Help is this ick or something else?

ILikeTurtles · 09/04/2012, 07:48 PM

Heres the story i had a bad ick outbreak in my old 125 gallon. I treated the whole tank with copper. I had some soft corals and a cppl shrimp and snails i put in a 55 gallon. the ick went away after about a week. I put the fish in with the corals in the 55 gallon after 3 weeks of no ick signs. i got a 150 gallon and restarted with new dead rock and dead sand. i then cycled the tank with ace hardware ammonia. after about 3 weeks the tank was cycled so i slowly put the fish and corals back in. everything was fine then bam bad ick out break and it looks a little differnt more stringy i guess. and the fish fins had some white looking disease on them as well. I did have a naso that had a little lymph on its fins but it was more wart looking than this. this is my first time trying to post pics i hope it works. I am really stressed right now because i know i cant catch these fish, my pillars of rocks are not moving. I lowered the salinity to 1009 and moved the corals and shrimp back to 55 gallon. so far the fish dont look worse or better.. Should i just keep fish in my dt and consistently run copper? There are so many variables to reef or fish only, such as fish only my rocks will get covered in algae {no snails or inverts). If the fish get used to their new home will they become more relaxed and the ick will be fought off by their immune systems? or should i treat it? Catching fish and running dt fallow for 3 months is not an option. Ive done this 2 times, i almost believe ick is in every system now, idk. Thanks for any help you guys can offer.

h2so4hurts · 09/05/2012, 07:41 AM

This is definitely crypto and if you're not willing to treat the disease correctly you might as well just bleach your entire system and start over. It sounds like you know what you need to do but just don't want to. Crypto is not in every tank and it is curable if you follow a few simple steps outlined in the stickies.

MrTuskfish · 09/05/2012, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h2so4hurts

This is definitely crypto and if you're not willing to treat the disease correctly you might as well just bleach your entire system and start over. It sounds like you know what you need to do but just don't want to. Crypto is not in every tank and it is curable if you follow a few simple steps outlined in the stickies.

I couldn't agree more. The huge majority long-time hobbyists (that I know) have ich free tanks. We've got about 1000 gallons of ich-free display tanks in our house. Ich in our system would be a nightmare. I'm not piling on or trying to be harsh; I'll just repeat what every good author on our hobby says: if you can't/won't use a QT and a good QT regimen, this may not be the hobby for you. Trying to "manage" ich has ruined this wonderful hobby for countless folks. Ich is easy to control with good quarantine from day one.

ILikeTurtles · 09/05/2012, 06:14 PM

So do you guys have a qt with copper for new fish and a qt with no fish for every new piece of rock or coral that you get? How long would you qt the rock/ coral with no fish 3 months?

h2so4hurts · 09/05/2012, 07:30 PM

I start my tanks with 95% dry rock and seed it with a few pieces of rock from my other tanks which I know are crypto free.

I dip all of my coral in Bayer Advanced Bug killer (10mL per 500 mL tank water) for 10 minutes. Nothing but the coral survives that. DON'T do this with fish, it will be fatal.

All of my fish go through a 1hour 10x rid ich+ dip (5mL per gallon - Formalin/malachite green), a week of prazi treatment, and 4 weeks of observation.

ILikeTurtles · 09/05/2012, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h2so4hurts

I start my tanks with 95% dry rock and seed it with a few pieces of rock from my other tanks which I know are crypto free.

I dip all of my coral in Bayer Advanced Bug killer (10mL per 500 mL tank water) for 10 minutes. Nothing but the coral survives that. DON'T do this with fish, it will be fatal.

All of my fish go through a 1hour 10x rid ich+ dip (5mL per gallon - Formalin/malachite green), a week of prazi treatment, and 4 weeks of observation.

Wow thats good info! Any coral is unharmed from that dip? That stuff is at home depot right? Can you elaborate on the fish dip procedure? Rid ick is that the reef safe stuff? And what exactly is formalin/malachite? Also what is prazi? I now feel really under educated in qt..

h2so4hurts · 09/06/2012, 10:25 AM

I've dipped SPS and LPS in the bayer mixture. I don't do soft coral, but from what I've been told by others it has worked for them without a problem on leathers, etc. I got mine at Lowes, but yes, in the lawn care aisle.

The dip is really simple. Mix up 5mL RidIch+ per gallon salt water in a separate bucket, throw in an airstone and let the fish swim around in there for an hour. That dip should kill anything on or immediately under the skin of your fish. It has worked without fail for me, BUT your mileage may vary. RidIch+ is a solution of formalin and Malachite green. Formalin gets into cells and glues all of the proteins together, Malachite green is a nasty compound that turns off the power factories in cells (Mitochondria). It will not harm your fish as a bath. I have seen pretty high mortality with small fish like chromis though.

