3 weeks and no nitrite

DrBoxedWine · 07/22/2014, 02:03 PM

I'm cycling my 20g quarantine the old fashioned way with adding pure ammonia, and i'm at about 3 weeks and there is still no nitrite showing up in my test. I didn't mean to do this, but when i added the ammonia i seem to have brought those levels up to around 8-10 PPM. Is there a level of ammonia that is too high and will impede bacterial growth? Or is it normal to go 3 weeks with no nitrite yet?

Thanks in advance!

Randy Holmes-Farley · 07/23/2014, 05:12 AM

Is the ammonia declining?

thegrun · 07/23/2014, 08:11 AM

While I have never had a cycle with levels that high I myself, have read a few posts that seem to indicate ammonia levels at 8ppm or higher do seem to slow down the cycle. If the ammonia is starting to decline I wouldn't do anything, if not a 50% water change to bring the ammonia down to 4ppm would likely help.

DrBoxedWine · 07/24/2014, 12:24 AM

From what I can tell, ammonia is not declining... My stupid API test isn't very accurate however at the higher levels, so it's hard to say for sure. I went ahead and did a 30% water change to bring them down. Thanks guys. It'd be an interesting experiment one day for someone to really test for this.

Titans_Reef · 07/24/2014, 04:08 AM

I dont know if you have done it already but when I started to cycle my 40g breeder, I added fish food to help it cycle. I just added a pinch of food, added 60lbs of black live sand, 45lbs of dead rock, and I told my LFS I was cycling a new tank so they gave me a bag of all the nasty "grunge" from their LR tank (the nasty mud on the bottom). I also used SeaChem Stability for a week and my ammonia went off the charts. I just tested yesterday and my ammonia is at 0 and now my nitrites are off the charts also. You are going to need some sort of bacteria to help it cycle like an additive or some sand from an existing tank IMO. My tank right now is only 2 weeks old and im hoping it is done cycling by the end of this month.

tmz · 07/24/2014, 08:24 AM

I don't know what level of ammonia will derail ammonia oxidizing bacteria or what clade of these bacteria unusually high levels will support if any.

What 's in the qt tank? Any source for phosphorus like live rock ? Ammonia is only adding a nitrogen source for the ammonia oxidizing bacteria.

Personally,FWIW, I prefer to use a little fish food vs pure ammonia for cycling.Food is what the particular ammonia oxidizing bacteria developed in cycling need to process in the long run as it will more closely approximate nutrients( nitrogen and phosphorous ) in fish waste than ammonia only,imo.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20220792

jrozzi · 07/24/2014, 08:26 AM

I would do a water change

GMay · 07/24/2014, 08:57 AM

That is a very high level of ammonium/ammonia and is lethal to most living organisms. Change out some water and get a seed culture some place.

DrBoxedWine · 07/24/2014, 01:48 PM

Thanks everyone. The water change brought them down to 5 or 6 ppm. I'm trying to go au natural here in an attempt to avoid pests. I also just have time... Getting married this weekend and then a honeymoon, so if it takes even 8 weeks it's no biggie

DrBoxedWine · 07/24/2014, 01:49 PM

Probably a random place to post this but this is the view from our house for the weekend! You'll have to excuse me if I'm offline for a few days ☺☺

tmz · 07/24/2014, 11:37 PM

While I agree it's a very high level of ammonia and I would do water changes ;it might not effect the bacteria,many are unaffected at high levels:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16604417

tmz · 07/24/2014, 11:39 PM

Congratulations. We'll be celebrating our 46th anniversary this year.It's been terrific.

DrBoxedWine · 07/25/2014, 07:26 PM

46 years, wow. Very impressive. Thanks everyone for all the help.

tmz · 07/25/2014, 08:28 PM

You are welcome.

07/22/2014, 02:03 PM	#1
DrBoxedWine Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 899	3 weeks and no nitrite I'm cycling my 20g quarantine the old fashioned way with adding pure ammonia, and i'm at about 3 weeks and there is still no nitrite showing up in my test. I didn't mean to do this, but when i added the ammonia i seem to have brought those levels up to around 8-10 PPM. Is there a level of ammonia that is too high and will impede bacterial growth? Or is it normal to go 3 weeks with no nitrite yet? Thanks in advance!

07/23/2014, 05:12 AM	#2
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	Is the ammonia declining? __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

07/24/2014, 08:24 AM	#6
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	I don't know what level of ammonia will derail ammonia oxidizing bacteria or what clade of these bacteria unusually high levels will support if any. What 's in the qt tank? Any source for phosphorus like live rock ? Ammonia is only adding a nitrogen source for the ammonia oxidizing bacteria. Personally,FWIW, I prefer to use a little fish food vs pure ammonia for cycling.Food is what the particular ammonia oxidizing bacteria developed in cycling need to process in the long run as it will more closely approximate nutrients( nitrogen and phosphorous ) in fish waste than ammonia only,imo. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20220792 __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

07/24/2014, 11:37 PM	#11
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	While I agree it's a very high level of ammonia and I would do water changes ;it might not effect the bacteria,many are unaffected at high levels: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16604417 __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

07/24/2014, 11:39 PM	#12
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Congratulations. We'll be celebrating our 46th anniversary this year.It's been terrific. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

07/23/2014, 08:11 AM	#3
thegrun Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Garden Grove, Ca Posts: 17,023	While I have never had a cycle with levels that high I myself, have read a few posts that seem to indicate ammonia levels at 8ppm or higher do seem to slow down the cycle. If the ammonia is starting to decline I wouldn't do anything, if not a 50% water change to bring the ammonia down to 4ppm would likely help.

07/24/2014, 12:24 AM	#4
DrBoxedWine Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 899	From what I can tell, ammonia is not declining... My stupid API test isn't very accurate however at the higher levels, so it's hard to say for sure. I went ahead and did a 30% water change to bring them down. Thanks guys. It'd be an interesting experiment one day for someone to really test for this.

07/24/2014, 04:08 AM	#5
Titans_Reef Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 188	I dont know if you have done it already but when I started to cycle my 40g breeder, I added fish food to help it cycle. I just added a pinch of food, added 60lbs of black live sand, 45lbs of dead rock, and I told my LFS I was cycling a new tank so they gave me a bag of all the nasty "grunge" from their LR tank (the nasty mud on the bottom). I also used SeaChem Stability for a week and my ammonia went off the charts. I just tested yesterday and my ammonia is at 0 and now my nitrites are off the charts also. You are going to need some sort of bacteria to help it cycle like an additive or some sand from an existing tank IMO. My tank right now is only 2 weeks old and im hoping it is done cycling by the end of this month.

07/24/2014, 08:26 AM	#7
jrozzi Moved On Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 580	I would do a water change

07/24/2014, 08:57 AM	#8
GMay Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 136	That is a very high level of ammonium/ammonia and is lethal to most living organisms. Change out some water and get a seed culture some place.

07/24/2014, 01:48 PM	#9
DrBoxedWine Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 899	Thanks everyone. The water change brought them down to 5 or 6 ppm. I'm trying to go au natural here in an attempt to avoid pests. I also just have time... Getting married this weekend and then a honeymoon, so if it takes even 8 weeks it's no biggie

07/24/2014, 01:49 PM	#10
DrBoxedWine Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 899	Probably a random place to post this but this is the view from our house for the weekend! You'll have to excuse me if I'm offline for a few days ☺☺

07/25/2014, 07:26 PM	#13
DrBoxedWine Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 899	46 years, wow. Very impressive. Thanks everyone for all the help.

07/25/2014, 08:28 PM	#14
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	You are welcome. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.