cleanup crew suggestions for a 10 gallon?

piranhaking · 03/02/2006, 10:10 PM

right now i have 1 big scarlet reef crab, 9 small blue leg hermits, 1 astrea snail, and 1 bumble bee snail. What, if anything, should i add.

piranhaking · 03/03/2006, 08:38 PM

BUMP

Andrew · 03/03/2006, 09:16 PM

I would get rid of the hermits and get 10-15 more astrea snails. Hermits will sometimes take the snails shells also.

piranhaking · 03/03/2006, 09:29 PM

unless i see my crabs causing some real problems i plan on keeping them. I know they sometimes eat coral polyps and large ones will steal snails shells, but only my scarlet hermit is anywhere near big enough to do that. I have been considering removing him though just because his shell is so big and im afraid he'll break a coral, but so far no problems. thanks for the responce though. By the way, i picked up another astrea today. I was going to get 2 more but one is all they had. I dont really have the money to get them all at once.

bertoni · 03/03/2006, 10:06 PM

For a 10g tank, I think you have more than enough animals, although you're a bit light on the algae-eating snails. Maybe add a cerith or two.

I'd expect some of the hermit crabs to starve over time unless you target-feed them.

piranhaking · 03/03/2006, 10:41 PM

i have a MAJOR hair algae problem from running regular and "grow light" bulbs on the tank when i didnt know any better. I have since upgraded to all 10,000k and actinic bulbs and the algae is on its way out, but there is still a ton of cleaning up to do. My nitrate stays at 0-1 and i have no phospate, and i use RO water. I didnt to begin with but i have for several months. I have also ran chemipure, phosguard, and quite a bit of carbon in the tank to make sure the water is cleaned up. If food starts looking scarce i will probably donate the crabs to the saltwater tank i work on at school. What are your experiences with conks and coweries? i think they are rather intersting. I know a conk os probably out of the question because they need alot of surface area of sand to stay alive and the tank really isnt big enough for a queen or fighting conk. Also if i do decide to keep them what would be the best way to target feed, pieces of seaweed strips or something like that? i realize it is probably unusual to target feed a cleanup crew, but i really like the look of the crabs in the tank. mabey im crazy, but thats just how i am:P
one last thing. do you have any preference for mexican, eastern pacific, or carribean cerith's?

Bluemorningwind · 03/03/2006, 11:28 PM

I agree with you, crabs are pretty cool critters, however a few more snails would increase the diversity of your crew. Also, adding a small conch and urchin might be an option.

Uless you notice your crabs dying off, don't worry about feeding them. They should be fine. If you need to feed them, you could place them in a seperate container with the food. Flakes, or whatever you have, will do.

piranhaking · 03/04/2006, 03:58 PM

Actually based on what ive read conchs arent really a good choice for a tank as small as mine. I dont remember the exact number, but they need much more surface area of substrate than my tank has. I wanted to get one, but i read up on them first and they really wouldnt work. Fighting conchs dont need as much room as queen conchs, but queens are all i can get around here. I am planning one some more snails, i was kinda wondering about what types would be good. I havent had any dealings with urchins but based on what i know they eat alot of coraline algae, which i dont have much of as it is. The are also thought to munch on corals, so im not really sure thats a risk i want to take. I do agree though that they are a very interesting and if i wasnt worried about my corals being eaten i would probably get one.

Sk8r · 03/04/2006, 05:57 PM

I have about 6 blue-legs and 5 scarlets in a 52g corner, not to mention turbo snails and a fighting conch, and I provide extra shells to keep the crabs from getting desperate and attacking snails. The turbos are quite good, but each type specializes in particular sorts of algae, so I have some moon snails (the ones that show a bright pale disc at the center of their shell coil) that specialize in glass-never have seen them do anything but. Our astraeas (I think) just reproduced, so we have tiny unidentifieds. I'd say the turbos are a really good bet for rocks, and hermits and a conch if you have a sand problem. My LFS will accept healthy critters back if you find you're overstocked, and turbos are easy to catch and detach, ditto the conch.

