Need some advice about how to setup and maintain my reef

Mikenroe · 06/28/2015, 03:53 PM

Hi there, i am new to RC and here is my question. I was just looking at some of the photos of the current tank of the month, as well as with viewing some of pictures of the past tanks of the month. I see these reefs people have created where almost every space is occupied by coral, of all types, spa,lps,ups, and sps. How do you create such environments that all these spaces like this. Is it that all the spa are at the top, lps in the middle, and softies at the bottom, with ups being in dark spaces and other things like brains and clams being on the bottom? I want to be able to do this.
Here re some other questions?

I would like to tale out all my live rock and re-aqua scape my aquarium, however will this stir up to much of the sand bed, and produce high nitrates?

What things should I do if I do re-aquascape?

Any other things I need to add to my husbandry to make a these type of environments possible and healthy. Here is list of what i have and do;

Tank:
160 gal with 180lbs live sand and 150lbs live rock

Sump:
eshopps rs300 with refugium with deep sand bed with mud and chaeto
led refugium light on 24 hrs

Protein skimmer
Bubble Magus NAC9

UV Steralizer

Lighting
3 AquaIllumination Hydra

2 MP 40's Vortech wireless powerheads

What I do:
Tank is about 7 months old. I was doing weekly water changes of 35 gals/week. I fed once a day with Larry's Reef Frenzy LRS food, about an inch square cube that I would thaw and then pour into aquarium. I was also using reefroids along with other filter feeding foods. However, my aquarium started to take a turn for the worst and my corals were turning brown and loosing color. My thought was that my testing was off or that I was not reading my testing correctly. So i had someone come out and test and they found that my NO3 were 180 using the api test kit. He did not do the red sea testing as he said with those type of numbers, no matter what test he used, bottom line is that my NO3 were way to high. My Phosphates were also high. So after that, I replaced a return hose that had a lot of algae growth in it. I bought a turkey baster and blew off all my rock and coral along with turning my mp 40s up to 9 on the reef crest mode, then i put a aqua sock on to catch all the detritus after the blowing off. I cleaned my protein skimmer and got rid of any coral that was not savable. Then I began doing large water changes of 70 gal every 3-4 days and after the water change would add microbacter7. My NO3 are now down between 5 and 10ppm. I want to get them down below 5ppm. However, once i do get them down below 5ppm, what do I do then. Do i continue to do weekly water changes? or is that two much? Is my equipment okay? I do not dose anything other than microbacter 7, but should I be to be able to keep sps, lps, nps, and all other things that make up a mixed colorful reef. My goal is to create some of these beautiful aquascapes like i see others have created. I hear of people using algae scrubbers and dosing kalk. Also, in a lot of these tanks, other reefers are keeping fish that are generally considered not reef safe, like leopard wrasses, is the key to feed more often to be able to do so. Would love your advice, and specifically would love to here from any of you that have had tanks of the months. Sorry for being so long winded.

BillNye · 06/28/2015, 06:05 PM

Welcome!

For starters, I would start digging through the threads and sticky's on here - you will learn a lot from what everyone has contributed! I don't think any of the TOTMs were created overnight so be patient.

It's good that you got NO3 and PO4 down. I try not to overfeed and clean up any fish poop and extra food they leave behind. I do weekly 15-20% water changes on my 125G and everything is doing great. I think your 70G water changes might be a bit much.

I've never heard of UPS or SPA corals, but generally SPS like high light / high flow, LPS enjoy a little lower light and lower flow compared to SPS and softies are usually lower than that - keep in mind these all vary from coral to coral so be sure to do some research before you buy. I would also buy a good, reliable test kit to test for Calcium, Alkalinity, Magnesium, Nitrate/Nitrite, Phosphate. A good refractometer is great to have as well. Depending on your coral load and test results, you could dose Ca and Alk to get some growth.

How deep is your sand bed and do you clean it? You might run into a problem if you take out the base rocks but moving any rock above the sand shouldn't be a problem. I know people use things like aqua putty to hold their rocks together and even plant corals in certain places.

Do you have any pictures of your set up right now and possibly some pictures of what you want?

Mikenroe · 06/28/2015, 06:53 PM

hey BillNye, thanks for the reply. I meant LPS and SPS not UPS and SPA corals, dang auto correct. I do have the red sea testing kits and have a digital refractometer. My sand bed is about 3 to 4 inches in tank and about 5 inches in sump. I don't have any pictures right now, but will look to upload some soon. So you are saying that if i move the base rock that might cause a problem? I'll check out some other posts as well. However, when ever i have purchased a birds nest or an acropora, they have died, tissue starts to bleach out and before it the coral is gone.

ericarenee · 06/28/2015, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikenroe

hey BillNye, thanks for the reply. I meant LPS and SPS not UPS and SPA corals, dang auto correct. I do have the red sea testing kits and have a digital refractometer. My sand bed is about 3 to 4 inches in tank and about 5 inches in sump. I don't have any pictures right now, but will look to upload some soon. So you are saying that if i move the base rock that might cause a problem? I'll check out some other posts as well. However, when ever i have purchased a birds nest or an acropora, they have died, tissue starts to bleach out and before it the coral is gone.

