Culturing mysis shrimp in a refugium

Sk8r · 08/11/2015, 09:08 AM

There are probably multiple ways to do this, but it's pretty easy given anything like a friendly environment for the shrimp...and if you feed mysis frozen cubes, you're constantly providing eggs, is my theory, wihch will hatch in a typical tank environment.

My first experience with them was a mysterious rock in the DT: it had a cave about the size of a quarter which was always aswarm with small moving thing. Yep.

And they turn up in the fuge. Much of my fuge gets quite a flowthrough, being simply the middle chamber of my sump, which is driven by a 20 foot downfall from upstairs and pushed by a 2000 gallons an hour pump at the end of the tank.

There is, however, a very active colony going in one corner of a 20 gallon fuge. What are their conditions? A shallow sandbed not at all well-maintained, a massive lot of cheato making a stable wall around their 'space', a 6500 k CFL floodlight in an 8 dollar aluminum shop-light clip. They're on the 'inflow' end of the fuge, in a low-flow area created by the massive cheato lump, in a corner, and the water conditions are 'reef', meaning 1.025 salinity, 80 temperature, 8.3 alk, 420 calcium, and 1300 magnesium. There's also live rock rubble around and about, overshadowed by the cheato mass.

In other words, it's a junky area, it's quiet, it's minimal light for a reef, and there isn't much predation there unless you count a couple of fat aiptasia (no, I don't stress about a few aiptasia unless they encroach on a coral up in the DT, but down here, they're just part of that 'circle of life' thing.)

What benefit to grow-your-own mysis? Well, they WILL get through the pump alive, and they can also breed and grow in the DT, in nooks and caves, and they're free fishfood, besides adding to the biodiversity of the tank, along with amphipods, copepods, etc, carrying the kind of nutrition marine fish need. And probably doing their bit to clean up waste. Some people don't like 'unscheduled' life in their tanks, but I do: there are very few predatory species among the 'common' sorts of things that arrive, and of the lot, the mysis and 'pods are the edible sort that make for happy fish, rewarding their hunting in a natural way.

So if you have a fuge, use rock rubble to wall the cheato out of a quiet corner, feed mysis, and see if you don't find an unscheduled population turning up.

stscream4187 · 08/11/2015, 01:34 PM

This sounds great, but I figured I would have to purchase live mysis. How will feeding frozen cubes of mysis spawn a population?

Dayson · 08/11/2015, 01:58 PM

I believe he is saying that there are frozen Mysis eggs in the cubes...

Sk8r · 08/11/2015, 03:39 PM

Yep. They're getting in there somehow, and my guess is eggs in the frozen cubes. Once they start breeding on their own, they manage.

Bent · 08/11/2015, 04:02 PM

If there is any quote from any book that reefing just confirms for me to be true, it's that "life finds a way."

stscream4187 · 08/12/2015, 05:20 AM

I apologize for my ignorance on this then, but if you freeze something, doesn't it die? How is this possible?

laga77 · 08/12/2015, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stscream4187

I apologize for my ignorance on this then, but if you freeze something, doesn't it die? How is this possible?

Many organisms can be frozen without destroying them. They just go into a dormant state. There are some frogs that can be frozen with no harm. I add BBS on a daily basis to my tanks. Occasionally there is an adult swimming around in my fuge.

stscream4187 · 08/12/2015, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laga77

Many organisms can be frozen without destroying them. They just go into a dormant state. There are some frogs that can be frozen with no harm. I add BBS on a daily basis to my tanks. Occasionally there is an adult swimming around in my fuge.

Wow, so cool. No idea. Sorry for side-tracking this thread. I'd love to see some pics of your fuge sk8r!

Sk8r · 08/12/2015, 07:48 AM

Just imagine a mass of green moss under a 6500 k shoplight clipped to the sump wall, and one little corner where you can see down to sand and rock, which is the whole middle section of my rather unlovely sump. All the pumps are at the far end, the big one being external, and the skimmer hangs on the side, discharging back into the fuge, but taking water from the pump chamber. That's about it. It's an old Eshopps fuge, with no sponges, filters, bells or whistles. Topoff is a tube from an Eheim pump in a freshwater reservoir, which happens to be a Rubbermaid trash can on rollers. I do not run what I would call a 'showy' fuge.

stscream4187 · 08/12/2015, 10:23 AM

Cool, thanks! Just curious about the part where the mysis are propagating!

tc2007 · 08/12/2015, 10:41 AM

What is the importance of sand and chaeto play in this? I have a similar setup except I dont have sand in my sump. It's just a 20g plain tank with no compartments. I only have a rock rubble in a plastic container in the middle and a plastic mesh ball from dollar store on top of it instead of the chaeto. I don't see too many pods nor mysis for that matter. Wondering if it is worth the trouble in my case to add sand in a container and replace the plastic mesh with chaeto. It will be too much trouble to replace the tank with a proper sump with compartments due to lack of space.

Sk8r · 08/12/2015, 10:46 AM

I really don't know what part sand plays---possibly it breeds even smaller things for the mysis to eat---they have to eat something. The reason I gave the involved description is because it works, but I don't know why or what parts of the setup are essential. I know that they thrive in a fist-sized protected area with rock and sand, about 8" deep, right under the light, and what walls it off on the third side is a green mass of cheato---where they also live. Maybe the lighted area is their Miami beach and they come out of the cheato mass for the light and the sand. But they're constantly busy, coming and going, I'd estimate 20-30 of them at a time---congregating there in numbers, while I do see them here and there in the large cheato mass.

Sk8r · 08/12/2015, 12:00 PM

I did look up what they eat, and the answer is, being shrimp---each other, at need. Otherwise any sort of microscopic fauna and plankton, which could include new-hatched copepods, though whether those congregate in the same places is uncertain. If you can manage a large cheato ball, that's probably going to produce both for your tank in enough abundance at least to entertain your fish, and to let them forage naturally with some hope of reward.

