NON-QUARANTINABLE livestock?????

AquaWave523 · 10/10/2012, 04:34 AM

I can only think of inverts such as shrimp, snails, corals and perhaps mandarin dragonet and lion fish because they are resistent to diseases?

Mr. Fish · 10/10/2012, 04:43 AM

IMO you should quarantine corals. Dipping only kills the adults, so eggs will still be left on the coral. I wouldn't quarantine a mandarin not for the fact that they are ich resistant, but for the lack of food in a QT.

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sponger0 · 10/10/2012, 06:31 AM

Dragonettes are not resistant to disease. They are less likely than other fish to be affected by crypt but can still carry the parasite and transfer it to your tank.

And actually someone on RC has gotten ick in their tank from a snail.

AquaWave523 · 10/10/2012, 06:36 AM

how do u quarantine inverts? u cant tell if ich is on it...and corals?

sponger0 · 10/10/2012, 06:38 AM

No you cannot tell if eggs are on them It is too small for our eyes.

If you wish to quarantine corals and inverts, you would need a seperate QT tank just for them. I wouldnt use your fish QT for inverts/corals

AquaticFins · 10/10/2012, 07:09 AM

With inverts and coral, the easiest way to quarantine them is simply time. Most parasitic organisms (like crypt/ich) cannot survive for very long without a host. It seems fairly rare to find mobile inverts that come in with parasites (other than perhaps shrimp), but corals do quite frequently arrive complete with parasitic or predatory nudibranchs, flatworms, snails and a variety of other pests. Especially in a large system, these can become very expensive and difficult to resolve outbreaks if not prevented from the onset. As Mr. Fish suggested, preventative dips are not always successful at completely eradicating pests. Isolating and quarantining offers time to observe, medicate and ensure they are as close to completely pest-free as possible as well as giving your animals time to adjust and recover from the stresses of shipping - just as important for corals and other invertebrates as it is for fish.

As for dragonettes, it is quite a bit more difficult to feed them through a quarantine period than most fish...but still possible. The easiest way I have found is to have some sacrificial live rock rubble or clumps of Chaetomorpha sp. algae or the like sitting in the refugium ahead of time that you can then transfer over in to the quarantine system, complete with 'pods for the mandarins to eat. Their thick slime coat also does not usually respond well to copper, in my experience...the "tank-transfer" method is probably the best way to prevent ich/crypt for them.

Personally, I err of the side of caution and isolate everything that goes in to my aquarium for three months in a quarantine system (I keep one for fish and one for invertebrates, as I use copper in the fish system).

It's not inexpensive, it's more time-consuming and it certainly takes a lot more patience than just dropping new critters, coral or rock in to the main tank...but the years have just made it seem more and more worthwhile to me.

C4rN4gE · 10/10/2012, 07:21 AM

QT everything! You would lose more money by introducing a pathogen to your tank that decimates the livestock than you will running a QT setup. It doesnt have to be fancy.

AquaWave523 · 10/10/2012, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C4rN4gE

QT everything! You would lose more money by introducing a pathogen to your tank that decimates the livestock than you will running a QT setup. It doesnt have to be fancy.

Right now, I have half-inch of sand, with two drybase rock in there. Is that good enough?

Sk8r · 10/10/2012, 10:16 AM

No sand or rock in a qt, period. That's where the ich parasite lives. Change the filters obsessively.

OTOH, everyone has to figure their odds, know whether they're buying from sources that take their own preventative measures, and decide how paranoid you want/need to be. I do not quarantine dragonets, I wash off inverts in a cup of tank discard water. I dip corals. And I do not run a roach-motel for fish: ie, I do NOT get new fish as a routine matter. I grow lps coral, which doesn't have the nudibranch problem that zoas do. I stock the tank once, fairly rapidly---and after that, I rarely, rarely get a new fish or invert once my tank is set up and running. The chap quoted I'm sure didn't get ich from a snail. He got it from the water that came WITH the snail. Wash the inverts quickly, each in a small cup of tank water, and cross your fingers. Again, keep your water in balance and you won't be losing snails and hermits.

Not saying anything against those who have the room and feel the need to be hyper-careful. It's good if you can do that. It's also good to buy all your fish, corals, and inverts within a few months, and then stop adding new stuff and watch what you've got live and grow and fill your tank over years of no-new-fish. Try to become the guy that has spare coral to give to friends, not the guy who's constantly adding stuff because something died. If things are dying in your tank---something's not right, and the place at least to start fixing problems is water quality.

Paul B · 10/10/2012, 10:34 AM

I dump buckets full of amphipods like these in my tank a few times a year, but I don't quarantine them. I also don't count them.

souperman · 10/10/2012, 12:57 PM

I have had ich reappear after a nine week fallow period. My fish marinated in copper in qt the entire time. The only thing I added were corals and inverts during that time. If you're going to chase the goal of a sterile disease free tank I'd think everything would have to be qt'd. Anything else is playing the odds...

