Correct way to mix salt to RO?

[conflictrealms]

Hi guys. When I buy my RO from the fish store, i then add 825g of marine salt to the 25l drum of RO...i then shake it up a bit and leave for 24hours and then add to the tank when i do a water change.

Is this process correct?

[homer1475]

You should constantly keep it circulating. Depending on the salt your using, some have organics in them that need to be fully mixed up.

I leave 2 small powerheads mixing in my bucket for 24 hours prior to using. After a couple hours, I throw a heater in to bring it up to my tanks temp, but leave the PH's constantly mixing

Since I'm from the US, I'm not sure about grams and liters, but typically you add 1/2cup of salt per gallon of RO/DI.

[conflictrealms]

Thanks homer1475....when i add ph buffer to my tank, can i add it to the bucket thats mixing for 24 hours?

[homer1475]

You should never add PH buffer to your tank, it will cause issues down the road. Keep your Alkalinity at a constant level(between 7 and 11 DKH) and the PH will follow. My PH fluctuates between 7.55 and 8.10(I only know cause its on the display of the Apex).

Most reefers never even look at their PH, myself included.

[Dkuhlmann]

I agree with homer. I also start with 1/2 cup of salt per gal of RODI water, then adjust it from there to get to an sg of 1.025-1.026 for my reef tank. I have a powerhead and a heater just for my salt/RODI mixing

I too am one that never checks PH and you most certainly will cause yourself problems by adding a PH buffer. Stop using it.

[conflictrealms]

Oh wow, thanks for that guys.

Whats he best way of keeping ontop of my alkalinity?

[homer1475]

Test daily or every other day. I personally like using randys 2 part home made solution. Simple to make and simple to use.

I use this calculator to figure out how much I need.

http://reef.diesyst.com/flashcalc/flashcalc.html

[Ron Reefman]

How old is your set up? How often and what percentage of water do you change? What salt are you using? Do you have sps or lps corals in the tank already?

If the tank is new and you don't have lps or sps corals and you do regular water changes, you'll probably not be needing to do anything to keep alk up above 7dKH or more.

[thelawnwrangler]

You folks don't buffer your RO top off water?

I was told to do so by my local fish store. Just kind of blindly followed that.

Also any suggestion on cheap power heads for 5 gallon bucket? I have been been buying premix salt from LFS, but they are at 1.020 and I think I need to get that up a bit so it sounds like I need to mix my own. Although unsure on salt price, but 2 gallons salt at 1.020 still might be a deal, and I only take it the extra .005 lol

[Isaacs55]

I agree with Ron Reefman. If you have no lps or sps, or maybe a few then regular water changes should keep your alkalinity stable. Also, keeping your magnesium at our above 1350 ppm will help keep your calcium and alkalinity stable and also prevent algae outbreaks. You want to choose a salt mix that has the desired levels your looking for but also a higher magnesium level.

[Isaacs55]

Originally Posted by thelawnwrangler

You folks don't buffer your RO top off water?

I was told to do so by my local fish store. Just kind of blindly followed that.

Also any suggestion on cheap power heads for 5 gallon bucket? I have been been buying premix salt from LFS, but they are at 1.020 and I think I need to get that up a bit so it sounds like I need to mix my own. Although unsure on salt price, but 2 gallons salt at 1.020 still might be a deal, and I only take it the extra .005 lol

No! Chasing PH is a thing of the past. At least for most reefers who have done the research. PH is more for freshwater as alkalinity is for reef tanks. A stable alkalinity of 8.4-9.5 is well within the PH range of 8.1-8.2.

I strongly suggest buying a quality RO/DI unit and a good salt mix and just make your own saltwater and freshwater. No more need to haul water from the store to your house back and forth.

[thelawnwrangler]

Originally Posted by Isaacs55

No! Chasing PH is a thing of the past. At least for most reefers who have done the research. PH is more for freshwater as alkalinity is for reef tanks. A stable alkalinity of 8.4-9.5 is well within the PH range of 8.1-8.2.