08/11/2015, 09:08 AM	#1
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Culturing mysis shrimp in a refugium There are probably multiple ways to do this, but it's pretty easy given anything like a friendly environment for the shrimp...and if you feed mysis frozen cubes, you're constantly providing eggs, is my theory, wihch will hatch in a typical tank environment. My first experience with them was a mysterious rock in the DT: it had a cave about the size of a quarter which was always aswarm with small moving thing. Yep. And they turn up in the fuge. Much of my fuge gets quite a flowthrough, being simply the middle chamber of my sump, which is driven by a 20 foot downfall from upstairs and pushed by a 2000 gallons an hour pump at the end of the tank. There is, however, a very active colony going in one corner of a 20 gallon fuge. What are their conditions? A shallow sandbed not at all well-maintained, a massive lot of cheato making a stable wall around their 'space', a 6500 k CFL floodlight in an 8 dollar aluminum shop-light clip. They're on the 'inflow' end of the fuge, in a low-flow area created by the massive cheato lump, in a corner, and the water conditions are 'reef', meaning 1.025 salinity, 80 temperature, 8.3 alk, 420 calcium, and 1300 magnesium. There's also live rock rubble around and about, overshadowed by the cheato mass. In other words, it's a junky area, it's quiet, it's minimal light for a reef, and there isn't much predation there unless you count a couple of fat aiptasia (no, I don't stress about a few aiptasia unless they encroach on a coral up in the DT, but down here, they're just part of that 'circle of life' thing.) What benefit to grow-your-own mysis? Well, they WILL get through the pump alive, and they can also breed and grow in the DT, in nooks and caves, and they're free fishfood, besides adding to the biodiversity of the tank, along with amphipods, copepods, etc, carrying the kind of nutrition marine fish need. And probably doing their bit to clean up waste. Some people don't like 'unscheduled' life in their tanks, but I do: there are very few predatory species among the 'common' sorts of things that arrive, and of the lot, the mysis and 'pods are the edible sort that make for happy fish, rewarding their hunting in a natural way. So if you have a fuge, use rock rubble to wall the cheato out of a quiet corner, feed mysis, and see if you don't find an unscheduled population turning up. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

08/11/2015, 03:39 PM	#4
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Yep. They're getting in there somehow, and my guess is eggs in the frozen cubes. Once they start breeding on their own, they manage. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

08/11/2015, 04:02 PM	#5
Bent I got nothin' Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: The anals Posts: 6,420	If there is any quote from any book that reefing just confirms for me to be true, it's that "life finds a way." __________________ Quitters never lose. [QUOTE=CStrickland]Who gets mad at a starfish?[/QUOTE] Current Tank Info: 75g DT, 30G refugium, 10g chaeto tank, 50g stock tank basement sump

08/12/2015, 07:48 AM	#9
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Just imagine a mass of green moss under a 6500 k shoplight clipped to the sump wall, and one little corner where you can see down to sand and rock, which is the whole middle section of my rather unlovely sump. All the pumps are at the far end, the big one being external, and the skimmer hangs on the side, discharging back into the fuge, but taking water from the pump chamber. That's about it. It's an old Eshopps fuge, with no sponges, filters, bells or whistles. Topoff is a tube from an Eheim pump in a freshwater reservoir, which happens to be a Rubbermaid trash can on rollers. I do not run what I would call a 'showy' fuge. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

08/12/2015, 10:46 AM	#12
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	I really don't know what part sand plays---possibly it breeds even smaller things for the mysis to eat---they have to eat something. The reason I gave the involved description is because it works, but I don't know why or what parts of the setup are essential. I know that they thrive in a fist-sized protected area with rock and sand, about 8" deep, right under the light, and what walls it off on the third side is a green mass of cheato---where they also live. Maybe the lighted area is their Miami beach and they come out of the cheato mass for the light and the sand. But they're constantly busy, coming and going, I'd estimate 20-30 of them at a time---congregating there in numbers, while I do see them here and there in the large cheato mass. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

08/11/2015, 01:34 PM	#2
stscream4187 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 122	This sounds great, but I figured I would have to purchase live mysis. How will feeding frozen cubes of mysis spawn a population?

08/11/2015, 01:58 PM	#3
Dayson Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Collierville, TN Posts: 88	I believe he is saying that there are frozen Mysis eggs in the cubes...

08/12/2015, 05:20 AM	#6
stscream4187 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 122	I apologize for my ignorance on this then, but if you freeze something, doesn't it die? How is this possible?

08/12/2015, 10:23 AM	#10
stscream4187 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 122	Cool, thanks! Just curious about the part where the mysis are propagating!

08/12/2015, 10:41 AM	#11
tc2007 Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Midwest Posts: 867	What is the importance of sand and chaeto play in this? I have a similar setup except I dont have sand in my sump. It's just a 20g plain tank with no compartments. I only have a rock rubble in a plastic container in the middle and a plastic mesh ball from dollar store on top of it instead of the chaeto. I don't see too many pods nor mysis for that matter. Wondering if it is worth the trouble in my case to add sand in a container and replace the plastic mesh with chaeto. It will be too much trouble to replace the tank with a proper sump with compartments due to lack of space.

08/12/2015, 12:00 PM	#13
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	I did look up what they eat, and the answer is, being shrimp---each other, at need. Otherwise any sort of microscopic fauna and plankton, which could include new-hatched copepods, though whether those congregate in the same places is uncertain. If you can manage a large cheato ball, that's probably going to produce both for your tank in enough abundance at least to entertain your fish, and to let them forage naturally with some hope of reward. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.