Bluemorningwind · 03/05/2006, 06:21 AM

I have two conches in in a 55 litre tank. No problem. Been in there for ten months. Best workers in my crew. They burrow in the sand, scale the rocks and keep some of the glass clean.
I'm not sure of the type I have. They are pretty small, about 5-8cm. Maybe you are limited in the type of conches available in the US.

In almost a decade of keeping reefs, I have never had a problem with an urchin consuming any type of coral. I particularly like collectors and short spines.

I wouldn't consider a crew complete without a conch and urchin, but that's just me.

You shouldn't be so scared that you are unwilling to try things. At worst you may want to take something back or give it away, but very few things will cause a real disaster.

The more diverse your CUC is, the better it will be.

bertoni · 03/05/2006, 02:46 PM

Well, some urchins have been known to eat soft corals and the like. They seem to want some high-protein food from time to time. That said, I like urchins, but this tank is only 10g and I don't know of an urchin that will do well in that size tank long-term.

piranhaking · 03/05/2006, 10:19 PM

Bluemorningwind, i agree with your statement about being willing to try different things. I don't like to buy things with out really doing my homework first. I have made enough mistakes to not want to make any more because of rushing into stuff. I have only read very little about urchins and really all that i have read is people saying what they had heard, not from someone that actually has one. Once i have researched them a little more i may try one. Bertoni, as far as long term keeping goes, i dont mind keeping something for a year or so and then haveing to sell or trade it off. I realize my tank size puts alot of limits on me. I do plan to make a larger tank soon though. The tank really has to fit on my desk so i cant find anything that will do what i need. Im not really sure of the size of the tank im gonna make, but its gonna be in the range of 24-28 inches long so that i can use 24 inch bulbs with out them hanging over the ends of the tank like i have now. and probably 18 front to back. It will also have a sump/refug built into the back much like the nano cubes do. I'm curious, whats the footprint measurements of your 55 liter tank?

bertoni · 03/06/2006, 01:32 AM

I'm not sure many of the smaller urchins would get enough to eat in that size tank. I suppose if you're willing to add food for them, that'd be fine, but they're not really cleanup crew at that point. You could try most any urchin that fits. Justy check the diet first, and be ready to add food.

Bluemorningwind · 03/06/2006, 02:04 AM

I believe pencil urchins may be the urchins that you and bertoni are referring to, however, I have kept pencils for goodsom periods without a problem.

You won't need to add food for an urchin that's sized proportionately for your tank, besides, I'm not sure that an urchin would take it.

I reckon a nice little collector would be great, or a short spine if you can't find a collector.

I currently have a short spine. It's the only creature in my crew that will touch a small patch of macro that persists on one of my rocks.

If you were asking me about the footprint of my 55 litre, it's 60cm by 30cm and 36cm high.

bertoni · 03/06/2006, 05:58 PM

Some urchins will definitely take algae sheets, and even Romaine lettuce. Investigating some specific species would help with a choice.

piranhaking · 03/06/2006, 06:18 PM

Bluemorningwind, i was asking about your 55 liter, sorry for the mixup. That doesnt sound much different than a 10 gallon, a few inches each way i think. Sounds like something i will look into. Also i did a little research on conchs and one site i found said some number of square feet (i dont remember the actual number) per conch and some said 1-2 conchs per square foot. I intend to ask around some more about them when i get time. Thanks for the help and advice. Ill let you know what i end up doing when i finally make up my mind and find something.

bertoni · 03/06/2006, 06:59 PM

The amount of space needed depends on the actual species involved. A queen conch would grow larger than the tank, for example. A fighting conch might need 7-8 sq ft of sand. Smaller animals require less space.

piranhaking · 03/30/2006, 09:20 AM

still having problems, but i almost have a diy skimmer and sump made for the tank. I now have 2 scarlet reef crabs 9 blue leg hermits, and 2 blueleg zebra hermits. Maybe the skimmer will fix things

03/02/2006, 10:10 PM	#1
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	cleanup crew suggestions for a 10 gallon? right now i have 1 big scarlet reef crab, 9 small blue leg hermits, 1 astrea snail, and 1 bumble bee snail. What, if anything, should i add.