I strongly suggest buying a quality RO/DI unit and a good salt mix and just make your own saltwater and freshwater. No more need to haul water from the store to your house back and forth.

yeah I underestimated the need for water even in a 36 gallon lol

Is saltwater math straight forward? 1.000 is freshwater value right? if I am at 1.020 and I want to go to 1.025 I could accomplish it theoretically with a 50% water change of 1.030 water?

I wouldn't change salinity that fast just want want to make sure I understand how the numbers work.

[jason2459]

pH should not be chased but should not be ignored either. Just because your alkalinity is in line where you want it does not mean your pH is. pH can be altered, lowered, and raised with out a change in alkalinity.

Someone could easily have very low pH and high Alk. Or very high pH and low Alk. I just experienced and corrected a high Alk and low pH issue. These can come about in many ways.

Also, if you are dosing anything that can alter pH like kalk/lime water the pH should be monitored. I use it as a failsafe for my kalk dosing. I also use vinegar for carbon dosing that can lower pH with out effecting alk. I also use pH as a failsafe for it. If to high or to low my controller will shutdown the dosing of one or the other.

[Isaacs55]

Originally Posted by jason2459

pH should not be chased but should not be ignored either. Just because your alkalinity is in line where you want it does not mean your pH is. pH can be altered, lowered, and raised with out a change in alkalinity.

Someone could easily have very low pH and high Alk. Or very high pH and low Alk. I just experienced and corrected a high Alk and low pH issue. These can come about in many ways.

Also, if you are dosing anything that can alter pH like kalk/lime water the pH should be monitored. I use it as a failsafe for my kalk dosing. I also use vinegar for carbon dosing that can lower pH with out effecting alk. I also use pH as a failsafe for it. If to high or to low my controller will shutdown the dosing of one or the other.

I believe the main topic here is mixing salt Jason. When mixing in salt there's no need to get the correct ph before putting the newly mixed saltwater into the tank. I've never encountered an off ph to a fresh batch of saltwater for a water change when the mix is at 1.026.

However, the PH in the main tank over a long period of time is a different story and should not be overlooked. Like you said there are many of factors the can change a ph in the tank.

[jason2459]

Originally Posted by Isaacs55

I believe the main topic here is mixing salt Jason. When mixing in salt there's no need to get the correct ph before putting the newly mixed saltwater into the tank. I've never encountered an off ph to a fresh batch of saltwater for a water change when the mix is at 1.026.

However, the PH in the main tank over a long period of time is a different story and should not be overlooked. Like you said there are many of factors the can change a ph in the tank.

That is the main topic but the topic of ignoring pH all together was brought up. This is the new to the hobby section and there's a lot of new members and reefers joining right now and in the future. They may read just a few threads and get information like this and feel they can now never test or monitor for pH. Which could lead to issues down the road. Especially this time of year.

In the winter with all windows sealed, doors shut as much as possible, fireplaces burning, furnaces blazing, etc the pH levels can drop significantly and to levels that can cause serious issues.

In my case my house is closed up year round due to very bad outside allergies and pH is low all year round. Limewater helps but I also have to use a CO2 scrubber to push up pH with out effecting alk as its already raised with the kalk additions.

[Dkuhlmann]

Originally Posted by thelawnwrangler

yeah I underestimated the need for water even in a 36 gallon lol

Is saltwater math straight forward? 1.000 is freshwater value right? if I am at 1.020 and I want to go to 1.025 I could accomplish it theoretically with a 50% water change of 1.030 water?

I wouldn't change salinity that fast just want want to make sure I understand how the numbers work.

