Heat sinks for Poseidon Titanium pumps??

sumpfish · 07/23/2006, 06:06 PM

I love the quietness of my Poseidon Titanium pump, but I'm not thrilled by the heat gain it puts into my reef tank. I have a chiller, but I was wondering if anyone knows if there are heat sinks available for the Poseidon pumps that could be clamped onto the pump motor to help cool the motor and reduce the heat transferred to the water??

Thanks,

Mark.

guntercb · 07/23/2006, 07:15 PM

Mark, I am tagging along. I want to know about heat sinks too.

Thanks,
Chris

NormanB · 07/24/2006, 12:13 PM

Hi guys! I have a T-3 and yes, like you, don't like the added heat. I don't have a heatsink on mine, but here is what I did. I built a 3 sided box that fits over the pump. That is a top, front and back with the inlet side and the other side open. I then cut a hole in the top piece about 3' so I could mount a fan on it. I have the fan blowing down onto the pump. I can't say for sure what effect it had on water temp, but before the fan mod the pump was too hot to touch for very long and now I can touch it for as long as I want. Yes, it's still warm, but not to the same degree. Maybe all I have done is extended the life of the pump and not changed the water temp. If you want I can post a pic tonight or tomorrow.

BeanAnimal · 07/24/2006, 01:02 PM

The fan mod does not do very much to cool the pump. Air is not a very good conductor of heat and the smooth pump body (and sticker) don't help.

I had been in the process of designing a clamp on heatsink for these pumps. I had intended on having them manufactured. The problem is that there is simply not enough demand to go through the trouble. I also found some "plastic" heatsink material that was thermoformable. But the problem was setup fees for a small production run of 50 units or so. I was not sure I could get rid of them so scrapped the idea.

You can however buy some thin aluminum and shape and clamp it. Use thermal epoxy to glue the fins on.

Bean

TroyPierce · 07/24/2006, 02:12 PM

Hmmm. Guess I have a defective T-4. I've been running it for a year and a half with no added heat. I have a 4" fan blowing on the motor and it stay's nice and cool.

BeanAnimal · 07/24/2006, 04:20 PM

Troy, it adds heat. (most mag drive pumps do, and even some shaft drives add heat).

I run (2) of them on my tank, and even though they do raise the temp, it is very managable

sumpfish · 07/26/2006, 02:08 PM

Well, guess I'll have to come up with something myself. I was thinking of a clamp-on aluminum (or perhaps copper) finned heat sink. If I come up with something useful, I'll post my results.

Here's an interesting link I found on making a DIY heat sink for any electric motor:

http://www.dream-models.com/eco/Heat_Sink.html

Mark.

FuzzyLogic · 07/26/2006, 02:29 PM

IMHO, you would need a heatsink AND a fan to make any substantial difference in heat. Now your back to square one (noise)

sumpfish · 07/26/2006, 02:35 PM

I agree, a fan is necessary. But a small fan, 2" or 3", would be all you'd need, and if its behind the tank I don't think you'd hear it.

Mark.

lesd · 07/27/2006, 04:09 PM

Tagging along. I recently got a T3 to power my skimmer and it adds a ton of heat. I think the backpressure from the beckett injector makes things even worse.

On a positive note, it does work as a nice pump for a PM Bullet 2, and it is much quieter than the MAK4 I had previously.

-- Les

sumpfish · 08/08/2006, 04:18 PM

Just a quick update on my Poseidon pump heat sink project. After doing a LOT of searching, apparently nobody makes a heat sink for this application. So I have begun to cut some heat sink fins out of copper sheet (copper due to the high thermal conductivity). They are shaped so they can be clamped onto the pump with 2 hose clamps. I have also ordered two 12v, 120mA, 80mm fans (32cfm) from BG Micro in Texas. They are rated at 27dB noise level, so they will be effectively silent, as the Poseidon is rated at 28dB. I also checked the pump surface temp with a digital meter. It reads 113 deg F, compared to 95 deg F for my fan-cooled Coralife Turbo-Sea pump. I'll post more info as I get farther along.

BeanAnimal · 08/08/2006, 04:32 PM

sumpfish...

I have done the same thing, but was not real pleased with the results for the amount of effort involved. I used thermal expoxy to glue fins onto the copper sheet.

Let is know how your setup works.

A few of us are still working on having some heatsinks manufactured for this specific task and I am trying to get a friend to cast a few aluminum prototypes.

mfinn · 08/08/2006, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sumpfish
I love the quietness of my Poseidon Titanium pump, but I'm not thrilled by the heat gain it puts into my reef tank. I have a chiller, but I was wondering if anyone knows if there are heat sinks available for the Poseidon pumps that could be clamped onto the pump motor to help cool the motor and reduce the heat transferred to the water??

Thanks,

Mark.