That sounds like Incorrect lighting.. but could be nitrates Do they start turning brown looking ?

Sk8r · 06/28/2015, 07:57 PM

Tanks like the tanks of the month aren't put together, they grow. Get some frags, position them well, and wait. Read that massive SETTING UP sticky above, understand how to manipulate the chemistry and how to keep it steady, and most of all, pick a class of corals and don't just blindly run in and buy one of everything without knowing how they live and how they get along. Softies and stony together have problems, for example. Some are photosynthetic, some aren't. Some have sweepers, some don't. Etc.

Mikenroe · 06/28/2015, 08:29 PM

ericarenee, yes they are turning brown and SK8r, good advice about the above sticky and will learn more about the corals I purchase, however to be noted. I do plan what i buy and read about them, however, especially every birds nest doesn't last and the same with the few frags of acros's I've purchased.

BillNye · 06/28/2015, 08:37 PM

What are your light settings? What are your water parameters?

I wouldn't try anymore SPS until you have a good understanding of everything and you have positive results from keeping easier corals.

To answer your above question, I don't think it's a great idea to move your base rock but depending on how much you have and how big they are you might be okay. I've moved one or two small pieces before but I clean my sandbed during water changes.

pisanoal · 06/28/2015, 08:45 PM

If you are attempting to keep dps, you need to have a better understanding of reefing chemistry. Mainly alkalinity, calcium magnesium and pH. Get some good rest kits for these and get a few baseline tests to find out where your tank is now and what your salt mix is. Then if needed adjust with supplements until they are close to the right levels (7-9doh alk, 420ppl ca and 1350ppm Mg). Make sure you start your sps very low since you are using LEDs. Most companies run metal halide or t5 over their sps systems, so LEDs are a big change. Start low and move them up a little every week or so.

Bleaching/tissue necrosis can be stress related and not necessarily just too high of light. Even high nutrients or big swings in nutrients can cause bleaching if it is a big swing. Most people have the idea that Brown is high nutrients and bleached is too much light, but corals expel their zoox (bleach) when stressed. Browning is overproduction of zoox and generally takes a little time in a high nutrient environment.

Main point is understand the chemistry, find out where yours is at, adjust it to the right values, and then take your time introducing new coral.

06/28/2015, 03:53 PM	#1
Mikenroe Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 129	Need some advice about how to setup and maintain my reef Hi there, i am new to RC and here is my question. I was just looking at some of the photos of the current tank of the month, as well as with viewing some of pictures of the past tanks of the month. I see these reefs people have created where almost every space is occupied by coral, of all types, spa,lps,ups, and sps. How do you create such environments that all these spaces like this. Is it that all the spa are at the top, lps in the middle, and softies at the bottom, with ups being in dark spaces and other things like brains and clams being on the bottom? I want to be able to do this. Here re some other questions? I would like to tale out all my live rock and re-aqua scape my aquarium, however will this stir up to much of the sand bed, and produce high nitrates? What things should I do if I do re-aquascape? Any other things I need to add to my husbandry to make a these type of environments possible and healthy. Here is list of what i have and do; Tank: 160 gal with 180lbs live sand and 150lbs live rock Sump: eshopps rs300 with refugium with deep sand bed with mud and chaeto led refugium light on 24 hrs Protein skimmer Bubble Magus NAC9 UV Steralizer Lighting 3 AquaIllumination Hydra 2 MP 40's Vortech wireless powerheads What I do: Tank is about 7 months old. I was doing weekly water changes of 35 gals/week. I fed once a day with Larry's Reef Frenzy LRS food, about an inch square cube that I would thaw and then pour into aquarium. I was also using reefroids along with other filter feeding foods. However, my aquarium started to take a turn for the worst and my corals were turning brown and loosing color. My thought was that my testing was off or that I was not reading my testing correctly. So i had someone come out and test and they found that my NO3 were 180 using the api test kit. He did not do the red sea testing as he said with those type of numbers, no matter what test he used, bottom line is that my NO3 were way to high. My Phosphates were also high. So after that, I replaced a return hose that had a lot of algae growth in it. I bought a turkey baster and blew off all my rock and coral along with turning my mp 40s up to 9 on the reef crest mode, then i put a aqua sock on to catch all the detritus after the blowing off. I cleaned my protein skimmer and got rid of any coral that was not savable. Then I began doing large water changes of 70 gal every 3-4 days and after the water change would add microbacter7. My NO3 are now down between 5 and 10ppm. I want to get them down below 5ppm. However, once i do get them down below 5ppm, what do I do then. Do i continue to do weekly water changes? or is that two much? Is my equipment okay? I do not dose anything other than microbacter 7, but should I be to be able to keep sps, lps, nps, and all other things that make up a mixed colorful reef. My goal is to create some of these beautiful aquascapes like i see others have created. I hear of people using algae scrubbers and dosing kalk. Also, in a lot of these tanks, other reefers are keeping fish that are generally considered not reef safe, like leopard wrasses, is the key to feed more often to be able to do so. Would love your advice, and specifically would love to here from any of you that have had tanks of the months. Sorry for being so long winded.

