new to SW : FOWLR

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 02:28 AM

hey all..

is it possible to have a SW aquarium without any substrate but a few LR?mine is a 30 gallon..can it run just on a HOB filter and some live rocks?Can i use a pair of percula clown or any damsels to cycle the tank?i read about this before but the LFS owner told me not to get any for the time being.should i get one?thanks in advance.

Blown 346 · 02/14/2006, 04:28 AM

Yes you can have a Bare bottom tank without substrate and live rock.
You can run a HOB but I would have a good amount of rock for your actual filtration.

No, I wouldnt use any fish to cycle a new tank, it is cruel, and they most likely could end up dying from the stress and the high levels in the tank during the cycle.
You should cycle your tank with the live rock.
I wouldnt get any type of Damsel since they are little terrors, and once they start picking on fish or even nipping at corals you will will have to dis assemble your tank to get them out.

philagothos · 02/14/2006, 04:47 AM

Welcome to RC!!!

From what I hear, going bare-bottom involves a lot more than just setting up an aquarium without substrate. If this is the route you want to go I advise doing as much research as you can before starting. For that matter, I advise doing tons of reading before starting anyways.

For cycling you can just use the live rock as it cycles. Or you can go to your local grocery store and get a fresh raw shrimp and just toss it in to kick off the cycle.

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 05:49 AM

okay..so, is it suitable for me to go with bare bottom?ive read alot about this..but nothing states whether it is a must to have sand. so, live rock+HOB and no substrate= ok? btw, is it ok to change 10% of the water each month?

Blown 346 · 02/14/2006, 06:07 AM

Yes 10% of the water each month is fine.

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 06:10 AM

how about a bare bottom tank?can i rely on 1 lbs of LR for 1 gallon and not use any substrate?

Blown 346 · 02/14/2006, 07:40 AM

Yes I wouldnt see why not.

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 07:45 AM

in other boards, some members said that the ph wouldnt be high enough..will that be a problem if i have enough live rock?

Blown 346 · 02/14/2006, 07:47 AM

If ph is a problem you can always use a small airstone to help maintain good PH levels. The smaller of a tank you go with the harderit is to maintain PH. Liverock will help but I would still use a small airstone.

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 07:50 AM

an airstone can help buffer the ph? Are you sure that it'll be fine to go without a substrate?thanks alot for the info btw, i really appreciate it.

MBuck · 02/14/2006, 08:55 AM

To Reef Central

I would do at least bi-weekly water changes in a tank that small...Your water can and will change in a matter of hours if something goes wrong.

The new SW also adds alot of nutrients that your inhabitants need to survive. A fresh water change will keep your parameters in check, and provide your living organisms with new supplements.

Anything is doable, BB, DSB, LPS, softies, FOWLR, but you must keep reading!! I have rad aon here about a guy keeping a 1g nano on his desk....it was awesome.

Good Luck, and keep asking questions!

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 09:01 AM

i just asked above, about using no substrate and just LR. is it ok?.it is not exactly a 30 gallon but a 25-26 gallon hexagon tank.

jgoodrich71 · 02/14/2006, 09:07 AM

There is nothing wrong with running a tank barebottom, any size tank. As with any tank, just keep an eye on water parameters.

Oh yeah,

To Reef Central

theop · 02/14/2006, 09:10 AM

If you go BB, you'll want to follow your pH carefully, especially when the tank is new. Having a crushed coral or aragonite substrate will help to buffer pH some because it is made of calcium carbonate.

You'll likely need to add some type of marine buffer liquid or power to keep your pH high enough. Be sure you get one that is free of phosphates. Also, be sure you get a good pH test kit or better yet, buy an electronic probe (about $100).

Adding an airstone will not buffer your pH, but will help to facilitate gas exchange and lower your CO2 levels, thus keeping your pH higher. CO2 buildup is one reason that pH can be low.

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 09:13 AM

thanks! i'll get another LR tomorrow..the LR is cheaper by 20 ringgit(7 dollars)

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 09:17 AM

btw, arent LR made out of calcium carbonate as well?

jgoodrich71 · 02/14/2006, 10:14 AM

Yes, live rock is calcium carbonate (aragonite)

ckk125 · 02/14/2006, 08:32 PM

which means if i have enough LR, i dont need any substrate?thx a lot guys.

ckk125 · 02/15/2006, 10:38 AM

I bought some dead sea sand.I do have 2 LR but nothing much on it..the LR is fully cured.Is it ok? I just tossed 3 pieces of prawn into the tank..when should I remove it?

ckk125 · 02/15/2006, 08:45 PM

anyone?

ckk125 · 02/16/2006, 02:04 AM

No response?

02/14/2006, 02:28 AM	#1
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	new to SW : FOWLR hey all.. is it possible to have a SW aquarium without any substrate but a few LR?mine is a 30 gallon..can it run just on a HOB filter and some live rocks?Can i use a pair of percula clown or any damsels to cycle the tank?i read about this before but the LFS owner told me not to get any for the time being.should i get one?thanks in advance. Last edited by ckk125; 02/14/2006 at 02:52 AM.

