I think I just made a big mistake...

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 05:27 PM

Well...I am in the process of setting up my 125g in-wall build. I got the stand built, set the tank, got the rock, set the rock, added sand...and then...filled with tap water

The tap water has now been in the tank with the pump running for 2 days (this is day 2). I'm not sure what I was thinking, I obviously wasn't as I had two buddies over helping me and perhaps drinking a few or more beers while setting up a tank wasn't quite such a good idea lol.

Anyways, my question is....do I drain the tank (still haven't figured out how I am going to do that...or has the damage been done? From what I have read the rock will absorb the nitrates, phosphates and other nasties in tap water.

I do have a BRS 4-stage RODI which makes my mistake even worse as I could have just used that to fill the tank...

Anyways, any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Dmorty217 · 05/19/2014, 05:33 PM

You should drain the tank but you could also get water conditioner and that will take care of heavy metals in the water but you should do a substantial water change, like 50% a few wks into the cycle and then a few more before putting corals into the tank for sure. Hookup your RO and get it running, you will have some evap with a 125g

Sk8r · 05/19/2014, 05:37 PM

Your rock and sand have enough of their own, and will not absorb it that much from the water. You could drain and start over, no big deal at this point, and it will probably save you some fuss and time later...city water often has a lot. But so do rock and sand on their own, depending on where they originated. It'll never be easier to export a big lot of it...

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 06:04 PM

Well this makes me feel a bit better. I did manage to drain about 90-100g out of the tank, and am busy re-filling it with the RODI water as we speak. Hopefully, that will dillute it out enough to not make it as bad.

Now, to wait for it to fill, mix the salt tomorrow and hope for the best!

MinnFish · 05/19/2014, 06:12 PM

Hold on. You need to mix the salt with the RO/DI before adding to tank. If not, some of the salt will not dissolve. I hope you read this before you have gone too far.

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MinnFish

Hold on. You need to mix the salt with the RO/DI before adding to tank. If not, some of the salt will not dissolve. I hope you read this before you have gone too far.

Thanks for the tip! I wasn't aware that it wouldn't all mix directly in the tank? Considering the tank is filling at only 75gpd and the salt is arriving tomorrow, I still have plenty of time tomorrow to mix the tank into the final 25-50g or so and add it from there.

I hope this is only a rough start for me and not a long list of things that will continue to go wrong...

MinnFish · 05/19/2014, 06:49 PM

You have just joined an exclusive club. We all have membership here and accept new members daily. Its called "The mistakes I made" club. I made another one yesterday. Did a water change without turning the ATO off. Humm, how that happen (I have changed more water than diapers)

.
Anyway, the process for mixing saltwater should be. You add the correct amount of salt to your RO/DI. Mix (with powerhead) for 24 hrs and if needed add heater to bring water up to temp. If your home is rather warm, room temp will be fine. Test water for proper salinity before adding to tank. Good luck.
One question. Are you using live rock or dry?

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MinnFish

You have just joined an exclusive club. We all have membership here and accept new members daily. Its called "The mistakes I made" club. I made another one yesterday. Did a water change without turning the ATO off. Humm, how that happen (I have changed more water than diapers)

.
Anyway, the process for mixing saltwater should be. You add the correct amount of salt to your RO/DI. Mix (with powerhead) for 24 hrs and if needed add heater to bring water up to temp. If your home is rather warm, room temp will be fine. Test water for proper salinity before adding to tank. Good luck.
One question. Are you using live rock or dry?

I am using dry rock from reefrocks.net. As for the mixing of salt, my container only holds 30g at a time, so I think I will have to slowly dissolve the salt in my tank over a period of a few days to slowly bring it to the proper salinity. With the pumps and powerheads moving the water around, I hope this will be enough to properly mix the water. I will have a seperate mixing container for water changes setup in the future, but that is on my list of things to complete while the tank is cycling.

shifty51008 · 05/19/2014, 07:18 PM

You can mix the salt in the tank after its filled and just run the pumps for 24 hours before checking the salinity. After you have rock and sand in the tank then mix it outside the tank.

