lookin for some help

[reeferrmadness]

im new. which is probably why my post is almost definately in the wrong place. im also new to saltwater. im about 6 months into my first tank and there are some things i would change if i could go back and start over so im building a new tank..
id like to do a 20 gallon long mixed reef w/nem and i was wondering if these things would be good/ too much/ not what i need. if im missing something please let me know
1.) gfo and carbon reactor
2.) skimmer
3.) auto top off
4.) good heater
5.) good light
6.) powerheads to keep water moving

i want to do a 3-3.5 inch deep sand bed with a generous portion of live rock.
ive read that a skimmer might not be necessary on such a small tank but id like a clean system.
also another question: is carbon and gfo the best things to run in a reactor?
i was planning on running kalk wasser through the auto top off system..is that a bad thing? what other things do i need to keep lps?

again im sorry my post is in the wrong place and if i get a few answers i promise to put all future posts in the correct location
thanks everybody

ps. i didnt believe saltwater tanks could be addicting. i am now a happy believer

[Reeferz412]

Will you be running a sump? That will help A LOT. A skimmer is not needed but, its good to have and I have one over my 20 and it skims up some dark junk. I dont have any reactors on my 20 gallon, all I have is chemi pure in a bag and it works wonders for me. As for the kalk wasser question, yes you can run it in your ato.

Take it from me, a 20 gallon reef tank owner (1 1/2 years), get a sump.

[Ron Reefman]

1.) gfo and carbon reactor
Why do you want to run GFO or carbon? If you don't know why, don't do it. I have a reactor plumbed into my system, but haven't run either GFO or carbon in the 2 years the tanks have been set up. If you don't have an algae issue, why run GFO? If you do water changes and run good filtration, why run carbon? Especially in a 20g system.
2.) skimmer
Yes, it's just that simple. And if you think you may upgrade to a bigger tank (most of us go through this) get a bigger skimmer than you need and you can use it on the next bigger tank (unless you go from the 20g to a 180g).
3.) auto top off
You don't need it, but it's a nice convience. I manually top off over 2 gallons a day and I use the top off water to dose calcium and soda ash. I find it helps keep me in touch with what's going on in my system.
4.) good heater
Depends on there you live and how cold you let your living space get.
5.) good light
Not a 'good light', get a VERY good light. If you can afford it, get a GREAT light. You'll never be disappointed with a light that is better than you need.
6.) powerheads to keep water moving
You want 2 things: 1) Enough water movement, 2) Some degree of randomness and good tank coverage with that water movement. A 20g tank with basic stuff needs 10x (or 200gph) of water movement. The more difficult your animals are to keep, like lps & sps corals or anemones, the more flow you need. 30x-40x (600-800gph). Getting full coverage in a 20g tank is a bit easier than in a big tank, but you would still be better off, IMHO, with 2 or 3 smaller powerheads than 1 big one. You'll get better coverage of every cubic inch of the tank, and if 1 fails, your tank isn't completely without flow until you find out the powerhead quit working.

i want to do a 3-3.5 inch deep sand bed with a generous portion of live rock.
Why a 3-3.5" deep sand bed? It's more than you need for most critters and not nearly enough to be a DSB which is better done in a sump anyway. I think 2" is more like the average in most tanks I see.

And as suggested above, seriously consider a sump or even a sump/refugium. You can almost double your water volume, have a place to put your skimmer, do a DSB and grow macro algae which helps eliminate the need for a GFO or carbon reactor (and you won't need to buy chemicals for a refugium).

[consumed corals]

Ron hit the nail right on the head again....if you follow the steps Ron laid out above you will be in good shape. Don't always feel you have to have a piece of equipment just because you notice others using it, THE BEST THING TO DO IS WATCH YOUR SYSTEM AND CLOSELY MONITOR YOUR AQUATIC LIFE AND YOU WILL BE FINE.

[rogermccray]

Great advice from Ron.

The only thing I have a bit different of an opinion on is carbon. I can see quite a difference when I replace my carbon. My water looks so much more clear.

[reef4life07]

Well said Ron...