Paul B · 10/10/2012, 02:40 PM

I forgot the picture

10/10/2012, 04:34 AM	#1
AquaWave523 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 911	NON-QUARANTINABLE livestock????? I can only think of inverts such as shrimp, snails, corals and perhaps mandarin dragonet and lion fish because they are resistent to diseases?

10/10/2012, 10:16 AM	#9
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	No sand or rock in a qt, period. That's where the ich parasite lives. Change the filters obsessively. OTOH, everyone has to figure their odds, know whether they're buying from sources that take their own preventative measures, and decide how paranoid you want/need to be. I do not quarantine dragonets, I wash off inverts in a cup of tank discard water. I dip corals. And I do not run a roach-motel for fish: ie, I do NOT get new fish as a routine matter. I grow lps coral, which doesn't have the nudibranch problem that zoas do. I stock the tank once, fairly rapidly---and after that, I rarely, rarely get a new fish or invert once my tank is set up and running. The chap quoted I'm sure didn't get ich from a snail. He got it from the water that came WITH the snail. Wash the inverts quickly, each in a small cup of tank water, and cross your fingers. Again, keep your water in balance and you won't be losing snails and hermits. Not saying anything against those who have the room and feel the need to be hyper-careful. It's good if you can do that. It's also good to buy all your fish, corals, and inverts within a few months, and then stop adding new stuff and watch what you've got live and grow and fill your tank over years of no-new-fish. Try to become the guy that has spare coral to give to friends, not the guy who's constantly adding stuff because something died. If things are dying in your tank---something's not right, and the place at least to start fixing problems is water quality. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%. Last edited by Sk8r; 10/10/2012 at 10:27 AM.

10/10/2012, 10:34 AM	#10
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	I dump buckets full of amphipods like these in my tank a few times a year, but I don't quarantine them. I also don't count them. __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

10/10/2012, 12:57 PM	#11
souperman Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 262	I have had ich reappear after a nine week fallow period. My fish marinated in copper in qt the entire time. The only thing I added were corals and inverts during that time. If you're going to chase the goal of a sterile disease free tank I'd think everything would have to be qt'd. Anything else is playing the odds... __________________ No.

10/10/2012, 02:40 PM	#12
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	I forgot the picture __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

10/10/2012, 04:43 AM	#2
Mr. Fish Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 828	IMO you should quarantine corals. Dipping only kills the adults, so eggs will still be left on the coral. I wouldn't quarantine a mandarin not for the fact that they are ich resistant, but for the lack of food in a QT. Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

10/10/2012, 06:31 AM	#3
sponger0 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Virginia Beach Posts: 6,659	Dragonettes are not resistant to disease. They are less likely than other fish to be affected by crypt but can still carry the parasite and transfer it to your tank. And actually someone on RC has gotten ick in their tank from a snail.

10/10/2012, 06:36 AM	#4
AquaWave523 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 911	how do u quarantine inverts? u cant tell if ich is on it...and corals?

10/10/2012, 06:38 AM	#5
sponger0 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Virginia Beach Posts: 6,659	No you cannot tell if eggs are on them It is too small for our eyes. If you wish to quarantine corals and inverts, you would need a seperate QT tank just for them. I wouldnt use your fish QT for inverts/corals

10/10/2012, 07:09 AM	#6
AquaticFins Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 887	With inverts and coral, the easiest way to quarantine them is simply time. Most parasitic organisms (like crypt/ich) cannot survive for very long without a host. It seems fairly rare to find mobile inverts that come in with parasites (other than perhaps shrimp), but corals do quite frequently arrive complete with parasitic or predatory nudibranchs, flatworms, snails and a variety of other pests. Especially in a large system, these can become very expensive and difficult to resolve outbreaks if not prevented from the onset. As Mr. Fish suggested, preventative dips are not always successful at completely eradicating pests. Isolating and quarantining offers time to observe, medicate and ensure they are as close to completely pest-free as possible as well as giving your animals time to adjust and recover from the stresses of shipping - just as important for corals and other invertebrates as it is for fish. As for dragonettes, it is quite a bit more difficult to feed them through a quarantine period than most fish...but still possible. The easiest way I have found is to have some sacrificial live rock rubble or clumps of Chaetomorpha sp. algae or the like sitting in the refugium ahead of time that you can then transfer over in to the quarantine system, complete with 'pods for the mandarins to eat. Their thick slime coat also does not usually respond well to copper, in my experience...the "tank-transfer" method is probably the best way to prevent ich/crypt for them. Personally, I err of the side of caution and isolate everything that goes in to my aquarium for three months in a quarantine system (I keep one for fish and one for invertebrates, as I use copper in the fish system). It's not inexpensive, it's more time-consuming and it certainly takes a lot more patience than just dropping new critters, coral or rock in to the main tank...but the years have just made it seem more and more worthwhile to me.

10/10/2012, 07:21 AM	#7
C4rN4gE Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 56	QT everything! You would lose more money by introducing a pathogen to your tank that decimates the livestock than you will running a QT setup. It doesnt have to be fancy.