03/03/2006, 10:06 PM	#5
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	For a 10g tank, I think you have more than enough animals, although you're a bit light on the algae-eating snails. Maybe add a cerith or two. I'd expect some of the hermit crabs to starve over time unless you target-feed them. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/04/2006, 05:57 PM	#9
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	I have about 6 blue-legs and 5 scarlets in a 52g corner, not to mention turbo snails and a fighting conch, and I provide extra shells to keep the crabs from getting desperate and attacking snails. The turbos are quite good, but each type specializes in particular sorts of algae, so I have some moon snails (the ones that show a bright pale disc at the center of their shell coil) that specialize in glass-never have seen them do anything but. Our astraeas (I think) just reproduced, so we have tiny unidentifieds. I'd say the turbos are a really good bet for rocks, and hermits and a conch if you have a sand problem. My LFS will accept healthy critters back if you find you're overstocked, and turbos are easy to catch and detach, ditto the conch. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

03/05/2006, 02:46 PM	#11
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Well, some urchins have been known to eat soft corals and the like. They seem to want some high-protein food from time to time. That said, I like urchins, but this tank is only 10g and I don't know of an urchin that will do well in that size tank long-term. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/06/2006, 01:32 AM	#13
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	I'm not sure many of the smaller urchins would get enough to eat in that size tank. I suppose if you're willing to add food for them, that'd be fine, but they're not really cleanup crew at that point. You could try most any urchin that fits. Justy check the diet first, and be ready to add food. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/03/2006, 08:38 PM	#2
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	BUMP

03/03/2006, 09:16 PM	#3
Andrew Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 13,640	I would get rid of the hermits and get 10-15 more astrea snails. Hermits will sometimes take the snails shells also.

03/03/2006, 09:29 PM	#4
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	unless i see my crabs causing some real problems i plan on keeping them. I know they sometimes eat coral polyps and large ones will steal snails shells, but only my scarlet hermit is anywhere near big enough to do that. I have been considering removing him though just because his shell is so big and im afraid he'll break a coral, but so far no problems. thanks for the responce though. By the way, i picked up another astrea today. I was going to get 2 more but one is all they had. I dont really have the money to get them all at once.

03/03/2006, 10:41 PM	#6
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	i have a MAJOR hair algae problem from running regular and "grow light" bulbs on the tank when i didnt know any better. I have since upgraded to all 10,000k and actinic bulbs and the algae is on its way out, but there is still a ton of cleaning up to do. My nitrate stays at 0-1 and i have no phospate, and i use RO water. I didnt to begin with but i have for several months. I have also ran chemipure, phosguard, and quite a bit of carbon in the tank to make sure the water is cleaned up. If food starts looking scarce i will probably donate the crabs to the saltwater tank i work on at school. What are your experiences with conks and coweries? i think they are rather intersting. I know a conk os probably out of the question because they need alot of surface area of sand to stay alive and the tank really isnt big enough for a queen or fighting conk. Also if i do decide to keep them what would be the best way to target feed, pieces of seaweed strips or something like that? i realize it is probably unusual to target feed a cleanup crew, but i really like the look of the crabs in the tank. mabey im crazy, but thats just how i am:P one last thing. do you have any preference for mexican, eastern pacific, or carribean cerith's?

03/03/2006, 11:28 PM	#7
Bluemorningwind Moved On Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 441	I agree with you, crabs are pretty cool critters, however a few more snails would increase the diversity of your crew. Also, adding a small conch and urchin might be an option. Uless you notice your crabs dying off, don't worry about feeding them. They should be fine. If you need to feed them, you could place them in a seperate container with the food. Flakes, or whatever you have, will do.

