PC, T5, VHO Please Help Me Understand

jlfnjlf · 09/29/2006, 05:04 PM

I would like to understand why people make the lighting choices they do. I know economics plays a a role, but I am hoping to understand the technical reasons.

I am building an 80g reef tank, but I have not bottomed out on the lighting yet. I currently have a 30g with 192W PC lighting that id doing great. However I do not keep any clams or SPS in the tank. I have heard of people that have had success with just about everything except clams under fluorescent. Now I understand all fluorescent are not created equally, but what I do not understand are the differences.

I am also considering one 175W MH on one end of the tank for SPS and clams, but I also want to keep some corals that not like so much light on the other end as well.

So basically I am lost and confused on how to light this tank. Would some of the experts please educate me on how to make the best decision for my tank. My goal is lots of softies and some LPS with a few SPS. I want a clam, but is that enough of a reason to go MH (I'm not sure yet)?

Thank you in advance.

John

Hockeydad · 09/29/2006, 05:09 PM

I am changing from two vho actinics (46.5 in.) to four 36 in. actinic T5's. I will let you know what I think.

Hockeydad · 09/29/2006, 05:10 PM

I also run three 400 20k PFO's over a euro brace tank home to many sps. Love lots of light!

DesertBandits · 09/29/2006, 06:46 PM

I hope this gives you a good start:

Power compact: by far the worst light. The dual tube is very inefficient because most of the light bounces back into the bulb or up into the canopy. Best case scenario, only 55% of the light produced will ever make it into the tank. Also the colors are ****.

VHO: very outdated, about 25years old, and high power consumption, but the VHO super actinic bulb gives a tank a unique fluoresence and bluish look to colors that cant be replicated with any other bulb. This is the only reason people are still talking about VHO.

T5HO: The new cutting edge fluorescent technology. Very low power consumption with very high output. With individual reflectors on each bulb more than 90% of each bulb's light gets into the tank. This is what I use, and many others too (check the T5 thread for more info). The output of T5 per watt is equal to that of metal halide, and there are new colors of T5 bulbs comming out all the time. If I were you I would check out reefgeek.com for their 4 bulb TEK T5 Lights. This may seem expensive, but you will never find yourself upgrading because you bought a piece of junk.

Metal Halide: For along time MH was the only way to get high intensity lighting on your tank till T5HO came out. MH is worse than T5 in the fact that it can raise a tank's water temp with it's intense heat. However, MH is the only way to get 'glimmer lines' which look really nice.

Overall I would recommend you lurk around the t5 thread and research MH. You can also use both types of lighting together with a 'maristar' light fixture, though it is more expensive. I hope this is a decent overview that answers some questions, now you need to do some of your own research to figure out what you like the best.

DesertBandits · 09/29/2006, 06:47 PM

BTW, either T5 or MH can keep any clam or coral you want.

jlfnjlf · 09/29/2006, 07:25 PM

Couldn't you get the glimmer lines with a hand full of white LEDs? The blues do it at night...

I feel another DIY project developing in my head. I am gonnna grab my LED flashlight and see now.

jlfnjlf · 09/29/2006, 07:32 PM

so how many 48 inch tubes would I need in a 20 inch water depth? Is there a watt per gallon rule of thumb for the T5HO lights?

Oh and as for the prices they are right in line with what I am hoping to spend.

jlfnjlf · 09/29/2006, 08:32 PM

OK so I am reading some these other T5 threads, and I am seeing a great contrast in opinions.

And you know what they say about opinions...

Does anyone know of any reliable data comparing MH to T5 lighting for the purposes of reef keeping? Reading some of the more heated threads I am starting to think I am going to need a PhD in the physics of the wave properties of light to even scratch the surface.

Thanks,

John

DesertBandits · 09/29/2006, 08:52 PM

Ok, im back. About LEDs, you're right. Any 'point source light' will give glimmer lines. From your question it was hard to tell how noob you are. I didn't mention LEDs in an attempt not to confuse you. As of now LEDs cant light a tank without alot of knowhow and DIY, though this may change in the near future (a few years).

So for the T5 TEK lights, 4 bulbs would be great for your tank. I would go 1GE 6500K, 2 ATI Blueplusses, 1 Superactinic. If you like a more bluish look, swap out the GE for an ATI Aquablue. This setup would be good to grow whatever you want, without killing LPS from too much light, though you may not be able to have SPS low in the tank. If you want to have SPS where ever you want, go 6 bulbs. If you go 6, you will need to acclimate some corals by putting them in a shady spot, and they may never be able to be in the full light blast. For 6 you could go: 1GE, 1 aquablue, 3blueplus, 1 Superactnic.

hope that helps.

09/29/2006, 05:04 PM	#1
jlfnjlf Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Out of my mind (in Citrus Heights, Ca) Posts: 824	PC, T5, VHO Please Help Me Understand I would like to understand why people make the lighting choices they do. I know economics plays a a role, but I am hoping to understand the technical reasons. I am building an 80g reef tank, but I have not bottomed out on the lighting yet. I currently have a 30g with 192W PC lighting that id doing great. However I do not keep any clams or SPS in the tank. I have heard of people that have had success with just about everything except clams under fluorescent. Now I understand all fluorescent are not created equally, but what I do not understand are the differences. I am also considering one 175W MH on one end of the tank for SPS and clams, but I also want to keep some corals that not like so much light on the other end as well. So basically I am lost and confused on how to light this tank. Would some of the experts please educate me on how to make the best decision for my tank. My goal is lots of softies and some LPS with a few SPS. I want a clam, but is that enough of a reason to go MH (I'm not sure yet)? Thank you in advance. John __________________ John L. Ford I never want to be an expert, I just want to know all the stuff they know. Then I can decide for myself if it is valid information. Current Tank Info: SAID GOOD BY TO REEF ON FEBRUARY 23 2008 125g planted discus tank

