Salt water tank virgin gone wrong

Jtweedie34 · 08/14/2013, 06:11 PM

I have a 55 gallon aquarium that I have for over a 10 years. I recently converted from fresh water to salt water,following the instructions of my local fish store and the conversion went smoothly. I waited two days for the cloudy water to clear. Before fish were purchased, I brought some water to my local fish store and had it tested. Every test result was in the normal range for a new aquarium. So five small fish were purchased along with 25 lbs of live rock. Two clownfish,and to sound like a real beginner, three small light blue silvery fish. Everything was fine for two days, until I came home from work today to find all five dead! I first checked the salt levels which was perfect. I then brought the bodies along with a cup of the tank water to my fish store. Surprise, surprise all the testing on the tank water all showed normal tank levels. My pet store sent me home with a black damsel and it died within 15 minutes of being in my tank. Could even revive him in the water that he came in. Anyone have anything similar happen to them? Maybe have any advice on what my next step should be?

acabgd · 08/14/2013, 06:33 PM

Did you dose any medication to the tank while you've had the fresh water setup? Saying that "all tests showed normal levels" is not good enough. What are your ammonia and nitrate levels? What about salinity, what is "perfect"?
How much LR do you have, how did you cycle your tank?

If you say that you waited 2 days "for the cloudy water to clear" and then purchased fish, I would say your tank is nowhere near cycled. Ammonia levels probably shot through the roof and killed all your fish.

I would recommend reading the stickies on top of this forum, especially this one:
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2322088

Best of luck.

browning_boy20 · 08/14/2013, 06:40 PM

You need to do ALOT of reading. You can't trust your lfs, they will tell you anything. As I have heard many times, nothing good happens fast in saltwater aquariums.

Dissy · 08/14/2013, 06:42 PM

It sounds like you waited 2 days and then put live rock and all 5 fish in at the same time. If that's the case, how did you cycle your tank?

And what exactly did your lfs tell you are "normal levels for a new tank"?

BlindZide · 08/14/2013, 07:11 PM

Its totally normal to give me all of the money in your bank account now! J/K. It sounds like fish life was lost due to your cycle starting. When the cycle starts, ammonia will sky rocket to deadly levels. This is probably what killed them. Test your own water and wait another 2-4 weeks until you put in your CuC. Read stickies for info on your cycle and what to look for.

Jtweedie34 · 08/14/2013, 08:22 PM

I just bought a test kit. Levels are as follows: high range ph is 8.0, ammonia is greater than 0 less than .25ppm ,nitrite .50ppm, nitrate 0 ppm. Salinity is 1.023. Under the advisement of lfs is the only reason I put fish in the tank so quickly. He said it would help cycle the tank. I haven't used any medication in a few years when it was a fresh water tank. My lfs said my levels were fine to support fish

Lynxone · 08/14/2013, 08:35 PM

Your lfs isn't helping you much with the exception of thinning your wallet. Any detectable ammonia and nitrites is deadly to most fish. It takes quite some time for a new tank to cycle. Check out the stickies here on the website for detailed info on cycling your tank. Take a step back and do a little reading. Post a few questions here and you'll find a lot of knowledgable people that will help you do it right.

And don't be discouraged, there's a lot of local fish stores that seem to be more interested in a sale then the long term success of your aquarium. The people here aren't in it to make money from you and will therefore give you straight answers.

CKI · 08/14/2013, 08:40 PM

I waited 2 weeks before i purchased any fish ... then upon reading on here i knew i shouldnt have...(i didnt know any better), knock on wood the only fish i have lost was my tang which was due to disease anyway well after the tank cycled...Read the stickies on here before moving forward, they can be a real life saver!

Sn8kbyt · 08/14/2013, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jtweedie34

Maybe have any advice on what my next step should be?

I would rob that LFS and retrieve all the money you paid them, and then set it on fire.

I just can't believe that in this day and age of internet purchasing and how fast word gets around from any keyboard that any LFS wouldn't be more proactive in trying to stay competitive.