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 07:49 PM

Maybe a stupid question....but why can't you have the rock and sand in the tank before you add the salt?

JayDeePee · 05/19/2014, 07:56 PM

It won't mix properly. A portion of the salt will sit on the sandbed and you will not be able to stir it up without mixing the sand also. I've done it before in a bare tank and I can confirm doing it with sand would not be optimal. In my 120 I mixed with nothing in it but all my circulation pumps. Every couple of hours there would be a new salt sediment area I would need to stir up.

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 08:00 PM

What about mixing it in the sump?

JayDeePee · 05/19/2014, 08:26 PM

You could do that but you would want to mix for about 2 hours each batch. How many times would you need to cycle this sump to fill your display tank? It's much easier to get another mixing can even just for this one time.

inetmug · 05/19/2014, 08:35 PM

I would put some of the new startup solutions out there that are meant to cycle tap water. They remove chlorine, and ammonia.

Many a tank has been set up that way. Let that cycle, then suck as much out as you can, including the sump, get yourself some gray brute cans (food safe), and then make up your RO/DI. Mix the salt in these cans using a transfer pump (but not one with oil on or it it in a sealed motor configuration, make sure oil-less). The RO/DI units take a long time to make water unless you get a big one. Consider buying the first load from the LFS?

Then, once you get it set, check the salinity, and bring it up to spec using small amounts of water mixed with large amounts of salt in a separate bucket. This will give you a concentrated salt solution in the small bucket. Add this to the sump slowly as needed. Once you get it at the right salinity, then let that cycle, doing water changes as suggested.

So I tank it this was all dead rock, and dead sand? I hope so, otherwise you got some issues new issues...

It all depends upon you local water supply how bad that tap water it.

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 08:40 PM

Yes, dead rock and dead sand. Man, I really made this more difficult than it had to be...twice. Gah...frustrated already lol.

inetmug · 05/19/2014, 08:53 PM

As poiinted out, no worries. I gomered on my 250G setup due to wrong leveling. I jacked it all out, fixed it, and it should be just fine. Just make sure you give it lots of time to settle out before you introduce critters, and test it. After 30-45 days you should be ready to start the cycle.

I have seen the "dead shrimp" method, where you put a dead shrimp in a hang tank. Sacrificial fish, and quick starts like live sand seeding, and combinations. Interesting hobby.

MinnFish · 05/19/2014, 08:56 PM

Do you have a LFS near that sells saltwater?

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inetmug

As poiinted out, no worries. I gomered on my 250G setup due to wrong leveling. I jacked it all out, fixed it, and it should be just fine. Just make sure you give it lots of time to settle out before you introduce critters, and test it. After 30-45 days you should be ready to start the cycle.

I have seen the "dead shrimp" method, where you put a dead shrimp in a hang tank. Sacrificial fish, and quick starts like live sand seeding, and combinations. Interesting hobby.

Well hopefully, I got "most" of the tap water out (save 25g or so), and am now refilling, so I am hoping the fallout won't be too bad.

My second oops was adding the rock and sand before the salt, so now I have to figure out a way to mix the salt outside of the tank and add it - though as mentioned above looks like I just need to get a few large mixing barrels and work from there.

I assume once I have the salinity and temperature right in the next few days, I am safe to start the cycle on the tank?

Kyle918 · 05/19/2014, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyProndoa

Yes, dead rock and dead sand. Man, I really made this more difficult than it had to be...twice. Gah...frustrated already lol.

Yea. It's a good to learn earlier in the game though. Take your time and plan your actions methodically.

How much sand do you have in there and rocks do you have in there? It may be less work overall to remove everything from the tank, let it fill one time with RO/DI water, then add salt and let it mix for a few days. After the salt is completely mixed, you can reintroduce the rock and sand.

I did this process for my 75 and agree that the salt does settle in such a large tank; in hindsight, I could have added a spare maxi-jet I have to help with the mixing process but in the end, it worked just as well. The only annoyance with the process was arranging my rock again after having it just as I wanted on the floor. It did come out awesome though nonetheless.