09/29/2006, 05:09 PM	#2
Hockeydad Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 273	Switching to T5's I am changing from two vho actinics (46.5 in.) to four 36 in. actinic T5's. I will let you know what I think. __________________ 120 gal. Euro design glass tank with three 400 watt PFO de and actinics. Closed loop Oceanmotion Super Squirt. 40 gal refugium, 120 gal sump. Knop/Geo reactors. All sps!! Current Tank Info: 120 Euro all sps

09/29/2006, 05:10 PM	#3
Hockeydad Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 273	lots of light I also run three 400 20k PFO's over a euro brace tank home to many sps. Love lots of light! __________________ 120 gal. Euro design glass tank with three 400 watt PFO de and actinics. Closed loop Oceanmotion Super Squirt. 40 gal refugium, 120 gal sump. Knop/Geo reactors. All sps!! Current Tank Info: 120 Euro all sps

09/29/2006, 07:25 PM	#6
jlfnjlf Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Out of my mind (in Citrus Heights, Ca) Posts: 824	Couldn't you get the glimmer lines with a hand full of white LEDs? The blues do it at night... I feel another DIY project developing in my head. I am gonnna grab my LED flashlight and see now. __________________ John L. Ford I never want to be an expert, I just want to know all the stuff they know. Then I can decide for myself if it is valid information. Current Tank Info: SAID GOOD BY TO REEF ON FEBRUARY 23 2008 125g planted discus tank

09/29/2006, 07:32 PM	#7
jlfnjlf Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Out of my mind (in Citrus Heights, Ca) Posts: 824	so how many 48 inch tubes would I need in a 20 inch water depth? Is there a watt per gallon rule of thumb for the T5HO lights? Oh and as for the prices they are right in line with what I am hoping to spend. __________________ John L. Ford I never want to be an expert, I just want to know all the stuff they know. Then I can decide for myself if it is valid information. Current Tank Info: SAID GOOD BY TO REEF ON FEBRUARY 23 2008 125g planted discus tank

09/29/2006, 06:46 PM	#4
DesertBandits Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Central Jersey Posts: 430	I hope this gives you a good start: Power compact: by far the worst light. The dual tube is very inefficient because most of the light bounces back into the bulb or up into the canopy. Best case scenario, only 55% of the light produced will ever make it into the tank. Also the colors are ****. VHO: very outdated, about 25years old, and high power consumption, but the VHO super actinic bulb gives a tank a unique fluoresence and bluish look to colors that cant be replicated with any other bulb. This is the only reason people are still talking about VHO. T5HO: The new cutting edge fluorescent technology. Very low power consumption with very high output. With individual reflectors on each bulb more than 90% of each bulb's light gets into the tank. This is what I use, and many others too (check the T5 thread for more info). The output of T5 per watt is equal to that of metal halide, and there are new colors of T5 bulbs comming out all the time. If I were you I would check out reefgeek.com for their 4 bulb TEK T5 Lights. This may seem expensive, but you will never find yourself upgrading because you bought a piece of junk. Metal Halide: For along time MH was the only way to get high intensity lighting on your tank till T5HO came out. MH is worse than T5 in the fact that it can raise a tank's water temp with it's intense heat. However, MH is the only way to get 'glimmer lines' which look really nice. Overall I would recommend you lurk around the t5 thread and research MH. You can also use both types of lighting together with a 'maristar' light fixture, though it is more expensive. I hope this is a decent overview that answers some questions, now you need to do some of your own research to figure out what you like the best.

09/29/2006, 06:47 PM	#5
DesertBandits Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Central Jersey Posts: 430	BTW, either T5 or MH can keep any clam or coral you want.

09/29/2006, 08:32 PM	#8
jlfnjlf Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Out of my mind (in Citrus Heights, Ca) Posts: 824	OK so I am reading some these other T5 threads, and I am seeing a great contrast in opinions. And you know what they say about opinions... Does anyone know of any reliable data comparing MH to T5 lighting for the purposes of reef keeping? Reading some of the more heated threads I am starting to think I am going to need a PhD in the physics of the wave properties of light to even scratch the surface. Thanks, John __________________ John L. Ford I never want to be an expert, I just want to know all the stuff they know. Then I can decide for myself if it is valid information. Current Tank Info: SAID GOOD BY TO REEF ON FEBRUARY 23 2008 125g planted discus tank

09/29/2006, 08:52 PM	#9
DesertBandits Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Central Jersey Posts: 430	Ok, im back. About LEDs, you're right. Any 'point source light' will give glimmer lines. From your question it was hard to tell how noob you are. I didn't mention LEDs in an attempt not to confuse you. As of now LEDs cant light a tank without alot of knowhow and DIY, though this may change in the near future (a few years). So for the T5 TEK lights, 4 bulbs would be great for your tank. I would go 1GE 6500K, 2 ATI Blueplusses, 1 Superactinic. If you like a more bluish look, swap out the GE for an ATI Aquablue. This setup would be good to grow whatever you want, without killing LPS from too much light, though you may not be able to have SPS low in the tank. If you want to have SPS where ever you want, go 6 bulbs. If you go 6, you will need to acclimate some corals by putting them in a shady spot, and they may never be able to be in the full light blast. For 6 you could go: 1GE, 1 aquablue, 3blueplus, 1 Superactnic. hope that helps.