Ceramics in Aquascaping

ambrose · 07/04/2004, 10:26 AM

Does anyone use ceramics in their tank(s)?

Either as substrate, equipment, or decoration.

What types of ceramics are safe to use?

TippyToeX · 07/04/2004, 09:00 PM

ambrose

To Reef Central

I've never used them so I am not of much help. I the only unnatural element I have used is clay pots in my tanks. I build the live rock around it, for a deep dark cave.

I hope someone will let you know if ceramics are safe to use.

DLBerlin · 07/05/2004, 05:55 AM

I had one of the old soft cheese crocks in my reef for a couple years-They are the heavy brown ceramic(stoneware I believe) ones-not sure if they still make them. It was the perfect size for my haddoni carpets foot.It ended up outgrowing it but I never had any problems.I would just make sure its foodsafe. Some decorative ceramics say not to use for food so I'm assuming they have nasties in the paints or glazes.
Debbie

mhurley · 07/05/2004, 08:54 AM

I just checked with Roger at Tunze and he confirmed that the Tunze Stream Rocks that they make (fake rocks to hide the Stream pumps in) are made out of ceramic, I have one of them in my tank now. He also said to becareful because not all ceramics are safe, many contain heavy metals, especially in the glazes. I'm not sure how you would confirm that besides speaking with the manufacturer.

Good luck.

ssheipel · 07/05/2004, 09:08 AM

I've seen clay pots in reef tanks -- how long do they stand up TippyToex?

I ask because after a couple of years with soil in them I notice at transplanting time for my houseplants the clay pots have deteriorated considerably.

Don't want to pile LR on them, only to have them collapse from decay from the salt water....

Thanks

ambrose · 07/07/2004, 11:03 AM

Awesome, I was afraid I was going to get no replies or shot down. I manufacture ceramics and was wondering what use they might be put to in tanks. I'm often unimpressed with the selection of tank decoration at pet shops.

Ceramics (used with common sense) can be extremely srong and survive in harsh conditions for long periods of time. This is why they are a favorite of archaeologists.

Rock and foam seem to take up a lot of water volume.

Red garden pots and bricks are generally very porous and break down more readily than something that is glazed. I was surprised to hear of their use, although compared with something that was glazed these (clay pots, not bricks) might offer more surface area. Also, the clay used for those pots can generally be poor and weak.

Should the question then be glazed vs. unglazed?

Would people be interested in using ceramics as decoration or supports?

Are there any types or shapes reefers would be interested in?

ssheipel · 07/07/2004, 11:31 AM

arches

DLBerlin · 07/07/2004, 11:58 AM

I agree-Nice arches made to blend well with live rock.
A reef-safe guarentee that it would not leach any toxins-heavy metals etc.

mike89t · 07/14/2005, 12:21 PM

Here is a ceramic rock wall that looks really cool. They sell it here.

http://www.finsreef.com/product.php?...cat=292&page=1

I think it would be very easy to do something like this. You would just need to find someone who would allow you to use their kiln.

I'm actually thinking of making something very similar to this to cover the back wall of my aquarium. Anyone know what type of clay would be best for this?

ambrose · 11/25/2006, 08:21 AM

I like ceramics

uberfugu · 11/25/2006, 10:27 AM

There is quite a variety of ceramic materials and manufacturing techniques
available in the market.

Firing temperatures can range as low as 1000ÂºF to as high as 2500ÂºF in commercial ware.
Clay bodies can be simply dug from a local clay deposit and fired in a primitive
straw-fueled mud kiln (as some mexican roof tiles), or formulated with analytical
grade ingredients in clean labs and fired with computer-controlled electric furnaces.

What makes a fired ceramic product is when a ceramic object is heated
to above 1030ÂºF (quartz inversion) the quartz crystals change from an alpha crystal structure to a
beta crystal structure. The object sort of fuses and can't be dissolved with water.

The higher a ceramic object is heated (up until its melting point when it turns to
a glass state) the harder and more chemically impervious it becomes.