RockyProndoa · 05/19/2014, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle918

Yea. It's a good to learn earlier in the game though. Take your time and plan your actions methodically.

How much sand do you have in there and rocks do you have in there? It may be less work overall to remove everything from the tank, let it fill one time with RO/DI water, then add salt and let it mix for a few days. After the salt is completely mixed, you can reintroduce the rock and sand.

I did this process for my 75 and agree that the salt does settle in such a large tank; in hindsight, I could have added a spare maxi-jet I have to help with the mixing process but in the end, it worked just as well. The only annoyance with the process was arranging my rock again after having it just as I wanted on the floor. It did come out awesome though nonetheless.

You are braver than me! I have about 100lbs of rock and almost 80lbs of sand in there at the moment...I think I will leave well enough alone.

I think my best bet is to simply utilize the c2c overflow I have. Small amounts of salt in there over a few days time with pumps and powerheads running should circulate enough to keep it from settling out, especially if I add it in small enough quantities at a time.

Now...I have to go look at mixing stations since apparently after a year of research I still missed some important steps in the beginning!

05/19/2014, 05:27 PM	#1
RockyProndoa Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 204	I think I just made a big mistake... Well...I am in the process of setting up my 125g in-wall build. I got the stand built, set the tank, got the rock, set the rock, added sand...and then...filled with tap water The tap water has now been in the tank with the pump running for 2 days (this is day 2). I'm not sure what I was thinking, I obviously wasn't as I had two buddies over helping me and perhaps drinking a few or more beers while setting up a tank wasn't quite such a good idea lol. Anyways, my question is....do I drain the tank (still haven't figured out how I am going to do that...or has the damage been done? From what I have read the rock will absorb the nitrates, phosphates and other nasties in tap water. I do have a BRS 4-stage RODI which makes my mistake even worse as I could have just used that to fill the tank... Anyways, any advice would be greatly appreciated!

05/19/2014, 05:33 PM	#2
Dmorty217 Saltwater Addict Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Vandalia OHIO Posts: 11,624	You should drain the tank but you could also get water conditioner and that will take care of heavy metals in the water but you should do a substantial water change, like 50% a few wks into the cycle and then a few more before putting corals into the tank for sure. Hookup your RO and get it running, you will have some evap with a 125g __________________ Fish are not disposable commodities, but a worthwhile investment that can be maintained and enjoyed for many years, providing one is willing to take the time to understand their requirements and needs Current Tank Info: 625g, 220g sump, RD3 230w, Vectra L1 on a closed loop, 3 MP60s, MP40. Several QTs

05/19/2014, 05:37 PM	#3
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Your rock and sand have enough of their own, and will not absorb it that much from the water. You could drain and start over, no big deal at this point, and it will probably save you some fuss and time later...city water often has a lot. But so do rock and sand on their own, depending on where they originated. It'll never be easier to export a big lot of it... __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

05/19/2014, 06:12 PM	#5
MinnFish Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Home of 10,000 lakes Posts: 917	Hold on. You need to mix the salt with the RO/DI before adding to tank. If not, some of the salt will not dissolve. I hope you read this before you have gone too far. __________________ 33G Long, 4x54 watt T5, Tunze 6025, Tunze Osmolator ATO, Tunze Streamfilter 3163 Posts about moving an oversized fish to a bigger tank. Is like hearing every stripper is just working to pay for colle

05/19/2014, 06:49 PM	#7
MinnFish Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Home of 10,000 lakes Posts: 917	You have just joined an exclusive club. We all have membership here and accept new members daily. Its called "The mistakes I made" club. I made another one yesterday. Did a water change without turning the ATO off. Humm, how that happen (I have changed more water than diapers) . Anyway, the process for mixing saltwater should be. You add the correct amount of salt to your RO/DI. Mix (with powerhead) for 24 hrs and if needed add heater to bring water up to temp. If your home is rather warm, room temp will be fine. Test water for proper salinity before adding to tank. Good luck. One question. Are you using live rock or dry? __________________ 33G Long, 4x54 watt T5, Tunze 6025, Tunze Osmolator ATO, Tunze Streamfilter 3163 Posts about moving an oversized fish to a bigger tank. Is like hearing every stripper is just working to pay for colle

