/2012, 04:16 AM	#11
izzy123 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Belgium Posts: 504	Bennjabb, I have to say that I think it's great that you where so honest about the 3G tank, I think you knew it was too small from the getgo. The ONLY way the pro's over here on RC can give you a correct answer, is to give them ALL the info, the good and the bad. Learn from your mistake, get a bigger QT and observe the fish at the lfs before you buy them. Good luck and happy reefing

08/16/2012, 09:13 PM	#12
BennJabb Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Maryland Posts: 63	Other clownfish has been moved to the 75 gallon and he looks great.

08/17/2012, 12:10 AM	#13
kbacon Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 36	Was there an anemone with him? Did you check kh and salinity after acclimating?

08/30/2012, 04:31 PM	#15
coreenm Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Grand Island, NY Posts: 72	I went through 5 clown fish, all percs, before I got a stable mated pair that didn't die on me (or get eaten by the rose bubble-tip anemone, which is NUTS). But the pair I have now are about 3 years old and doing great in the bubble coral they adopted as home.