Are you saying your chiller can't keep up with just one Poseidon pump?
I would think there would be other heat issues.
I use a P-4 on my 180. I knew what has been said about them so I bought a 6" clip-on fan and pointed it at the wet end and I have had no gain in heat.
In fact I plan on running 3 of them on my new 240.
I thought I would have to try out the mod for the Pan World pumps, but didn't need to try.

Petsolutions · 08/08/2006, 04:53 PM

I would check into CPU cooling systems. They have excellent Copper heat sinks, some with built in fans, others with a water cooling system. They are small enough to attach to the pump. CPU's generally run 50-70C, which is a bit warmer than the pump should be running. This might do the job.

Don Roberts
Petsolutions Customer Service

BeanAnimal · 08/08/2006, 04:53 PM

You cant mod the T4 like that. The back end of the pump holds the electronics and power connection. There is nothing to attach the heatsink to

I run two T4s on a 75G

sumpfish · 08/08/2006, 07:14 PM

I'm running a small 1/10 hp PCI chiller on my 75 gal, and it can keep up with the heat load, but I'd rather work on reducing the heat input so the chiller doesn't have to run as long. Think of it as an engineering challenge......... Also, I would like to replace my Coralife pump with another Poseidon pump to quiet the system down (its in my living room), and that would only increase the heat load. If nothing works, I can always throw in the towel and just get a larger chiller.......

skylar · 08/10/2006, 11:39 AM

All I ever read is these pumps add so much heat to the tank. I just don't find that to be true. They run hot - in fact very hot, but the transfer of heat to the water is so little I havn't even bothered with pointing fans at my 2 T3's or my T4.

I have tested this by replacing a T3 with a little giant and taking temp reading exiting both pumps(after several hours of run time). The T3 fluctuated between 78* and 79* (water temp) pump temp was 116*. The little Giant water stayed at 78* and the pump was 97*. I did this with my lights off and chiller on. However the chiller doesn't turn on until the tank hits 80*. That is a .5 to 1.0 heat difference. With my lights on the tank runs from 79* to 80* with the chiller cycleing on at 80* 1 to 4 times every 2 hours.

My point is the added heat from the T3's is nothing compared to the heat from other sources - like lights. This is just my experience on my system.

mfinn · 08/10/2006, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sumpfish
I'm running a small 1/10 hp PCI chiller on my 75 gal, and it can keep up with the heat load, but I'd rather work on reducing the heat input so the chiller doesn't have to run as long. Think of it as an engineering challenge.........

Yeah, I'm inclined to do the same thing some times.

But sometimes I have to remind myself, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

07/23/2006, 06:06 PM	#1
sumpfish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Merritt Island, Fl. Posts: 61	Heat sinks for Poseidon Titanium pumps?? I love the quietness of my Poseidon Titanium pump, but I'm not thrilled by the heat gain it puts into my reef tank. I have a chiller, but I was wondering if anyone knows if there are heat sinks available for the Poseidon pumps that could be clamped onto the pump motor to help cool the motor and reduce the heat transferred to the water?? Thanks, Mark.

07/24/2006, 02:12 PM	#5
TroyPierce Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Baltimore, Maryland Posts: 759	Hmmm. Guess I have a defective T-4. I've been running it for a year and a half with no added heat. I have a 4" fan blowing on the motor and it stay's nice and cool. __________________ "Everythings better, down where it's wetter" ><((((º> ><((((º> Current Tank Info: 120 gallon reef, 2x175W MH and 2x40W actinic

07/26/2006, 02:08 PM	#7
sumpfish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Merritt Island, Fl. Posts: 61	Well, guess I'll have to come up with something myself. I was thinking of a clamp-on aluminum (or perhaps copper) finned heat sink. If I come up with something useful, I'll post my results. Here's an interesting link I found on making a DIY heat sink for any electric motor: http://www.dream-models.com/eco/Heat_Sink.html Mark. Last edited by sumpfish; 07/26/2006 at 02:27 PM.

08/08/2006, 04:53 PM	#14
Petsolutions Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Beavercreek, Ohio Posts: 64	HEAT CONTROL I would check into CPU cooling systems. They have excellent Copper heat sinks, some with built in fans, others with a water cooling system. They are small enough to attach to the pump. CPU's generally run 50-70C, which is a bit warmer than the pump should be running. This might do the job. Don Roberts Petsolutions Customer Service

08/10/2006, 11:39 AM	#17
skylar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 158	All I ever read is these pumps add so much heat to the tank. I just don't find that to be true. They run hot - in fact very hot, but the transfer of heat to the water is so little I havn't even bothered with pointing fans at my 2 T3's or my T4. I have tested this by replacing a T3 with a little giant and taking temp reading exiting both pumps(after several hours of run time). The T3 fluctuated between 78* and 79* (water temp) pump temp was 116. The little Giant water stayed at 78 and the pump was 97. I did this with my lights off and chiller on. However the chiller doesn't turn on until the tank hits 80. That is a .5 to 1.0 heat difference. With my lights on the tank runs from 79* to 80* with the chiller cycleing on at 80* 1 to 4 times every 2 hours. My point is the added heat from the T3's is nothing compared to the heat from other sources - like lights. This is just my experience on my system. __________________ Addicted 14 years. Current tank:300g Reef w/ lot's of fish, SPS, LPS, and Clams. 4 x 400w MH 4 x 110 VHO actinic. MTC Ca reactor ER 12-1 & ASMG4Xrc.