Praziquantel is a drug that kills worms, how it works is still up for debate (thought to turn of calcium and/or adenosine channels on cell membranes). It's good for getting rid of tapeworms and other intestinal baddies.

ILikeTurtles · 09/06/2012, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h2so4hurts

I've dipped SPS and LPS in the bayer mixture. I don't do soft coral, but from what I've been told by others it has worked for them without a problem on leathers, etc. I got mine at Lowes, but yes, in the lawn care aisle.

The dip is really simple. Mix up 5mL RidIch+ per gallon salt water in a separate bucket, throw in an airstone and let the fish swim around in there for an hour. That dip should kill anything on or immediately under the skin of your fish. It has worked without fail for me, BUT your mileage may vary. RidIch+ is a solution of formalin and Malachite green. Formalin gets into cells and glues all of the proteins together, Malachite green is a nasty compound that turns off the power factories in cells (Mitochondria). It will not harm your fish as a bath. I have seen pretty high mortality with small fish like chromis though.

Praziquantel is a drug that kills worms, how it works is still up for debate (thought to turn of calcium and/or adenosine channels on cell membranes). It's good for getting rid of tapeworms and other intestinal baddies.

Sounds like a good plan! Thank
you im going to give it a try!

ILikeTurtles · 09/06/2012, 05:21 PM

Wow this is taking over the blue tang fast his left gills are closed shut im draining water asap to get him and do dip i hope it makes it!im buying rid ick now! Can i run copper and prazi together? Im qt all fish and running tAnk fallow for a few months i care too much to see them suffer

09/05/2012, 07:41 AM	#2
h2so4hurts Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Durham, NC Posts: 462	This is definitely crypto and if you're not willing to treat the disease correctly you might as well just bleach your entire system and start over. It sounds like you know what you need to do but just don't want to. Crypto is not in every tank and it is curable if you follow a few simple steps outlined in the stickies. __________________ 350G SPS reef - tomato clowns&sebae nem-sunburst anthias- Carberryi Anthias-Powder Blue-Whitecheeck-Desjardini Sailfin-Purple Tang-Royal Gramma-Copperband-Spotfin-Engineer Goby-Moorish Idol

09/05/2012, 07:30 PM	#5
h2so4hurts Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Durham, NC Posts: 462	I start my tanks with 95% dry rock and seed it with a few pieces of rock from my other tanks which I know are crypto free. I dip all of my coral in Bayer Advanced Bug killer (10mL per 500 mL tank water) for 10 minutes. Nothing but the coral survives that. DON'T do this with fish, it will be fatal. All of my fish go through a 1hour 10x rid ich+ dip (5mL per gallon - Formalin/malachite green), a week of prazi treatment, and 4 weeks of observation. __________________ 350G SPS reef - tomato clowns&sebae nem-sunburst anthias- Carberryi Anthias-Powder Blue-Whitecheeck-Desjardini Sailfin-Purple Tang-Royal Gramma-Copperband-Spotfin-Engineer Goby-Moorish Idol

09/06/2012, 10:25 AM	#7
h2so4hurts Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Durham, NC Posts: 462	I've dipped SPS and LPS in the bayer mixture. I don't do soft coral, but from what I've been told by others it has worked for them without a problem on leathers, etc. I got mine at Lowes, but yes, in the lawn care aisle. The dip is really simple. Mix up 5mL RidIch+ per gallon salt water in a separate bucket, throw in an airstone and let the fish swim around in there for an hour. That dip should kill anything on or immediately under the skin of your fish. It has worked without fail for me, BUT your mileage may vary. RidIch+ is a solution of formalin and Malachite green. Formalin gets into cells and glues all of the proteins together, Malachite green is a nasty compound that turns off the power factories in cells (Mitochondria). It will not harm your fish as a bath. I have seen pretty high mortality with small fish like chromis though. Praziquantel is a drug that kills worms, how it works is still up for debate (thought to turn of calcium and/or adenosine channels on cell membranes). It's good for getting rid of tapeworms and other intestinal baddies. __________________ 350G SPS reef - tomato clowns&sebae nem-sunburst anthias- Carberryi Anthias-Powder Blue-Whitecheeck-Desjardini Sailfin-Purple Tang-Royal Gramma-Copperband-Spotfin-Engineer Goby-Moorish Idol

09/05/2012, 06:14 PM	#4
ILikeTurtles Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: tampa fl Posts: 31	So do you guys have a qt with copper for new fish and a qt with no fish for every new piece of rock or coral that you get? How long would you qt the rock/ coral with no fish 3 months?

09/06/2012, 05:21 PM	#9
ILikeTurtles Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: tampa fl Posts: 31	Wow this is taking over the blue tang fast his left gills are closed shut im draining water asap to get him and do dip i hope it makes it!im buying rid ick now! Can i run copper and prazi together? Im qt all fish and running tAnk fallow for a few months i care too much to see them suffer