06/28/2015, 06:05 PM	#2
BillNye Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Socal Posts: 226	Welcome! For starters, I would start digging through the threads and sticky's on here - you will learn a lot from what everyone has contributed! I don't think any of the TOTMs were created overnight so be patient. It's good that you got NO3 and PO4 down. I try not to overfeed and clean up any fish poop and extra food they leave behind. I do weekly 15-20% water changes on my 125G and everything is doing great. I think your 70G water changes might be a bit much. I've never heard of UPS or SPA corals, but generally SPS like high light / high flow, LPS enjoy a little lower light and lower flow compared to SPS and softies are usually lower than that - keep in mind these all vary from coral to coral so be sure to do some research before you buy. I would also buy a good, reliable test kit to test for Calcium, Alkalinity, Magnesium, Nitrate/Nitrite, Phosphate. A good refractometer is great to have as well. Depending on your coral load and test results, you could dose Ca and Alk to get some growth. How deep is your sand bed and do you clean it? You might run into a problem if you take out the base rocks but moving any rock above the sand shouldn't be a problem. I know people use things like aqua putty to hold their rocks together and even plant corals in certain places. Do you have any pictures of your set up right now and possibly some pictures of what you want? __________________ Trust me - I'm a scientist. Current Tank Info: 125G

06/28/2015, 07:57 PM	#5
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Tanks like the tanks of the month aren't put together, they grow. Get some frags, position them well, and wait. Read that massive SETTING UP sticky above, understand how to manipulate the chemistry and how to keep it steady, and most of all, pick a class of corals and don't just blindly run in and buy one of everything without knowing how they live and how they get along. Softies and stony together have problems, for example. Some are photosynthetic, some aren't. Some have sweepers, some don't. Etc. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

06/28/2015, 08:37 PM	#7
BillNye Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Socal Posts: 226	What are your light settings? What are your water parameters? I wouldn't try anymore SPS until you have a good understanding of everything and you have positive results from keeping easier corals. To answer your above question, I don't think it's a great idea to move your base rock but depending on how much you have and how big they are you might be okay. I've moved one or two small pieces before but I clean my sandbed during water changes. __________________ Trust me - I'm a scientist. Current Tank Info: 125G

06/28/2015, 06:53 PM	#3
Mikenroe Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 129	hey BillNye, thanks for the reply. I meant LPS and SPS not UPS and SPA corals, dang auto correct. I do have the red sea testing kits and have a digital refractometer. My sand bed is about 3 to 4 inches in tank and about 5 inches in sump. I don't have any pictures right now, but will look to upload some soon. So you are saying that if i move the base rock that might cause a problem? I'll check out some other posts as well. However, when ever i have purchased a birds nest or an acropora, they have died, tissue starts to bleach out and before it the coral is gone.

06/28/2015, 08:29 PM	#6
Mikenroe Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 129	ericarenee, yes they are turning brown and SK8r, good advice about the above sticky and will learn more about the corals I purchase, however to be noted. I do plan what i buy and read about them, however, especially every birds nest doesn't last and the same with the few frags of acros's I've purchased.

06/28/2015, 08:45 PM	#8
pisanoal Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 705	If you are attempting to keep dps, you need to have a better understanding of reefing chemistry. Mainly alkalinity, calcium magnesium and pH. Get some good rest kits for these and get a few baseline tests to find out where your tank is now and what your salt mix is. Then if needed adjust with supplements until they are close to the right levels (7-9doh alk, 420ppl ca and 1350ppm Mg). Make sure you start your sps very low since you are using LEDs. Most companies run metal halide or t5 over their sps systems, so LEDs are a big change. Start low and move them up a little every week or so. Bleaching/tissue necrosis can be stress related and not necessarily just too high of light. Even high nutrients or big swings in nutrients can cause bleaching if it is a big swing. Most people have the idea that Brown is high nutrients and bleached is too much light, but corals expel their zoox (bleach) when stressed. Browning is overproduction of zoox and generally takes a little time in a high nutrient environment. Main point is understand the chemistry, find out where yours is at, adjust it to the right values, and then take your time introducing new coral.