Travis Rohrbach · 08/15/2013, 12:35 AM

Take everything that lfs has to say with a grain of salt

robotman · 08/15/2013, 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jtweedie34

I have a 55 gallon aquarium that I have for over a 10 years. I recently converted from fresh water to salt water,following the instructions of my local fish store and the conversion went smoothly. I waited two days for the cloudy water to clear. Before fish were purchased, I brought some water to my local fish store and had it tested. Every test result was in the normal range for a new aquarium. So five small fish were purchased along with 25 lbs of live rock. Two clownfish,and to sound like a real beginner, three small light blue silvery fish. Everything was fine for two days, until I came home from work today to find all five dead! I first checked the salt levels which was perfect. I then brought the bodies along with a cup of the tank water to my fish store. Surprise, surprise all the testing on the tank water all showed normal tank levels. My pet store sent me home with a black damsel and it died within 15 minutes of being in my tank. Could even revive him in the water that he came in. Anyone have anything similar happen to them? Maybe have any advice on what my next step should be?

did you scrub and clean that tank over and over? and not with soap?

plus what kind of filtration system are you running, and you put the live rock in with the fish?

, 5 is way to many if they are small starting off if you dont know your levels.

BlindZide · 08/15/2013, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jtweedie34

I just bought a test kit. Levels are as follows: high range ph is 8.0, ammonia is greater than 0 less than .25ppm ,nitrite .50ppm, nitrate 0 ppm. Salinity is 1.023.

The Nitrite at .50ppm and Nitrate at 0ppm lets me know that your tank spiked ammonia recently and again that is what probably killed the fish. The cycle goes like this Ammonia - Nitrite - Nitrate. So your next step will see Nitrite drop to 0 and Nitrate spike high as the cycle completes.

Never cycle a tank with a fish. It doesn't help anything and all it does is waste your money and it is cruel to the fish. Ghost feeding is a good way to keep active in your tank and help create the bacteria needed to hold fish.

fishgate · 08/15/2013, 05:58 AM

"Converted"?? How exactly did they tell you to do this? My guess is you just dumped in salt and bought a powerhead to mix it in-tank. The correct way would have been to totally break down the old tank, clean it, discard almost everything and start from scratch with new substrate and RO/DI water.

FTDelta · 08/15/2013, 06:22 AM

Sounds like he rushed into setting up his first SW tank at the expense of his LFS's greed.

Chen1009 · 08/15/2013, 08:06 AM

Beginner here as well. Internet is your new best friend

for acquiring knowledge.
I would stop putting any live stocks in (duh..) and let the tank cycle. Also 25 lbs of LR in a 55G tank doesn't seem to be enough. If budget allows buy more, if not buy more base/dry rocks (cheaper)? Any sand in the tank?

premilove · 08/15/2013, 08:27 AM

there is no way you finished your cycle and your test results prove it. go to your lfs and demand all your money back. it's easy to say that your cycle is finished and sell you fish. they robbed you!

Sosa29Reef · 08/15/2013, 08:51 AM

Patience is a virtue....

Leave your tank alone for a few days/weeks if you can dont even look at it lol...

Sounds like your LFS got you for a quick $40, you rushed it...

faithenfire · 08/15/2013, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sosa29Reef

Patience is a virtue....

Leave your tank alone for a few days/weeks if you can dont even look at it lol...

Sounds like your LFS got you for a quick $40, you rushed it...

Yup

Welcome to the hobby

It sounds like your tank is still cycling. I would get a tank sponsor. It makes life easier. Mine is at my local fish store but I also asked a lot of questions to make sure that he knew what he was talking about.
All fish stores aren't bad, and it depends on the individual employee too. You can also see if you can find a local enthusiast group. They will be a local source of info and supplies.
but it's going to be ok. You asked for help and that is the first step into learning how to care for your little bit of ocean

uwish · 08/15/2013, 01:43 PM

Tank cycling is usually a very long process, you could use a bottle nitrifying bacteria if you want to add 'a fish or two' but you can't rush the cycle much. When you do in almost every case it will yield fish casualties.

I started my 250G with Dr Tim's one and only nitrifying bacteria, and it worked flawlessly.

