Contemplating NOT running Filter Socks

[Jaculus]

OK,, I have 75 gal reef and a 120 Gal FOWLR DT tanks upstairs that drain right below them into the basement into a 125 gal Sump/refu. I have the CPR SockIt (7" with the two inlets) now.

Anyhow, While changing the socks is AT TIMES A PITA. I understand in the overall scheme of things with Reef tanks,, this is not a big deal. I could go years replacing, cleaning, rinsing, ,,, these socks every couple days. BUT I have been doing some research and I am coming to my own personal conclusion that the socks MIGHT not be such a good thing anyhow.

Arguments for the socks usually include better water quality etc.

Arguments against the socks usually include the hassle but also include the point that some of what we have in our refugium needs these nutirents and matter. That is actually what it is there to break down. I know the skimmer gets much of it anyhow also.

But here are my personal thoughts, I think I am going to remove the socks ONLY to use the socks when I am tearing through, rearranging rocks, cleaning algae/dietrus etc for a few hours during and AFTER I do the work in the tanks. That way I am providing the refugium with some of what it is set up for and feed my pods etc in there. BUT I have the socks to filter LARGER quantities of material when I know it will be coming down from the DT's.

Has anyone found any studies on this whether it's better to run or not run filter socks? Looking for something a little more than each of our own opinions. (but feel free to give me your opinions lol ,, I am looking for someone with some facts based on studies though.)

[Stolireef]

There are as many opinions on this as there are reef keepers. I've run systems with and without socks. (currently sockless).

When running socks, I was always impressed by how much stuff they removed. On the other hand, I haven't noticed any difference in my tank after removing them.

I suspect that it depends on things like feeding habits, water changes, skimming style (wet vs. dry) etc. The one thing I can tell you is that I don't miss the sock exchange process.

[major stare]

Thought about exactly the same, changing socks is for some reason the most tedious job, possibly because they are thrown away so often or a pain to clean.

I swapped to 200micron from 100micron, which doesn't clog up so quickly. Have to be careful not to let them collect too much dirt and go biological.

[origreefer]

Changing socks is not a chore, remove one, replace. Soak old sock in water with bleach for a day then rinse. I monitor ORP, it decreases when not using socks. That's enough evidence for me. I would never go sockless. Those organics they capture do not simply go away, they have to be removed.

[cody6766]

But here are my personal thoughts, I think I am going to remove the socks ONLY to use the socks when I am tearing through, rearranging rocks, cleaning algae/dietrus etc for a few hours during and AFTER I do the work in the tanks. That way I am providing the refugium with some of what it is set up for and feed my pods etc in there. BUT I have the socks to filter LARGER quantities of material when I know it will be coming down from the DT's.

That's what I do. I've tried running a sock full time and noticed NO difference in the tanks I was toying with. I like to minimize work and maximize enjoyment, so no sock cleaning for me unless I'm cleaning or making a mess. I also like the idea of not losing pods and other little critters in the sock. I'm sure it's a small number, but why do it when the sock isn't really doing anything for me?

My tanks are normally a little understocked and I'm not keeping really sensitive critters. They're mixed reefs in the truest sense of the word(s). Some guys with very needy SPS tanks may have a different experience than I do. Also, I have no science to back this up. I'm only relaying info that I observed in my tanks. I say try it and see how yours react. Give it a few water change cycles and do your best to not change anything else.

[WBrian]

You could always split the difference and only use one sock, alternating which drain it's on each time you swap it out. Then your fuge and pods, etc get all those goodies, and you limit how many pods you lose to the socks...

[Jaculus]

After running the system without the socks for a couple weeks I noticed the water quality suffer slightly and I just decided to go back to using them 100% of the time.

[DavidinGA]

240gal total volume and tried running socks for a while. It was a pain and I saw little difference. Sockless again now and loving it.

[Timfish]

Sockless: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Uf5IyXvajg

Sockless: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vs_etaHSOfQ

Sockless, filterless, skimmerless: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eCQSVdqBQA

[Jaculus]

I am going to continue to run the sock for another few months I think

My 75 gal reef tank has been established for a while, then I added the 125 gal sump/refu in the basement earlier this year. Then a few months ago I added the 120 gal FOWLR tank to the system with an increase in bio load. My thought, and this is only a thought, is that the socks are better until the total system is functioning after all the "cycles" and build up of the proper bacteria etc. The socks are just an easy way for now to get the stuff out BEFORE it starts breaking down into the N's lol.

I will go back to sockless,, just not yet.

[FirstContact]

My sump is a 100g Rubbermaid stock tank. I can't tell you what a PITA it is to keep clean w/o socks. I use two. One before the skimmer and one after.

[greaps]

Something I observed is more than anything I think it was display tank algae that is cleaned off the glass every 2-3 days that probably clogged my socks more than anything else.