Terracotta pots are fired to the low end of the scale. They have a high iron
content (hence red color) that lets them be relatively solid at a low firing temp.
It has a porous nature that can harbor algaes and bacteria. Terracotta should
be sterilized between aquarium applications with a hot water and bleach soak
(then properly dechlorinating).

Ceramic bio-filter media is low-fired to remain porous enhancing bacterial colonization.

Porcelains are a low-iron ceramic that is fired much higher. When fired, porcelain
is very strong, fairly chemically inert, and has a low moisture absorption. They are
generally safe for reef use.

Glazes are another issue. While they are composed of similar ingredients as a
ceramic body, they are formulated to melt and adhere at the temperature which
the ceramic body is fired. But the formulas for a glaze are altered to accomodate
color and texture with the additions of metals.

One of my favorite glazes is a matte gunmetal called pewter. It is a saturated
copper glazed that is not food safe; it leaches copper when it comes in contact
with acidic foods. Although my reef is akaline, I would use a product with this
glaze.

Similar popular glazes have a saturated barium content and leaching is a
concern. Cadmium, strontium, iron, cobalt, titanium, and lead are commonly
used metals in ceramics.

I think that unglazed terracotta is usable. Most porcelains and stonewares
should be ok. Fancy metallic finishes or ultrabright colors may call for more research.
You could probably soak the questionable ceramic in a bucket of tank water for
a week and test for the usual suspects. But I feel that If in doubt, leave it out.

kentrob11 · 11/25/2006, 10:32 AM

Who was it that was selling big ceramis rock structures for reef tanks? There was some seriously nice looking stuff there!

07/04/2004, 10:26 AM	#1
ambrose Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 10	Ceramics in Aquascaping Does anyone use ceramics in their tank(s)? Either as substrate, equipment, or decoration. What types of ceramics are safe to use?

07/04/2004, 09:00 PM	#2
TippyToeX Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 10,711	ambrose *To Reef Central* I've never used them so I am not of much help. I the only unnatural element I have used is clay pots in my tanks. I build the live rock around it, for a deep dark cave. I hope someone will let you know if ceramics are safe to use. __________________ -Amy-

07/05/2004, 08:54 AM	#4
mhurley RC Staff Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Illinois'ish Posts: 38,805	I just checked with Roger at Tunze and he confirmed that the Tunze Stream Rocks that they make (fake rocks to hide the Stream pumps in) are made out of ceramic, I have one of them in my tank now. He also said to becareful because not all ceramics are safe, many contain heavy metals, especially in the glazes. I'm not sure how you would confirm that besides speaking with the manufacturer. Good luck. __________________ Mike Current Tank Info: 60G Cube

07/05/2004, 09:08 AM	#5
ssheipel Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 406	I've seen clay pots in reef tanks -- how long do they stand up TippyToex? I ask because after a couple of years with soil in them I notice at transplanting time for my houseplants the clay pots have deteriorated considerably. Don't want to pile LR on them, only to have them collapse from decay from the salt water.... Thanks __________________ "Why does your living room smell like low tide? Current Tank Info: 120 g tank, 30ish gallon sump/fuge, aqauspacelight 250 x 2 plus pc actinic, euroreef skimmer, MAS dual chamber calcium reactor, Dolphin Amp Master 3000 pump, 2 3/4 " Sea Swirls, Tunze Stream 6000 with controller, ro/di auto top up

07/14/2005, 12:21 PM	#9
mike89t Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Chandler, Az Posts: 1,889	Here is a ceramic rock wall that looks really cool. They sell it here. http://www.finsreef.com/product.php?...cat=292&page=1 I think it would be very easy to do something like this. You would just need to find someone who would allow you to use their kiln. I'm actually thinking of making something very similar to this to cover the back wall of my aquarium. Anyone know what type of clay would be best for this? __________________ Give a person a fish and you feed them for a day; teach that person to use the Internet and they won't bother you for weeks. Current Tank Info: Sold my 150G reef tank. :^(