Jtweedie34 · 08/15/2013, 04:25 PM

I drained the freshwater tank down completely. Removed all components, and scrubbed the tank down with new terry clothes and water only. Then rinsed the tank out with a hose and dried it with paper towels. It then sat for a week. Before I started with the new setup I cleaned the tank again. Next I rinsed and rinsed my 40lbs of crushed coral and then added to tank. Set up my aqua top cf 400-uv filter, and began to fill the tank with water. While it was filling I measured out the amount of instant ocean salt needed. Once the tank was 3/4 full I added the salt and stirred it with a new power head tube. Also I added tap water conditioner and ammonia detoxifier. Then filled the tank up the rest of the way and turned the filter on. Is there any thing I might of done wrong there?

acabgd · 08/15/2013, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jtweedie34

Is there any thing I might of done wrong there?

Two things are definitely wrong here (actually three but I won't correct your grammar).

- Using tap water is usually not recommended for the very simple reason that you have no idea what's in it. It is also usually not consistent, depending on droughts, rainfall or chemicals used by your water company. Some people have excellent tap water, some have very bad tap water and you can't really know unless you test it - which I suppose you didn't do. Another thing with tap water and saltwater tanks is a possible presence of trace amounts of copper (from piping), which can kill your inhabitants. Anyway, RO/DI is the most recommended way to go, it's cheap, it's in your house and you can make your own clean water. Using RO/DI you know what kind of water you pour into your tank.

- Usually (if using tap water, which is not recommended) you should add tap water conditioner before mixing salt. I also don't understand why you've used ammonia remover, as it kills your cycle completely. You need to have a source of ammonia in order to cycle your tank. Some people put a raw shrimp in their tank and let it dissolve (or at least rot to a certain point) in order to add/create ammonia in their tanks to jump start the cycle. You can skip this part only if you have extremely fresh and quality live rock delivered to you straight from the holding bins, but usually this is not the case. Hence, you need ammonia for bacteria to start the cycle, breaking down ammonia into nitrite, then nitrate.

I hope you've read the stickies in the meantime?

Spyderturbo007 · 08/16/2013, 01:47 PM

You need to either purchase RO/DI water, or purchase an RO/DI unit. With a 55g tank, I'm going to suggest purchasing an RO/DI unit. Using tap water is going to make your life exponentially harder and you'll never be able to nail down any problems that surface.

With a saltwater tank, you shouldn't ever need any type of water conditioner or ammonia detoxifier. You'll want to keep a bottle of ammonia detoxifier on hand for emergencies, like a mass die off or something of that nature, but it's just for emergencies.

What is in the tank currently? Is it just the sand and water? If so, I would drain the tank and wash the sand. Then fill with RO/DI and mix up your salt. Then add your washed sand and any rock that you would like to use. Grab a raw shrimp from your deli counter and toss it in the tank. Then grab a beer and relax, because you're in for quite a wait while the miracle of a biological filter is established.

ghst1203reef · 08/16/2013, 02:39 PM

Wouldn't distilled water work too? That's what I used and my tank cycled just fine.

Brianmil7516 · 08/16/2013, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghst1203reef

Wouldn't distilled water work too? That's what I used and my tank cycled just fine.

Distilled water would be fine. however.. in the long run it will cost more than an RO/DI unit and TDS meter.. plus no more loading your car up with gallon jugs

ghst1203reef · 08/16/2013, 06:22 PM

yea I'm just saying for his first fill and to start it cycling then he can see what he wants to do after that.

08/14/2013, 06:11 PM	#1
Jtweedie34 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Chicago Posts: 4	Salt water tank virgin gone wrong I have a 55 gallon aquarium that I have for over a 10 years. I recently converted from fresh water to salt water,following the instructions of my local fish store and the conversion went smoothly. I waited two days for the cloudy water to clear. Before fish were purchased, I brought some water to my local fish store and had it tested. Every test result was in the normal range for a new aquarium. So five small fish were purchased along with 25 lbs of live rock. Two clownfish,and to sound like a real beginner, three small light blue silvery fish. Everything was fine for two days, until I came home from work today to find all five dead! I first checked the salt levels which was perfect. I then brought the bodies along with a cup of the tank water to my fish store. Surprise, surprise all the testing on the tank water all showed normal tank levels. My pet store sent me home with a black damsel and it died within 15 minutes of being in my tank. Could even revive him in the water that he came in. Anyone have anything similar happen to them? Maybe have any advice on what my next step should be?

