Can you do a herbie with out emergency

[LI reefer]

Setting up 180g with dual over flow boxes with 1" and 3/4" holes in each. I want to have a dual return. Therefore what are my options for drains. Also can a herbie be done with out an emergency? I'm not worried about it being clogged

[treedog5]

Technically yes, but not recommend. I'm always afraid of tanks without a emergency drain, you never know what might happen. You should at least use one of the returns as a emergency and maybe run one return over the back.

[ca1ore]

By definition a 'herbie' is a dual drain, so no, you cannot do a herbie with just a single drain. You could do a single drain as a siphon, yes, but its a dangerous way to go because you have no excess drain capacity should the siphon become reduced even slightly. I see no good reason to have a split return, so on my dual overflow tank I did one corner as a herbie and the other as a siphon/return.

[CafeReef]

Originally Posted by ca1ore

By definition a 'herbie' is a dual drain, so no, you cannot do a herbie with just a single drain. You could do a single drain as a siphon, yes, but its a dangerous way to go because you have no excess drain capacity should the siphon become reduced even slightly. I see no good reason to have a split return, so on my dual overflow tank I did one corner as a herbie and the other as a siphon/return.

I agree. A herbie without a dual drain is basically just a standpipe drain with a filter cap on the pipe. My new tank will be going with a herbie drain. I am in the same boat, I have a 3/4" and a 1/2" for a drain and return in the bottom of the tank. I will be expanding the 1/2" to a 3/4" to allow for a true herbie then drill the back of the tank above the main drain for my return pipe to have space.

[LI reefer]

I was considering doing what ca1ore said but wasn't sure what the benefits or draw backs of a dual return are

[thegrun]

If you want a good varied flow from your return look into a sea swirl with the return(s) run up over the back.

[mgraf]

Love my sea swirl.

[Indymann99]

Yes, you can run a Herbie without a emergency drain... its called a "Flood system" (its just a matter of time till it happens....).

Take inventory of whats on your floor, what the floor is made of, if your really brave "who" lives below you...... then by all means run a "BIE" (But I couldnt run an Emergency drain)

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by LI reefer

I was considering doing what ca1ore said but wasn't sure what the benefits or draw backs of a dual return are

Personally I hate anything coming over the rim of my tank, so anything HoB is out. I also try to preserve as much flow as I can from my basement pump, so unecessary T's, elbows or loc line are out.

[mike810]

Originally Posted by LI reefer

Setting up 180g with dual over flow boxes with 1" and 3/4" holes in each. I want to have a dual return. Therefore what are my options for drains. Also can a herbie be done with out an emergency? I'm not worried about it being clogged

You should be worried about it being clogged as it is only 1" and since you will have to put a valve on it and close it a bit to control the flow, it will get clogged. I have 1.5" drains running bean animal and I've had snails and even fish clog the main siphon.

[kmbyrnes]

ca1ore has the right idea. My 350 runs the same way.

[LI reefer]

Which hole should be used for the emergency

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by mike810

I've had snails and even fish clog the main siphon.

I put a screen/strainer on every drain to prevent this.

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by LI reefer

Which hole should be used for the emergency

Larger is emergency; smaller siphon.

[LI reefer]

Should the 1" be used as a return and have the 3/4 as a siphon then in the other over flow 3/4 siphon and 1" emergency

[ATinPGH]

My $.02

You don't "need" 2 returns. They shouldn't be used to create flow in the tank. That should be done by powerheads/Vortechs/Gyres or the latest flow producing gizmo of the month. Returns facilitate flow through your sump.

If you think of it in that mindset then you have three holes to work with which is what I did. My tank has dual overflows and I wanted to go with a Bean Animal set up without having to drill any glass. I installed a "balance pipe" between the two overflows in the tank. Its basically a 1" black pvc pipe that is sealed with silicone and equalizes the flow between the two overflows. Since the back of my tank is painted black it blends right in and then the sand conceals it completely.

One over flow has the full siphon and dry emergency pipe (no flow unless clogged elsewhere) and the other overflow has the return and the "wet" emergency pipe. I put them in that configuration so that there will always be at least a little flow in the overflow with the return. I didn't want any stagnant water.

The full siphon is adjusted with a gate valve and pulls from both overflows. It was the only solution I could come up with that didn't require drilling glass. My pump can provide more than enough flow to meet my target through the sump via one return line. I create flow in the tank with various powerheads.

Best of Luck.

Aaron

[mike810]

Originally Posted by ca1ore

I put a screen/strainer on every drain to prevent this.

I'm running the bean animal drains. I had spare mesh left over from making screens and have since put those on the drains as well. Still, the snail get caught on the drains and I'd have to pluck them out which messes with the full siphon drain a bit.

[CStrickland]

Originally Posted by ca1ore

... I see no good reason to have a split return, so on my dual overflow tank I did one corner as a herbie and the other as a siphon/return.

Same here (in progress).
There's a few diff ways to approach a reef ready tank like this. I read a lot of threads before I decided, and Calore's way is a good balance of getting most of what you want out of the system, but not having to mod or drill.

I'm doing each side as a separate drain all the way down, on its own gate valve. Connecting them seems to give people trouble tuning the flow.

If I were using a canopy I might do two herbies with the return external, I like symmetry.