05/19/2014, 06:04 PM	#4
RockyProndoa Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 204	Well this makes me feel a bit better. I did manage to drain about 90-100g out of the tank, and am busy re-filling it with the RODI water as we speak. Hopefully, that will dillute it out enough to not make it as bad. Now, to wait for it to fill, mix the salt tomorrow and hope for the best!

05/19/2014, 07:18 PM	#9
shifty51008 12-5 Chiefs record Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: NW Iowa Posts: 10,134	You can mix the salt in the tank after its filled and just run the pumps for 24 hours before checking the salinity. After you have rock and sand in the tank then mix it outside the tank. __________________ 75 gal. mixed DT, 100 gal. sump, 50 gal. fuge, Clownfish breeder

05/19/2014, 07:49 PM	#10
RockyProndoa Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 204	Maybe a stupid question....but why can't you have the rock and sand in the tank before you add the salt?

05/19/2014, 07:56 PM	#11
JayDeePee Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: NYC Posts: 47	It won't mix properly. A portion of the salt will sit on the sandbed and you will not be able to stir it up without mixing the sand also. I've done it before in a bare tank and I can confirm doing it with sand would not be optimal. In my 120 I mixed with nothing in it but all my circulation pumps. Every couple of hours there would be a new salt sediment area I would need to stir up.

05/19/2014, 08:00 PM	#12
RockyProndoa Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 204	What about mixing it in the sump?

05/19/2014, 08:26 PM	#13
JayDeePee Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: NYC Posts: 47	You could do that but you would want to mix for about 2 hours each batch. How many times would you need to cycle this sump to fill your display tank? It's much easier to get another mixing can even just for this one time.

05/19/2014, 08:35 PM	#14
inetmug Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Posts: 693	I would put some of the new startup solutions out there that are meant to cycle tap water. They remove chlorine, and ammonia. Many a tank has been set up that way. Let that cycle, then suck as much out as you can, including the sump, get yourself some gray brute cans (food safe), and then make up your RO/DI. Mix the salt in these cans using a transfer pump (but not one with oil on or it it in a sealed motor configuration, make sure oil-less). The RO/DI units take a long time to make water unless you get a big one. Consider buying the first load from the LFS? Then, once you get it set, check the salinity, and bring it up to spec using small amounts of water mixed with large amounts of salt in a separate bucket. This will give you a concentrated salt solution in the small bucket. Add this to the sump slowly as needed. Once you get it at the right salinity, then let that cycle, doing water changes as suggested. So I tank it this was all dead rock, and dead sand? I hope so, otherwise you got some issues new issues... It all depends upon you local water supply how bad that tap water it.

05/19/2014, 08:40 PM	#15
RockyProndoa Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 204	Yes, dead rock and dead sand. Man, I really made this more difficult than it had to be...twice. Gah...frustrated already lol.

05/19/2014, 08:53 PM	#16
inetmug Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Posts: 693	As poiinted out, no worries. I gomered on my 250G setup due to wrong leveling. I jacked it all out, fixed it, and it should be just fine. Just make sure you give it lots of time to settle out before you introduce critters, and test it. After 30-45 days you should be ready to start the cycle. I have seen the "dead shrimp" method, where you put a dead shrimp in a hang tank. Sacrificial fish, and quick starts like live sand seeding, and combinations. Interesting hobby.

05/19/2014, 08:56 PM	#17
MinnFish Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Home of 10,000 lakes Posts: 917	Do you have a LFS near that sells saltwater? __________________ 33G Long, 4x54 watt T5, Tunze 6025, Tunze Osmolator ATO, Tunze Streamfilter 3163 Posts about moving an oversized fish to a bigger tank. Is like hearing every stripper is just working to pay for colle