08/14/2013, 07:11 PM	#5
BlindZide Registered Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 1,273	Its totally normal to give me all of the money in your bank account now! J/K. It sounds like fish life was lost due to your cycle starting. When the cycle starts, ammonia will sky rocket to deadly levels. This is probably what killed them. Test your own water and wait another 2-4 weeks until you put in your CuC. Read stickies for info on your cycle and what to look for. __________________ ~Trent Biocube 14 Mixed Reef 75G LPS Reef

08/14/2013, 08:40 PM	#8
CKI Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Delaware Posts: 281	I waited 2 weeks before i purchased any fish ... then upon reading on here i knew i shouldnt have...(i didnt know any better), knock on wood the only fish i have lost was my tang which was due to disease anyway well after the tank cycled...Read the stickies on here before moving forward, they can be a real life saver! __________________ _____________________________ 75Gal - 30 gal sump - Coralife T5's - Eshopps overflow - PSK-150-Triton Deep Blue

08/15/2013, 05:58 AM	#13
fishgate Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Damascus, MD Posts: 3,340	"Converted"?? How exactly did they tell you to do this? My guess is you just dumped in salt and bought a powerhead to mix it in-tank. The correct way would have been to totally break down the old tank, clean it, discard almost everything and start from scratch with new substrate and RO/DI water. __________________ 125RR in-wall, 40B Sump, CS180 BM Skimmer, ATI 4x80 watt, eheim 1262, custom wrap around rock wall, ReefKeeper Elite 120g in-wall, 40B Sump, PC 54wx4, Jabao DC-6000 (full siphon), future seahorse t Current Tank Info: 125g, 120g, 2x40b sumps, ATI 4x80 T5HO

08/15/2013, 01:43 PM	#19
uwish Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Calgary, Alberta Posts: 131	Tank cycling is usually a very long process, you could use a bottle nitrifying bacteria if you want to add 'a fish or two' but you can't rush the cycle much. When you do in almost every case it will yield fish casualties. I started my 250G with Dr Tim's one and only nitrifying bacteria, and it worked flawlessly. __________________ 130 Gal Planted freshwater tank 250 Gal FOWLR predator Peninsula tank __________________________________ RCAF Veteran (10 years) Current Tank Info: 130 Gal planted community and 250Gal FOWLR..

08/14/2013, 06:33 PM	#2
acabgd Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Belgrade Posts: 1,086	Did you dose any medication to the tank while you've had the fresh water setup? Saying that "all tests showed normal levels" is not good enough. What are your ammonia and nitrate levels? What about salinity, what is "perfect"? How much LR do you have, how did you cycle your tank? If you say that you waited 2 days "for the cloudy water to clear" and then purchased fish, I would say your tank is nowhere near cycled. Ammonia levels probably shot through the roof and killed all your fish. I would recommend reading the stickies on top of this forum, especially this one: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2322088 Best of luck.

08/14/2013, 06:40 PM	#3
browning_boy20 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Mobile, AL Posts: 425	You need to do ALOT of reading. You can't trust your lfs, they will tell you anything. As I have heard many times, nothing good happens fast in saltwater aquariums.

08/14/2013, 06:42 PM	#4
Dissy Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 257	It sounds like you waited 2 days and then put live rock and all 5 fish in at the same time. If that's the case, how did you cycle your tank? And what exactly did your lfs tell you are "normal levels for a new tank"?