No just start using top off water mixed to 1.025 until it equalizes. Then continue to do water changes at 1.025

No we never even test PH nor do we worry about it and I've been in reef keeping and saltwater tanks off and on since the 80's

If you don't have corals yet you can use a regular mix like Instant Ocean and do 10% wc's every two weeks and you'll be fine. If you have corals you can use Instant Ocean Reef Crystals for a while before you would have to start dosing anything. But get the 3 main tests for corals, Alk/Ca/Mg and see if they fall below levels of NSW. I did 20% WC's for a long time with the Reef Crystals before I had to dose anything due to the higher Big 3.

[Dkuhlmann]

Originally Posted by jason2459

That is the main topic but the topic of ignoring pH all together was brought up. This is the new to the hobby section and there's a lot of new members and reefers joining right now and in the future. They may read just a few threads and get information like this and feel they can now never test or monitor for pH. Which could lead to issues down the road. Especially this time of year.

In the winter with all windows sealed, doors shut as much as possible, fireplaces burning, furnaces blazing, etc the pH levels can drop significantly and to levels that can cause serious issues.

In my case my house is closed up year round due to very bad outside allergies and pH is low all year round. Limewater helps but I also have to use a CO2 scrubber to push up pH with out effecting alk as its already raised with the kalk additions.

I agree with you from the newbie stand point. I also think they need to know other sides of reef keeping. For instance newbies with corals when asked what their parameters are only give Temp/SG/Ammonia/Nitrites/Nitrates because they weren't told of the Big 3 for corals.

[gottalikesharks]

Originally Posted by thelawnwrangler

yeah I underestimated the need for water even in a 36 gallon lol

Is saltwater math straight forward? 1.000 is freshwater value right? if I am at 1.020 and I want to go to 1.025 I could accomplish it theoretically with a 50% water change of 1.030 water?

I wouldn't change salinity that fast just want want to make sure I understand how the numbers work.

Yes that would work. If you want to raise your numbers slow, just use salt water instead of ro water to do your top offs, then monitor your salinity after each top off. When it's where you want it start topping off with ro water.

[Isaacs55]

Originally Posted by jason2459

That is the main topic but the topic of ignoring pH all together was brought up. This is the new to the hobby section and there's a lot of new members and reefers joining right now and in the future. They may read just a few threads and get information like this and feel they can now never test or monitor for pH. Which could lead to issues down the road. Especially this time of year.

In the winter with all windows sealed, doors shut as much as possible, fireplaces burning, furnaces blazing, etc the pH levels can drop significantly and to levels that can cause serious issues.

In my case my house is closed up year round due to very bad outside allergies and pH is low all year round. Limewater helps but I also have to use a CO2 scrubber to push up pH with out effecting alk as its already raised with the kalk additions.

Totally agree with you on this. My mistake on forgetting this is the new to the hobby section. Good looking out! Definitely need to monitor ph as whole, but when mixing new saltwater there's no need to buffer.

[thelawnwrangler]

Originally Posted by gottalikesharks

Yes that would work. If you want to raise your numbers slow, just use salt water instead of ro water to do your top offs, then monitor your salinity after each top off. When it's where you want it start topping off with ro water.

seems like a solid suggestion. I need to dial in my refractometer though first.

[CStrickland]

I think the ph of really fresh saltwater is a little off until the batch gets aerated. You might see it change on its own if you test it right away and then 30 min later. No need to buffer.

As to how sg works, the sg is like the weight of the water.
This may be interesting (or not lol) http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/1/chemistry
To raise the tank sg, def easiest to top of with salt water. Idk if I'd bother buying sw that is only 1.02, might as well just make your own.

ETA on the salt I'm think more about the hassle of mixing and testing than the price. If you are going to all of the trouble of raising the sg, it makes sense to me to start with pure water that you know is 0 tds. Your lfs sounds kinda dumb about water, for all you know they haven't changed the rodi filters in a while. If you were getting fresh water from them to add salt to at home, you could just whip out your tds meter in the store and not buy anything that isn't zero. Since you can't do that on salted water, the salt could be hiding all kinds of garbage.