new tank proposal? noob

[rotccapt]

hi all, i have been keeping fresh water fish for about 4 years now and have mostly been keeping cichlids. i have a 55 gallon peacock tank, 120 gallon mbana, and a 300 gallon sa/ca cichlid tank.

we have always wanted to do a reef tank but i have always though it was too much work so i just put it off.

so that brings you up to my current point. one of my buddies is going to sell me a 50 gallon pentagon style corner tank and i had a though of using it for my first ever dive into a reef tank. the tank measures 24sx24sx24t but i dont know the width from the back corner to the front

currently the tank is not drilled but since i will need to break it down and rebuild it do to a blown seam i plan on drilling it and adding a corner overflow so i can use a sump. my plan is to use t5 lights. for now i will be using water from my lfs because they have a water service until i can get a ro/di unit to make my own water.

i am hoping to have a 20 gallon sump for this tank

currently i have a ati master freshwater liquid test set for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, ph
i understand i will need either a hydrometer or a refractometer. which is better?

so the number one question is will this set up be a good one for my first tank? i have not decided what i want to keep yet i still need to do more research on that front but for now i am trying to decide it i should go with a reef or just stick with fresh water.

thanks in advance for your help

[BAGGERZ13]

I will let other more experienced members give you advice on everything else but your hydrometer situation. They are cheaper and will work of your budget is super tight like mine but a refractometer is the way to go. It is much more accurate then a hydrometer. One fact is because as you fill the hydrometer with water 9/10 times you get little air bubbles that stick to the needle and cause your salinity reading to be inaccurate. I use a hydrometer and it is such a pain in the butt to try and knock off all the air bubbles and sometimes I can't get them all so I will be switching to a refractometer as soon as my budget allows me too.

[rotccapt]

after a bit of looking a i thing i would like to try my hand at sps corals unless you think i should start with something else.

also a refractometer is on the list

[AZ_reefer]

Start off with the lps first. Set up your tank with a skimmer, and good circulation internally as well as the sump. You need T5, LED or metal halide lighting for that tank. Go with the live rock...at least 50-60lbs of fiji or equivalent, Florida live rock weighs more, so you will need more 75-100lbs. 1-2" sand bed for ease of maintenance for your first time.

Test kits. Ammo, Nitrite, Nitrate, phosphate, pH, dKH, Calcium for starters.

IME, odd shaped tanks cause odd dead spots with detritus build up. It can be done with your tank, but you my be off to a harder start than say a standard 40 gal breeder.

Read the forums a lot. Salt is so much more labor.

Learn about the cycle and the various algae blooms that will occur. Have a plan in place, and most important, be patient. Let the system stabilize.

Welcome....and good luck!

[Arc Drafter]

I could be wrong, but I would assume that fresh and saltwater test kits will be significantly different.

[rotccapt]

so i like zoos, Acan, plate

would these be good starters?

[rotccapt]

double post sorry

[accordsirh22]

the test kits are the same, the result charts are a teeny tiny slightly bit different. but you probably know which colors are good and which are bad by now.

zoos are good starters.
what kinds of plate? there are lots of plating things, chalices, montis, etc.
acans, i wouldnt start with those, i have never had good luck with them and they seem to be a little more sensitive.

def get the refractometer, they blow hydrometers out of the water, i will never use another hydro again.

[igadget56]

Do yourself a favor and don't use the API tests. To get started you will need 3 tests, Salifert or Red Sea are both very good tests. Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate for now. Then you can put some fish in, but go slow. Later you will need an alkalinity calcium and magnesium before putting in any coral. The reason why I won't use API I battled calcium for over a month and all I ever got was 360. Use the Red Sea and I was way off the charts. Messed me up for a couple months, good luck, it's fun you will enjoy it. Once all is said and done it is much easier than a freshwater tank.

[FTDelta]

I've been reading and researching to start up my first SW tank for 5 years now. I have yet have a tank up and running due to finances and currently saving what I can now. My goal is to finally get my "feet wet" in a couple years or so from now.

Now I can offer some of what I do know would help. Refractometer is a definite must have. Expensive but well worth it. IMO get the Milwaukee Seawater Digital Refractometer.

Protein Skimmer I'd run with the Reef Octopus brand. You can put it in your sump.

Sump - Go with the ProFlex Sump (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...2&pcatid=23752)
You can set it in three different methods : Berlin, Refugium, or Traditional

LEDs lighting are the rage but others choose MH. LEDs

Corals - Zoanthids are great beginner corals. Softies are great as well (Leathers, etc...) Others include: Frogspawn, Ricordias and Mushrooms, Candy Cane/Trumpet corals. You can find more at Liveaquaria.com.

I'm sure other experienced aquarists can offer more advice.

Oh yeah - invest in a book called The Conscientious Aquarist. It's well worth its weight in gold.

Welcome and I wish you the best in starting up your first Marine tank.

[jinks]

I would put mh over this tank. It has nothing to do with the quality of light put out and I'm not trying to open that can of worms again. It's the depth and shape of the tank. T5 bulbs are going to limit what you can put over this tank without it hanging over the sides. For pentagons and other odd shaped tanks light is harder to pull off. Mh work well for this because of the one small point the light comes from. Some LEDs could also work well for this if heat and electric is high on your list.