07/05/2004, 05:55 AM	#3
DLBerlin Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 395	I had one of the old soft cheese crocks in my reef for a couple years-They are the heavy brown ceramic(stoneware I believe) ones-not sure if they still make them. It was the perfect size for my haddoni carpets foot.It ended up outgrowing it but I never had any problems.I would just make sure its foodsafe. Some decorative ceramics say not to use for food so I'm assuming they have nasties in the paints or glazes. Debbie

07/07/2004, 11:03 AM	#6
ambrose Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 10	Awesome, I was afraid I was going to get no replies or shot down. I manufacture ceramics and was wondering what use they might be put to in tanks. I'm often unimpressed with the selection of tank decoration at pet shops. Ceramics (used with common sense) can be extremely srong and survive in harsh conditions for long periods of time. This is why they are a favorite of archaeologists. Rock and foam seem to take up a lot of water volume. Red garden pots and bricks are generally very porous and break down more readily than something that is glazed. I was surprised to hear of their use, although compared with something that was glazed these (clay pots, not bricks) might offer more surface area. Also, the clay used for those pots can generally be poor and weak. Should the question then be glazed vs. unglazed? Would people be interested in using ceramics as decoration or supports? Are there any types or shapes reefers would be interested in?

07/07/2004, 11:31 AM	#7
ssheipel Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 406	arches

07/07/2004, 11:58 AM	#8
DLBerlin Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 395	I agree-Nice arches made to blend well with live rock. A reef-safe guarentee that it would not leach any toxins-heavy metals etc.

11/25/2006, 08:21 AM	#10
ambrose Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 10	I like ceramics

11/25/2006, 10:27 AM	#11
uberfugu Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Oak/SF Bay Area Posts: 358	There is quite a variety of ceramic materials and manufacturing techniques available in the market. Firing temperatures can range as low as 1000ÂºF to as high as 2500ÂºF in commercial ware. Clay bodies can be simply dug from a local clay deposit and fired in a primitive straw-fueled mud kiln (as some mexican roof tiles), or formulated with analytical grade ingredients in clean labs and fired with computer-controlled electric furnaces. What makes a fired ceramic product is when a ceramic object is heated to above 1030ÂºF (quartz inversion) the quartz crystals change from an alpha crystal structure to a beta crystal structure. The object sort of fuses and can't be dissolved with water. The higher a ceramic object is heated (up until its melting point when it turns to a glass state) the harder and more chemically impervious it becomes. Terracotta pots are fired to the low end of the scale. They have a high iron content (hence red color) that lets them be relatively solid at a low firing temp. It has a porous nature that can harbor algaes and bacteria. Terracotta should be sterilized between aquarium applications with a hot water and bleach soak (then properly dechlorinating). Ceramic bio-filter media is low-fired to remain porous enhancing bacterial colonization. Porcelains are a low-iron ceramic that is fired much higher. When fired, porcelain is very strong, fairly chemically inert, and has a low moisture absorption. They are generally safe for reef use. Glazes are another issue. While they are composed of similar ingredients as a ceramic body, they are formulated to melt and adhere at the temperature which the ceramic body is fired. But the formulas for a glaze are altered to accomodate color and texture with the additions of metals. One of my favorite glazes is a matte gunmetal called pewter. It is a saturated copper glazed that is not food safe; it leaches copper when it comes in contact with acidic foods. Although my reef is akaline, I would use a product with this glaze. Similar popular glazes have a saturated barium content and leaching is a concern. Cadmium, strontium, iron, cobalt, titanium, and lead are commonly used metals in ceramics. I think that unglazed terracotta is usable. Most porcelains and stonewares should be ok. Fancy metallic finishes or ultrabright colors may call for more research. You could probably soak the questionable ceramic in a bucket of tank water for a week and test for the usual suspects. But I feel that If in doubt, leave it out.

11/25/2006, 10:32 AM	#12
kentrob11 Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: O'Fallon, IL Posts: 4,520	Who was it that was selling big ceramis rock structures for reef tanks? There was some seriously nice looking stuff there!