02/14/2006, 08:55 AM	#11
MBuck Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Shelby, Ohio Posts: 452	*To Reef Central* I would do at least bi-weekly water changes in a tank that small...Your water can and will change in a matter of hours if something goes wrong. The new SW also adds alot of nutrients that your inhabitants need to survive. A fresh water change will keep your parameters in check, and provide your living organisms with new supplements. Anything is doable, BB, DSB, LPS, softies, FOWLR, but you must keep reading!! I have rad aon here about a guy keeping a 1g nano on his desk....it was awesome. Good Luck, and keep asking questions! __________________ Marie Do not dwell on the past, improve the future!! ~ M. Current Tank Info: 180g Reef, mated pair B/W percs, 3- pajama cardinals, long-spined urchin, yellow tang, six-line wrasse, hermits, snails, 2 Chromis, LP Angel, Foxface, 2- Royal Grammas, LMB, Sailfin Tang, pink damsel.

02/14/2006, 04:28 AM	#2
Blown 346 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 6,596	Yes you can have a Bare bottom tank without substrate and live rock. You can run a HOB but I would have a good amount of rock for your actual filtration. No, I wouldnt use any fish to cycle a new tank, it is cruel, and they most likely could end up dying from the stress and the high levels in the tank during the cycle. You should cycle your tank with the live rock. I wouldnt get any type of Damsel since they are little terrors, and once they start picking on fish or even nipping at corals you will will have to dis assemble your tank to get them out.

02/14/2006, 04:47 AM	#3
philagothos Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 756	Welcome to RC!!! From what I hear, going bare-bottom involves a lot more than just setting up an aquarium without substrate. If this is the route you want to go I advise doing as much research as you can before starting. For that matter, I advise doing tons of reading before starting anyways. For cycling you can just use the live rock as it cycles. Or you can go to your local grocery store and get a fresh raw shrimp and just toss it in to kick off the cycle.

02/14/2006, 05:49 AM	#4
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	okay..so, is it suitable for me to go with bare bottom?ive read alot about this..but nothing states whether it is a must to have sand. so, live rock+HOB and no substrate= ok? btw, is it ok to change 10% of the water each month?

02/14/2006, 06:07 AM	#5
Blown 346 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 6,596	Yes 10% of the water each month is fine.

02/14/2006, 06:10 AM	#6
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	how about a bare bottom tank?can i rely on 1 lbs of LR for 1 gallon and not use any substrate?

02/14/2006, 07:40 AM	#7
Blown 346 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 6,596	Yes I wouldnt see why not.

02/14/2006, 07:45 AM	#8
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	in other boards, some members said that the ph wouldnt be high enough..will that be a problem if i have enough live rock?

02/14/2006, 07:47 AM	#9
Blown 346 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 6,596	If ph is a problem you can always use a small airstone to help maintain good PH levels. The smaller of a tank you go with the harderit is to maintain PH. Liverock will help but I would still use a small airstone.

02/14/2006, 07:50 AM	#10
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	an airstone can help buffer the ph? Are you sure that it'll be fine to go without a substrate?thanks alot for the info btw, i really appreciate it.

02/14/2006, 09:01 AM	#12
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	i just asked above, about using no substrate and just LR. is it ok?.it is not exactly a 30 gallon but a 25-26 gallon hexagon tank.

02/14/2006, 09:07 AM	#13
jgoodrich71 Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 849	There is nothing wrong with running a tank barebottom, any size tank. As with any tank, just keep an eye on water parameters. Oh yeah, *To Reef Central*

02/14/2006, 09:10 AM	#14
theop Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Durham, NC Posts: 1,493	If you go BB, you'll want to follow your pH carefully, especially when the tank is new. Having a crushed coral or aragonite substrate will help to buffer pH some because it is made of calcium carbonate. You'll likely need to add some type of marine buffer liquid or power to keep your pH high enough. Be sure you get one that is free of phosphates. Also, be sure you get a good pH test kit or better yet, buy an electronic probe (about $100). Adding an airstone will not buffer your pH, but will help to facilitate gas exchange and lower your CO2 levels, thus keeping your pH higher. CO2 buildup is one reason that pH can be low.

02/14/2006, 09:13 AM	#15
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	thanks! i'll get another LR tomorrow..the LR is cheaper by 20 ringgit(7 dollars)

02/14/2006, 09:17 AM	#16
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	btw, arent LR made out of calcium carbonate as well?

02/14/2006, 10:14 AM	#17
jgoodrich71 Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 849	Yes, live rock is calcium carbonate (aragonite)

02/14/2006, 08:32 PM	#18
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	which means if i have enough LR, i dont need any substrate?thx a lot guys.

02/15/2006, 10:38 AM	#19
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	I bought some dead sea sand.I do have 2 LR but nothing much on it..the LR is fully cured.Is it ok? I just tossed 3 pieces of prawn into the tank..when should I remove it?

02/15/2006, 08:45 PM	#20
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	anyone?

02/16/2006, 02:04 AM	#21
ckk125 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 53	No response?