[accordsirh22]

gadget, were your tests out of date or maybe a bad batch? i have used the api ones for quite a while with no issues.

[rotccapt]

i have a standard 55 would this be a better beginner tank? also not drilled but i would add duel corner overflows to it

so can i start with corals or do i need to start with a few fish then add corals?

also so far i am liking the; Zoanthids, Candy Cane/Trumpet, orange plate.

one think i think would be cool would be one of those green/blue enenomies that are commonly found in pacific tied pools i have know idea what they are called tough

[jinks]

The 55 would open your lighting choices up a little bit. The down side to a 55 is they have a lot of height and not much width. This can make rock placement hard. Both tank will work just fine. Use the one you like best. Don't start off with anything in the tank. It will need to cycle first. I won't go into that as a quick search will give you more then you ever needed to know. Once that's done you can start adding fish and clean up crew. Add one fish at a time. Keeping a week or so between fish will let your tank keep up with the new bio load. After the tank has been cycled for a month or so you can start adding coral. Just start easy and work your way up.

[rotccapt]

ok i know about the nitrogen cycle with my fresh water tanks. i will stick with the pentagon. i will be picking it up tomorrow so i can see what all i need to do to it to make it usable. first step will be breaking it down and rebuilding it due to the popped seam.

i may look into led lighting i have done some research on that for other tanks so i have a bit of experience with that aspect of the hobby.

for this tank i was thinking i should have two powerheads inside the tank and my return pump. how much flow should i have from the powerheads and my return pump turnover?

[jinks]

For powerheads the 3 I would look at would be koralia, tunze, and Vortech. Two koralia750 would work and save a little money. Two tunze 6045 would give nice flow and they let you adjust yor flow a bit, but cost a little more. You could also grab an mp10. Costs the most but with built in wave making its a nice pump and will only run $50 more then the 6045, but $150 more then the koralias.

[rotccapt]

i think i will go with the koralia750's

so i found out my LFS/reef shop sells reef water for $1 a gallon and they also sell cured live rock for $6 a pound does that sound reasonable?

they also sell regular salt water too for the same price. what would be the difference between the two kinds of water?

i keep my house at around 75-80 year round do you think i will need a heater? i know they are cheep but i figured i should ask

also would adding the zoo's st the first coral be a good idea?

sorry for all the questions, i just want to get my head around this whole reef aquarium thing before dropping a lot of coin on it.

i will have the tank tomorrow and will post some pics for you guys before i start tearing it down.

[jinks]

I would just mix your own water but if you really don't want to the "reef water" would be made from a salt mix that has higher levels of things like calcium. They might even make s.g. A bit higher in this. If you look at a lot of salt brands they will sell two mixes. Red Sea has their normal salt and their coral pro. The coral pro has higher ALK, CAL, MG. If your not going to try and grow Stoney coral you don't really need it then again it won't really hurt. I would get the heaters. Set them to the lowest you want the tank at just to be safe. Some people like to let the temp swing others like to keep it level. Zoas are a good starting spot that will still look nice down the line. I have seen a lot of people buy coral because they are cheap and easy. Then they want them out because they are an ugly color and taking over. Anything that spreads will be hard to get out so make sure you want them long term.

[rotccapt]

my thoughts on the water is to buy the first fill then get an ro/di set up so i can do my own water change and top off water. the unit i am looking at is a 75 gallon/day unit so it would take me an entire day to get enough water to fill the tank for the first time. or do you think i should just get the ro/di unit and just let it fill a bucket then start my tank?

would this work for my needs?
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/brs-4-...tem-75gpd.html

thank you for you help!!!

[jinks]

If your going to buy a ro/di I would get it right from the start. It will save you money and having to haul heavy buckets. It also lets you know exactly what your putting in the tank. Pick a salt brand and stick with it. Most of the big names will work just fine. That unit would be a good buy, and really what's a day or two of filling buckets. I like to do every step myself and know what's going into my tank rather then spend more money to hope a store is doing it right.

[rotccapt]

That makes sense. The first fill would be half the cost of the unit. So since I will be buying most of my stock from the same store should I try to match there salinity

[jinks]

No just take your time acclimating them and they will be fine.

[rotccapt]

well i picked up the tank today and i think it will work out just fine. the actual size is, 45 gallons calculated based off the internal dimensions of the tank. after adding my overflow i think my tank will be about 40 gallons do you think this will still work for my first reef?

also that stand will go i do not like the elcheapo partial board stand and also there is not enough room for my sump in there.

here it is

[disc1]

Originally Posted by accordsirh22

the test kits are the same, the result charts are a teeny tiny slightly bit different.

That depends on the test. For some there is no difference. I think most nitrate tests go both ways for example. For some there is a huge difference. A freshwater alkalinity test isn't going to work out in saltwater at all for example. Best bet is to look at the kit itself. It will say somewhere whether it is appropriate for saltwater or freshwater or both.

[rotccapt]

well after looking at the tank some more i decided i want a bigger tank than 44 gallons. so i plan on using the glass from this tank to build a bigger pentagon tank that is about 65 gallons. i will use one of the long side panels and the two short front panels to build a plywood tank. this new tank will be 28"x28" for the long sides and the front will be 13"x22"x13" and a tank height of 23.625 inches and a water height of 22 inches