08/14/2013, 08:22 PM	#6
Jtweedie34 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Chicago Posts: 4	I just bought a test kit. Levels are as follows: high range ph is 8.0, ammonia is greater than 0 less than .25ppm ,nitrite .50ppm, nitrate 0 ppm. Salinity is 1.023. Under the advisement of lfs is the only reason I put fish in the tank so quickly. He said it would help cycle the tank. I haven't used any medication in a few years when it was a fresh water tank. My lfs said my levels were fine to support fish

08/14/2013, 08:35 PM	#7
Lynxone Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 251	Your lfs isn't helping you much with the exception of thinning your wallet. Any detectable ammonia and nitrites is deadly to most fish. It takes quite some time for a new tank to cycle. Check out the stickies here on the website for detailed info on cycling your tank. Take a step back and do a little reading. Post a few questions here and you'll find a lot of knowledgable people that will help you do it right. And don't be discouraged, there's a lot of local fish stores that seem to be more interested in a sale then the long term success of your aquarium. The people here aren't in it to make money from you and will therefore give you straight answers.

08/15/2013, 12:35 AM	#10
Travis Rohrbach Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Wapakoneta, OH Posts: 111	Take everything that lfs has to say with a grain of salt

08/15/2013, 06:22 AM	#14
FTDelta Moved On Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Central NY Posts: 1,124	Sounds like he rushed into setting up his first SW tank at the expense of his LFS's greed.

08/15/2013, 08:06 AM	#15
Chen1009 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 31	Beginner here as well. Internet is your new best friend for acquiring knowledge. I would stop putting any live stocks in (duh..) and let the tank cycle. Also 25 lbs of LR in a 55G tank doesn't seem to be enough. If budget allows buy more, if not buy more base/dry rocks (cheaper)? Any sand in the tank?

08/15/2013, 08:27 AM	#16
premilove The Empire Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Central Jersey Posts: 776	there is no way you finished your cycle and your test results prove it. go to your lfs and demand all your money back. it's easy to say that your cycle is finished and sell you fish. they robbed you!

08/15/2013, 08:51 AM	#17
Sosa29Reef Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Miami FL Posts: 55	Patience is a virtue.... Leave your tank alone for a few days/weeks if you can dont even look at it lol... Sounds like your LFS got you for a quick $40, you rushed it...

08/15/2013, 04:25 PM	#20
Jtweedie34 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Chicago Posts: 4	I drained the freshwater tank down completely. Removed all components, and scrubbed the tank down with new terry clothes and water only. Then rinsed the tank out with a hose and dried it with paper towels. It then sat for a week. Before I started with the new setup I cleaned the tank again. Next I rinsed and rinsed my 40lbs of crushed coral and then added to tank. Set up my aqua top cf 400-uv filter, and began to fill the tank with water. While it was filling I measured out the amount of instant ocean salt needed. Once the tank was 3/4 full I added the salt and stirred it with a new power head tube. Also I added tap water conditioner and ammonia detoxifier. Then filled the tank up the rest of the way and turned the filter on. Is there any thing I might of done wrong there?

08/16/2013, 01:47 PM	#22
Spyderturbo007 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: PA Posts: 2,564	You need to either purchase RO/DI water, or purchase an RO/DI unit. With a 55g tank, I'm going to suggest purchasing an RO/DI unit. Using tap water is going to make your life exponentially harder and you'll never be able to nail down any problems that surface. With a saltwater tank, you shouldn't ever need any type of water conditioner or ammonia detoxifier. You'll want to keep a bottle of ammonia detoxifier on hand for emergencies, like a mass die off or something of that nature, but it's just for emergencies. What is in the tank currently? Is it just the sand and water? If so, I would drain the tank and wash the sand. Then fill with RO/DI and mix up your salt. Then add your washed sand and any rock that you would like to use. Grab a raw shrimp from your deli counter and toss it in the tank. Then grab a beer and relax, because you're in for quite a wait while the miracle of a biological filter is established.

08/16/2013, 02:39 PM	#23
ghst1203reef Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: El Paso TX Posts: 127	Wouldn't distilled water work too? That's what I used and my tank cycled just fine.

08/16/2013, 06:22 PM	#25
ghst1203reef Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: El Paso TX Posts: 127	yea I'm just saying for his first fill and to start it cycling then he can see what he wants to do after that.