07/23/2006, 07:15 PM	#2
guntercb Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Land O Lakes, FL Posts: 1,626	Mark, I am tagging along. I want to know about heat sinks too. Thanks, Chris

07/24/2006, 12:13 PM	#3
NormanB Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Mars, PA Posts: 163	Hi guys! I have a T-3 and yes, like you, don't like the added heat. I don't have a heatsink on mine, but here is what I did. I built a 3 sided box that fits over the pump. That is a top, front and back with the inlet side and the other side open. I then cut a hole in the top piece about 3' so I could mount a fan on it. I have the fan blowing down onto the pump. I can't say for sure what effect it had on water temp, but before the fan mod the pump was too hot to touch for very long and now I can touch it for as long as I want. Yes, it's still warm, but not to the same degree. Maybe all I have done is extended the life of the pump and not changed the water temp. If you want I can post a pic tonight or tomorrow.

07/24/2006, 01:02 PM	#4
BeanAnimal Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 20,772	The fan mod does not do very much to cool the pump. Air is not a very good conductor of heat and the smooth pump body (and sticker) don't help. I had been in the process of designing a clamp on heatsink for these pumps. I had intended on having them manufactured. The problem is that there is simply not enough demand to go through the trouble. I also found some "plastic" heatsink material that was thermoformable. But the problem was setup fees for a small production run of 50 units or so. I was not sure I could get rid of them so scrapped the idea. You can however buy some thin aluminum and shape and clamp it. Use thermal epoxy to glue the fins on. Bean

07/24/2006, 04:20 PM	#6
BeanAnimal Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 20,772	Troy, it adds heat. (most mag drive pumps do, and even some shaft drives add heat). I run (2) of them on my tank, and even though they do raise the temp, it is very managable

07/26/2006, 02:29 PM	#8
FuzzyLogic Registered Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: South FL Posts: 258	IMHO, you would need a heatsink AND a fan to make any substantial difference in heat. Now your back to square one (noise)

07/26/2006, 02:35 PM	#9
sumpfish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Merritt Island, Fl. Posts: 61	I agree, a fan is necessary. But a small fan, 2" or 3", would be all you'd need, and if its behind the tank I don't think you'd hear it. Mark.

07/27/2006, 04:09 PM	#10
lesd Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 134	Tagging along. I recently got a T3 to power my skimmer and it adds a ton of heat. I think the backpressure from the beckett injector makes things even worse. On a positive note, it does work as a nice pump for a PM Bullet 2, and it is much quieter than the MAK4 I had previously. -- Les

08/08/2006, 04:18 PM	#11
sumpfish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Merritt Island, Fl. Posts: 61	Just a quick update on my Poseidon pump heat sink project. After doing a LOT of searching, apparently nobody makes a heat sink for this application. So I have begun to cut some heat sink fins out of copper sheet (copper due to the high thermal conductivity). They are shaped so they can be clamped onto the pump with 2 hose clamps. I have also ordered two 12v, 120mA, 80mm fans (32cfm) from BG Micro in Texas. They are rated at 27dB noise level, so they will be effectively silent, as the Poseidon is rated at 28dB. I also checked the pump surface temp with a digital meter. It reads 113 deg F, compared to 95 deg F for my fan-cooled Coralife Turbo-Sea pump. I'll post more info as I get farther along.

08/08/2006, 04:32 PM	#12
BeanAnimal Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 20,772	sumpfish... I have done the same thing, but was not real pleased with the results for the amount of effort involved. I used thermal expoxy to glue fins onto the copper sheet. Let is know how your setup works. A few of us are still working on having some heatsinks manufactured for this specific task and I am trying to get a friend to cast a few aluminum prototypes.

08/08/2006, 07:14 PM	#16
sumpfish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Merritt Island, Fl. Posts: 61	I'm running a small 1/10 hp PCI chiller on my 75 gal, and it can keep up with the heat load, but I'd rather work on reducing the heat input so the chiller doesn't have to run as long. Think of it as an engineering challenge......... Also, I would like to replace my Coralife pump with another Poseidon pump to quiet the system down (its in my living room), and that would only increase the heat load. If nothing works, I can always throw in the towel and just get a larger chiller.......