[reeferrmadness]

Thanks for all the info. ive been kicking the idea around in my head of running like a 10 gal sump if i end up getting a stand for it, the only problem (and the only reason im not going bigger than 20) is that im in college and im not really supposed to have anything bigger than a beta bowl.
i wanted to run carbon and gfo as some sort of a filter..i wasnt sure if getting like a cheap whisper filter or something would be better..i figured a reactor would let me use carbon to keep the water clear and gfo if ever i had phosphate/algae issues. just seemed like more choice.

other than natural filtration using the live rock what is the best thing to use?

as for the sandbed i was thinking 3-3.5" would be enough to get that anaerobic area for denitrification purposes. if not i might scratch the idea unless i do a sump cause its a pretty shallow tank and more than 3.5 inches of sand wont leave me for much space.

ill have to look into a sump idea
thanks everybody

[jerseygurl]

Originally Posted by Ron Reefman

1.) gfo and carbon reactor
[COLOR="Blue"]Why do you want to run GFO or carbon? If you don't know why, don't do it. I have a reactor plumbed into my system, but haven't run either GFO or carbon in the 2 years the tanks have been set up. If you don't have an algae issue, why run GFO?COLOR]

To avoid phosphate buildup in your tank. If you're not actively removing phosphates with GFO chances are they're accumulating in your tank. When you DO have an algae outbreak it'll be much harder to fix. Even if you don't run the reactor all the time they are still an excellent and cheap addition to your tank.

[BigCountry74]

Originally Posted by Ron Reefman

1.) gfo and carbon reactor
Why do you want to run GFO or carbon? If you don't know why, don't do it. I have a reactor plumbed into my system, but haven't run either GFO or carbon in the 2 years the tanks have been set up. If you don't have an algae issue, why run GFO? If you do water changes and run good filtration, why run carbon? Especially in a 20g system.
2.) skimmer
Yes, it's just that simple. And if you think you may upgrade to a bigger tank (most of us go through this) get a bigger skimmer than you need and you can use it on the next bigger tank (unless you go from the 20g to a 180g).
3.) auto top off
You don't need it, but it's a nice convience. I manually top off over 2 gallons a day and I use the top off water to dose calcium and soda ash. I find it helps keep me in touch with what's going on in my system.
4.) good heater
Depends on there you live and how cold you let your living space get.
5.) good light
Not a 'good light', get a VERY good light. If you can afford it, get a GREAT light. You'll never be disappointed with a light that is better than you need.
6.) powerheads to keep water moving
You want 2 things: 1) Enough water movement, 2) Some degree of randomness and good tank coverage with that water movement. A 20g tank with basic stuff needs 10x (or 200gph) of water movement. The more difficult your animals are to keep, like lps & sps corals or anemones, the more flow you need. 30x-40x (600-800gph). Getting full coverage in a 20g tank is a bit easier than in a big tank, but you would still be better off, IMHO, with 2 or 3 smaller powerheads than 1 big one. You'll get better coverage of every cubic inch of the tank, and if 1 fails, your tank isn't completely without flow until you find out the powerhead quit working.

i want to do a 3-3.5 inch deep sand bed with a generous portion of live rock.
Why a 3-3.5" deep sand bed? It's more than you need for most critters and not nearly enough to be a DSB which is better done in a sump anyway. I think 2" is more like the average in most tanks I see.

And as suggested above, seriously consider a sump or even a sump/refugium. You can almost double your water volume, have a place to put your skimmer, do a DSB and grow macro algae which helps eliminate the need for a GFO or carbon reactor (and you won't need to buy chemicals for a refugium).

x2

Ron is all over it.

20g is a small tank. Keep it simple.

[reeferrmadness]

if i run a sump/refugium and run carbon/gfo would it hurt the macro algae or will it just not grow as fast?
also what would be a nice overflow box to avoid drilling the aquarium?
ive read that lifereef makes the best quality but it is really so much better than eshoppe's that its worth an extra 60-70 bucks?

[Reeferz412]

Go with CPR if possible or lifereef as you stated. You really awant to avoid those tube siphoning overflows. They are really annoying as they can lose their siphon easily and sometimes an air bubble forms at the top fo the tube and you slowly lose your siphon. That is one thing you don't want to skimp on, unless you want to take the risk of having water all over your floor, or your pump burning out.