03/04/2006, 03:58 PM	#8
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	Actually based on what ive read conchs arent really a good choice for a tank as small as mine. I dont remember the exact number, but they need much more surface area of substrate than my tank has. I wanted to get one, but i read up on them first and they really wouldnt work. Fighting conchs dont need as much room as queen conchs, but queens are all i can get around here. I am planning one some more snails, i was kinda wondering about what types would be good. I havent had any dealings with urchins but based on what i know they eat alot of coraline algae, which i dont have much of as it is. The are also thought to munch on corals, so im not really sure thats a risk i want to take. I do agree though that they are a very interesting and if i wasnt worried about my corals being eaten i would probably get one.

03/05/2006, 06:21 AM	#10
Bluemorningwind Moved On Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 441	I have two conches in in a 55 litre tank. No problem. Been in there for ten months. Best workers in my crew. They burrow in the sand, scale the rocks and keep some of the glass clean. I'm not sure of the type I have. They are pretty small, about 5-8cm. Maybe you are limited in the type of conches available in the US. In almost a decade of keeping reefs, I have never had a problem with an urchin consuming any type of coral. I particularly like collectors and short spines. I wouldn't consider a crew complete without a conch and urchin, but that's just me. You shouldn't be so scared that you are unwilling to try things. At worst you may want to take something back or give it away, but very few things will cause a real disaster. The more diverse your CUC is, the better it will be.

03/05/2006, 10:19 PM	#12
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	Bluemorningwind, i agree with your statement about being willing to try different things. I don't like to buy things with out really doing my homework first. I have made enough mistakes to not want to make any more because of rushing into stuff. I have only read very little about urchins and really all that i have read is people saying what they had heard, not from someone that actually has one. Once i have researched them a little more i may try one. Bertoni, as far as long term keeping goes, i dont mind keeping something for a year or so and then haveing to sell or trade it off. I realize my tank size puts alot of limits on me. I do plan to make a larger tank soon though. The tank really has to fit on my desk so i cant find anything that will do what i need. Im not really sure of the size of the tank im gonna make, but its gonna be in the range of 24-28 inches long so that i can use 24 inch bulbs with out them hanging over the ends of the tank like i have now. and probably 18 front to back. It will also have a sump/refug built into the back much like the nano cubes do. I'm curious, whats the footprint measurements of your 55 liter tank?

03/06/2006, 02:04 AM	#14
Bluemorningwind Moved On Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 441	I believe pencil urchins may be the urchins that you and bertoni are referring to, however, I have kept pencils for goodsom periods without a problem. You won't need to add food for an urchin that's sized proportionately for your tank, besides, I'm not sure that an urchin would take it. I reckon a nice little collector would be great, or a short spine if you can't find a collector. I currently have a short spine. It's the only creature in my crew that will touch a small patch of macro that persists on one of my rocks. If you were asking me about the footprint of my 55 litre, it's 60cm by 30cm and 36cm high.

03/06/2006, 05:58 PM	#15
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Some urchins will definitely take algae sheets, and even Romaine lettuce. Investigating some specific species would help with a choice. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/06/2006, 06:18 PM	#16
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	Bluemorningwind, i was asking about your 55 liter, sorry for the mixup. That doesnt sound much different than a 10 gallon, a few inches each way i think. Sounds like something i will look into. Also i did a little research on conchs and one site i found said some number of square feet (i dont remember the actual number) per conch and some said 1-2 conchs per square foot. I intend to ask around some more about them when i get time. Thanks for the help and advice. Ill let you know what i end up doing when i finally make up my mind and find something.

03/06/2006, 06:59 PM	#17
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	The amount of space needed depends on the actual species involved. A queen conch would grow larger than the tank, for example. A fighting conch might need 7-8 sq ft of sand. Smaller animals require less space. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/30/2006, 09:20 AM	#18
piranhaking Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 321	still having problems, but i almost have a diy skimmer and sump made for the tank. I now have 2 scarlet reef crabs 9 blue leg hermits, and 2 blueleg zebra hermits. Maybe the skimmer will fix things