how much miracle mud do i need in my refugium

Reef junky 305 · 12/20/2012, 01:51 PM

hey wuss up everyone i cant figure out how much mud do i need in my refugium its a 175 bowfront with a 4" sand bed any help will be great i have to fill the tank tommorow and put my rock and corals in since they are picking up my 90 gall on saturday

sirreal63 · 12/20/2012, 03:34 PM

You need none. Do a search on Miracle Mud and you will discover it is mostly quartz, which is inert, and does nothing for your tank. It does have a slight iron content which can help macro algaes or sea grasses but other than the minimal iron content, there is no reason to use the product. It has been studied and doesn't even come from the ocean, it is basically garden soil. Save your money

reefgeezer · 12/20/2012, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirreal63

you need none. Do a search on miracle mud and you will discover it is mostly quartz, which is inert, and does nothing for your tank. It does have a slight iron content which can help macro algaes or sea grasses but other than the minimal iron content, there is no reason to use the product. It has been studied and doesn't even come from the ocean, it is basically garden soil. Save your money

+1

SchnitzelReef · 12/20/2012, 03:51 PM

I have miracle mud in my sump, and all my corals grow twice as fast and turn into gold.....it's a miracle!!!

jk

I do have miracle mud, but I feel it was a waste of money. I'm gunna suck out as much as I can, and just run a deep sand bed. Trust me, there is no miracle....other then the miracle that people will pay $100 for some dirt in a jar. Good luck

Sent from my iPhone

rtparty · 12/20/2012, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SchnitzelReef

I have miracle mud in my sump, and all my corals grow twice as fast and turn into gold.....it's a miracle!!!

jk

I do have miracle mud, but I feel it was a waste of money. I'm gunna suck out as much as I can, and just run a deep sand bed. Trust me, there is no miracle....other then the miracle that people will pay $100 for some dirt in a jar. Good luck

Sent from my iPhone

And a deep sand bed won't do anything either. Save your money and sump space

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

grcforce327 · 12/20/2012, 05:37 PM

Does this mean I should stop using kitty litter???

mastersonr · 12/20/2012, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rtparty

And a deep sand bed won't do anything either. Save your money and sump space

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

sounds it sounds like bare bottom is the way to go in a refugium now correct? What about having some live rock or rubble and a few critters? Any benefit to having those. Or just go with some macroalgae and nothing else?

cherubfish pair · 12/20/2012, 09:52 PM

So is all refugium mud worthless or is some brands of it okay?

tkeracer619 · 12/20/2012, 10:28 PM

Won't help or hurt.

No need for a DSB either and they seem to be phasing out in popularity. If you want to do a DSB do it remotely so when it gets loaded you can dump it out and start over.

It is very difficult to have a proper DSB survive for years on end. Often they crash the tank because the reefer unknowingly relied on it to correct their poor husbandry.

cherubfish pair · 12/20/2012, 10:58 PM

I'm just talking about an 18 inch cpr aquafuge for raising worms, micro stars, scavangers, etc, etc.

tmz · 12/20/2012, 11:29 PM

I don't use any mud an think it can be a problem,particularly under macraoalge.
A macro algae barebottom fudge is fine . A cryptic( dark) live rock fudge is fine too. Shallow sand beds are fine in display taks if you like the beachy look. The sand does give you extra surface area for bacteria to grow on but most of the denitrification in sand beds occurs in the first half inch or so. If you have enough live rock or other surface areas in the system ,bare bottom is fine too. Deep sand is useful for animals that need it, such as certain anemones, jawfish and wrasses. You can construct sand pools for these or keep a deep bed in the tank.

SchnitzelReef · 12/22/2012, 11:59 PM

Ya I would throw extra live rock in the fuge, can't have too much live rock. I would stay away from rock rubble, they're more of a detritus trap then they're worth. And I guess the whole DSB and mud are the same, Trap for detritus

Sent from my iPhone

moondoggy4 · 12/23/2012, 12:26 PM

Next you are going say that Santa isn't real.

r-balljunkie · 12/28/2012, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moondoggy4

Next you are going say that Santa isn't real.

***? bubble buster!

wayne in norway · 12/28/2012, 06:10 AM

There are some rather sweeping statements above!

But I have found Caulerpa to be a fine way to export nutrient and it grows very fast when it has some sediment to work with compared to a bare bottom enviroment. That can be a silty substrate, or a shallow layer of fine sand. I found algae on top of a DSB to be a nuisance to maintain, as the algae slows the water velocity responsible for most of the waste water transport in an out of the sand bed.

h2hiero · 04/08/2013, 03:03 PM

how is everyone on here saying the miracle mud does not work when they have done little to no research besides on this forum NOR tried it for themselves. They are very upfront with what they say is in it and for any substrate and macro algae to work efficiently you need a big enough surface area in your sump for it vs your dt. every person that has used it on here has not said anything negative about it. those who use and are not 100% pleased with it are not following the guidelines of the product or have way to small of a Refugium surface area to even matter in the first place.