[BigBarnacles]

Originally Posted by ron reefman

1.) gfo and carbon reactor
why do you want to run gfo or carbon? If you don't know why, don't do it. I have a reactor plumbed into my system, but haven't run either gfo or carbon in the 2 years the tanks have been set up. If you don't have an algae issue, why run gfo? If you do water changes and run good filtration, why run carbon? Especially in a 20g system.
2.) skimmer
yes, it's just that simple. And if you think you may upgrade to a bigger tank (most of us go through this) get a bigger skimmer than you need and you can use it on the next bigger tank (unless you go from the 20g to a 180g).
3.) auto top off
you don't need it, but it's a nice convience. I manually top off over 2 gallons a day and i use the top off water to dose calcium and soda ash. I find it helps keep me in touch with what's going on in my system.
4.) good heater
depends on there you live and how cold you let your living space get.
5.) good light
not a 'good light', get a very good light. If you can afford it, get a great light. You'll never be disappointed with a light that is better than you need.
6.) powerheads to keep water moving
you want 2 things: 1) enough water movement, 2) some degree of randomness and good tank coverage with that water movement. A 20g tank with basic stuff needs 10x (or 200gph) of water movement. The more difficult your animals are to keep, like lps & sps corals or anemones, the more flow you need. 30x-40x (600-800gph). Getting full coverage in a 20g tank is a bit easier than in a big tank, but you would still be better off, imho, with 2 or 3 smaller powerheads than 1 big one. You'll get better coverage of every cubic inch of the tank, and if 1 fails, your tank isn't completely without flow until you find out the powerhead quit working.

i want to do a 3-3.5 inch deep sand bed with a generous portion of live rock.
why a 3-3.5" deep sand bed? It's more than you need for most critters and not nearly enough to be a dsb which is better done in a sump anyway. I think 2" is more like the average in most tanks i see.

And as suggested above, seriously consider a sump or even a sump/refugium. You can almost double your water volume, have a place to put your skimmer, do a dsb and grow macro algae which helps eliminate the need for a gfo or carbon reactor (and you won't need to buy chemicals for a refugium).

+1

[sponger0]

Ron did hit alot of the topics but Ill add my 2 cents....

1.) gfo and carbon reactor

Unless you know you have a problem, its not worth spending your money on it now. Each tank is different so saying what your tank needs now before its even running is hard to say

2.) skimmer

It wont hurt but weekly water changes in a 20 gallon will take care of most of your nutrient issues.

3.) auto top off

I like automation. I like not having to worry about topping off my tank. But thats just me.

4.) good heater

Yes get a quality heater. But as Ron said, depending on where you live will also dictate the heater. My heater usually only runs to keep the tank warm when the lights are off

5.) good light

Leds or T5s. I wouldnt use metal halide on a 20 gallon due to heat issues. This is one area you dont wanna try to save money on. Your lights are going to be very important.

6.) powerheads to keep water moving

Yes you will need powerheads. Most people use Koralias. Use some nano koralias for a 20 gallon. But how much is gonna be dependant on what kind of corals you plan to keep.

My advice is first to read up on anemones. They need to go in a system that has been established for at least 6 months. I wouldnt recommend them to a newbie. So if you are new, your best bet is to start with softies and work your way up. Anemones are going to have certain water requirements and that you understand those needs and how to keep up on them.

[Reeferz412]

Originally Posted by sponger0

Ron did hit alot of the topics but Ill add my 2 cents....

1.) gfo and carbon reactor

Unless you know you have a problem, its not worth spending your money on it now. Each tank is different so saying what your tank needs now before its even running is hard to say

2.) skimmer

It wont hurt but weekly water changes in a 20 gallon will take care of most of your nutrient issues.

3.) auto top off

I like automation. I like not having to worry about topping off my tank. But thats just me.

4.) good heater

Yes get a quality heater. But as Ron said, depending on where you live will also dictate the heater. My heater usually only runs to keep the tank warm when the lights are off

5.) good light

Leds or T5s. I wouldnt use metal halide on a 20 gallon due to heat issues. This is one area you dont wanna try to save money on. Your lights are going to be very important.

6.) powerheads to keep water moving

Yes you will need powerheads. Most people use Koralias. Use some nano koralias for a 20 gallon. But how much is gonna be dependant on what kind of corals you plan to keep.

My advice is first to read up on anemones. They need to go in a system that has been established for at least 6 months. I wouldnt recommend them to a newbie. So if you are new, your best bet is to start with softies and work your way up. Anemones are going to have certain water requirements and that you understand those needs and how to keep up on them.

Koralia nanos are ok for softies. I just switched mine for 450s. MUCH better choice. They both work, but I see a hell of a difference.