I have been under an impression that if I could eliminate algae from the display my socks would be much cleaner, maybe run GFO.

[ca1ore]

Successful tanks are run with socks; successful tanks are run without socks. Doesn't seem to be THE determining factor so go with what's easier.

[DavidinGA]

People still use socks?

[Tweaked]

BB here, when I switched to sockless, I did not like the results.

[greaps]

Was reading through some tank of the months, and saw the " reef in the sky" his tank is sock less. Coarse substrate, high flow in tank, sump is sock less, with heavy skimming, and more power heads in the sump to keep detritus suspended. Keeping detritus suspended in tank and in sump would improve skimmer function. Tank must have a full siphon to prevent tons of noise and bubble's.

[Hentz]

I was running a sock on my 75 SPS Reef. I would let it run a few extra days after overflowing since I noticed better color in my corals by doing so. One day I just took it off and haven't put it back on, that was a month and a half ago lol. My tank is doing perfect, if not better as I'm having an explosion in growth.

My maintence:
Weekly 20 Gallon Waterchange
Dosing of Mag every night (started a month ago and realized my growth explosion)

And that's it :P.

I'm also barebottom! With just a tiny but of sand under the rocks still as I can't get it out.

[greaps]

Im leaning to sock-less on my next build. Heavy in tank flow, heavy sump flow, no refugium, keep the particles suspended, let the skimmer do its job. Just have to figure out how to achieve a full siphon so I don't have a billion bubbles salt creeping everything.

[swk]

I run my tank without any mechanical media. The closest my tank gets is the skimmer. So far, so good

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by greaps

Was reading through some tank of the months, and saw the " reef in the sky" his tank is sock less. Coarse substrate, high flow in tank, sump is sock less, with heavy skimming, and more power heads in the sump to keep detritus suspended. Keeping detritus suspended in tank and in sump would improve skimmer function. Tank must have a full siphon to prevent tons of noise and bubble's.

You don't really need to keep detritus suspended in the sump, necessarily, in fact that means you've got a better chance of recirculating it back into the tank. If you're at the 'greenfield' point, why not design a settling chamber in to your sump - that's what I did and it works really well.

[greaps]

Can you share a picture of the settling chamber? Or is it just wherever it settles naturally?

[rishma]

I like low flow sumps so my whole sump is a settling chamber. I have been back and forth with/without socks. my animals dont seem to care. I either have to clean socks or siphon out sump periodically. neither is a major chore but I currently dont use socks. just siphon sump once every month or two.

I used to put powerhreads in the sump to keep it stirred up, but that is kinda pointless in my opinion. The skimmer may remove it but settling and siphoning is simpler and uses less energy overall (my energy and electricity).

[dotkat77]

I run them every other day for few hours when I feed the fish. Then I take them out.

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by greaps

Can you share a picture of the settling chamber? Or is it just wherever it settles naturally?

It's rather hidden behind a rats nest of pipes. Simple enough, though. I just made the first baffle in my sump almost the full height of the tanks and only about 6 inches wide. Drains pour into this section, detritus settles to the bottom and water goes up and over the tall baffle. I also keep a small mag float on the bottom and have a bulkhead drain also on the bottom. Every month I stop the main pump, use the old mag float to stir up the gunk, and then drain it out via the bulkhead. Easy, quick, effective .....

[Jaculus]

I think the general consensus is the following

You can run without socks which likely has benefits to first the refugium since it allows more of those nutrients to reach the skimmer, macro algae, pods etc before heading back to the DT.

Those benefits of running sockless are dependent on Bio Load in the display tanks and the amount and types of filtration/lighting/flow in the refugium. Because of this many (like me) tend to see limited change in the water quality or corals from socks to sockless.

One thing we all agree on is that running sockless SHOULD have low enough flow for the material to settle in the refugium. Having a very deep first chamber (or other slow flow chamber) is beneficial to collect the detritus that is of no benefit to the rest of the filtration system.

Sock or Sockless we should have enough FLOW IN THE DISPLAY tanks though to keep the detritus and other stuff suspended as much as possible to eventually flow into the overflow or drain to the refugium. Either extra powerheads or a closed loop system can provide this.

BUT if we run socks we all agree that cleaning or replacing the socks every couple days (depending on load etc) or at least as soon as possible after filling up and overflowing gets that bad stuff out before it can turn into nitrate producing material.

Even though I have not found too much scientific material or studies on the net on the debate of sock vs sockless, I think the consensus is that since many of the most successful tanks have been run without the socks it is worth considering that as the POSSIBLE best solution as long as the other considerations are taking into account such as low refugium flow in at least one chamber and making sure the rest of the filtration is maintained such as removing detritus from dead zones etc.

I have convinced myself to commit to a "Sockless" setup OTHER THAN when I am cleaning or digging around in my display tanks for a few hour during and after my stirring the tanks up.