12/20/2012, 01:51 PM	#1
Reef junky 305 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 61	how much miracle mud do i need in my refugium hey wuss up everyone i cant figure out how much mud do i need in my refugium its a 175 bowfront with a 4" sand bed any help will be great i have to fill the tank tommorow and put my rock and corals in since they are picking up my 90 gall on saturday

12/20/2012, 03:34 PM	#2
sirreal63 Go Spurs Go!!! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Meadowlakes Texas Posts: 13,357	You need none. Do a search on Miracle Mud and you will discover it is mostly quartz, which is inert, and does nothing for your tank. It does have a slight iron content which can help macro algaes or sea grasses but other than the minimal iron content, there is no reason to use the product. It has been studied and doesn't even come from the ocean, it is basically garden soil. Save your money __________________ Jack No One has ever been seriously injured by using the search function. Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms should be a convenience store, not a government agency. Current Tank Info: Reefing the Pentagon.

12/20/2012, 09:52 PM	#8
cherubfish pair Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Libby, Montana Posts: 7,061 Blog Entries: 1	So is all refugium mud worthless or is some brands of it okay? __________________ pairo chero Thanks for looking at my build thread and subscribe to it if you already haven't yet! Current Tank Info: thirty rimless

12/20/2012, 10:28 PM	#9
tkeracer619 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 17,289	Won't help or hurt. No need for a DSB either and they seem to be phasing out in popularity. If you want to do a DSB do it remotely so when it gets loaded you can dump it out and start over. It is very difficult to have a proper DSB survive for years on end. Often they crash the tank because the reefer unknowingly relied on it to correct their poor husbandry. __________________ Hobby Experience: 9200ish gallons, 26 skimmers, and a handful of Kent Scrapers. Current Tank: Vortech Powered 600G SPS Tank w/ 100gal frag tank & 100g Sump. RK2-RK10 Skimmer. ReefAngel. Radium 20k.

12/20/2012, 10:58 PM	#10
cherubfish pair Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Libby, Montana Posts: 7,061 Blog Entries: 1	I'm just talking about an 18 inch cpr aquafuge for raising worms, micro stars, scavangers, etc, etc. __________________ pairo chero Thanks for looking at my build thread and subscribe to it if you already haven't yet! Current Tank Info: thirty rimless

12/20/2012, 03:51 PM	#4
SchnitzelReef Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Southern California Posts: 2,569	I have miracle mud in my sump, and all my corals grow twice as fast and turn into gold.....it's a miracle!!! jk I do have miracle mud, but I feel it was a waste of money. I'm gunna suck out as much as I can, and just run a deep sand bed. Trust me, there is no miracle....other then the miracle that people will pay $100 for some dirt in a jar. Good luck Sent from my iPhone

12/20/2012, 05:37 PM	#6
grcforce327 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 395	Does this mean I should stop using kitty litter???

12/20/2012, 11:29 PM	#11
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	I don't use any mud an think it can be a problem,particularly under macraoalge. A macro algae barebottom fudge is fine . A cryptic( dark) live rock fudge is fine too. Shallow sand beds are fine in display taks if you like the beachy look. The sand does give you extra surface area for bacteria to grow on but most of the denitrification in sand beds occurs in the first half inch or so. If you have enough live rock or other surface areas in the system ,bare bottom is fine too. Deep sand is useful for animals that need it, such as certain anemones, jawfish and wrasses. You can construct sand pools for these or keep a deep bed in the tank. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

12/22/2012, 11:59 PM	#12
SchnitzelReef Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Southern California Posts: 2,569	Ya I would throw extra live rock in the fuge, can't have too much live rock. I would stay away from rock rubble, they're more of a detritus trap then they're worth. And I guess the whole DSB and mud are the same, Trap for detritus Sent from my iPhone

12/23/2012, 12:26 PM	#13
moondoggy4 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: menifee So cal Posts: 11,042	Next you are going say that Santa isn't real.

12/28/2012, 06:10 AM	#15
wayne in norway Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Stavanger, Norway Posts: 1,271	There are some rather sweeping statements above! But I have found Caulerpa to be a fine way to export nutrient and it grows very fast when it has some sediment to work with compared to a bare bottom enviroment. That can be a silty substrate, or a shallow layer of fine sand. I found algae on top of a DSB to be a nuisance to maintain, as the algae slows the water velocity responsible for most of the waste water transport in an out of the sand bed.

04/08/2013, 03:03 PM	#16
h2hiero Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 63	how is everyone on here saying the miracle mud does not work when they have done little to no research besides on this forum NOR tried it for themselves. They are very upfront with what they say is in it and for any substrate and macro algae to work efficiently you need a big enough surface area in your sump for it vs your dt. every person that has used it on here has not said anything negative about it. those who use and are not 100% pleased with it are not following the guidelines of the product or have way to small of a Refugium surface area to even matter in the first place.