Ozone and the Reef Aquarium, Part 3:Changes in a Reef Aquarium upon Initiating Ozone

[Billybeau1]

I believe that to be a typo. Randy's had too much coffee again

[boxfishpooalot]

Originally posted by Billybeau1
I believe that to be a typo. Randy's had too much coffee again

Actually we all know randys a post android! But he would tell you he does not drink coffee. He says there's too manny chemicals in it --listen to him he is correct. But I still cant stop drinking the stuff!

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I think you guys are hallucinating.

[Obi-dad]

Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
I think you guys are hallucinating.

Probably from sniffing too much ozone

I think 'ozodize' just became part of RC vocabulary.

[ikatobiko]

While I understand using carbon at the output of an ozone reactor, why is a carbon-filled vent required on the reactor?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

To Reef Central

To keep ozone gas from being released into your home in potentially toxic quantities.

[crook6693]

Hi all

Sorry to bring such an old thread up, I see from Randy that I should be using carbon after my skimmer output, I have never run carbon whilst using ozone in that last year and a little worried I could be causing harm by not doing this.

I have always had the skimmer output run over and aireation chamber and not used carbon, what is the ozone giving off that I should capture with carbon please


Thanks

[jason2459]

Originally Posted by Randy Holmes-Farley

My third ozone article has posted at:

Ozone and the Reef Aquarium, Part 3:
Changes in a Reef Aquarium upon Initiating Ozone
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-05/rhf/index.php

The contents:


Introduction
ORP Changes
ORP Measurement
Water Clarity
Algae Growth
Response of Organisms
Oxygen Levels
Effect of Air Drying
Disinfection of Water by Ozone Treatment
Activated Carbon Treatment
Conclusions About Reaction Chambers
Details of My Aquarium System
Summary
References

Originally Posted by crook6693

Hi all

Sorry to bring such an old thread up, I see from Randy that I should be using carbon after my skimmer output, I have never run carbon whilst using ozone in that last year and a little worried I could be causing harm by not doing this.

I have always had the skimmer output run over and aireation chamber and not used carbon, what is the ozone giving off that I should capture with carbon please


Thanks

I would suggest reading the articles Randy Posted at the very start of the Thread. There's 3 parts. The first two parts are linked to in the 3rd part he posted.

From part 3 in the series

"In order to assess the GAC's impact on the water, the water can be tested for ozone and ozone byproducts (OPO's) before and after the GAC. Using my tubing reactor, with a water flow rate of about 0.5 gallons per minute, I found that the residual oxidant was 0.10 - 0.24 ppm chlorine equivalents before the activated carbon. After the activated carbon, the effluent had an oxidant level of 0.04 ppm chlorine equivalents or less."

[bertoni]

I don't think we know for sure exactly what might be in the effluent, but there could be some ozone or other reactive byproducts around. Using carbon is a good safety net, but aeration could be enough if the issue primarily is ozone.

[crook6693]

I have the ozone on for 8 hours at night (when all in bed) at 25mg which is the lowest setting, yes I have 800 litres so it should be far more but I find this dosage and time keeps my water clarity like new salt water mix, the ozone outlet has to pass through another chamber which has a very high output air stone and then to a return pump.

I have run ozone for along time so maybe I have got away with it, I have read all of Randy's literature which is great but I was just after if carbon is a must and what is left in the water for some time that would potential be harmful if anything.

My thoughts which are probably completely incorrect that ozone will only last seconds so become less harmful, I am very happy to now run carbon but still would like to know what the carbon is actually capturing and do I need it at such a low dose.

Again thank you

[bertoni]

This link points to a list of some of the byproducts of ozone application:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-03/rhf/index.php#6

In addition, of course, ozone itself can kill organisms. It generally won't last long, but it doesn't take long to cause harm, and it'll last longer when the water has fewer organics.

[jason2459]

All three parts should be read by anyone using ozone.

[crook6693]

Well I think I have been lucky, I will now run carbon between a returning baffle just in case.

I have to say that is some serious reading on ozone but thanks for pointing me the right way.

I have bought some redsea reef spec carbon as that is the only decent carbon that you can get in the UK, if you know of anything better please let me know.

Couple of pics for you, tank since the move four month's ago is doing well, lost so many SP's colony's due to a sea hare trapping and polluting the holding tank :-(
Lesson learnt to always replace the pump cover.

Thanks all

[jason2459]

Very nice. I don't use much ozone at all either and probably don't need to use any GAC but throw it in front of my skimmer any way.

I posted how I have my ozone setup recently here:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...php?p=24679460

Originally Posted by jason2459

I had a question on my ozone setup and use. I've posted this before so most of this will be a copy paste.


You certainly don't need much ozone to produce results. I've also found very small amounts to help skimmer production while higher amounts hinder a good dense foam production. Some people will only run ozone for a couple hours right after lights on with great results.

I have used a 50mg/l redsea aquazone for years and have it down to running 25% for around 200 gallon system volume. That is a very small amount and poses little risk to fish even if GAC wasn't used. I do have a bag of GAC (ROX 0.8) sitting in front of my skimmer's output as a precaution. I do feel it acts like a flocculant at that small amount along with being an oxidizing agent. As others have said it's only one small part to maintaining my system.

More importantly though is that ozone isn't released into the atmosphere for you or anyone else in the house to breath in. (another reason I like very small amounts.) If using a skimmer as a reactor put bags of carbon over the collection cup if there's holes. I used to tape the holes up with duct tape except one of them and shoved my skimmer's airline in it to draw in any excess ozone air back into the skimmer. Lifereef skimmer do this already. My current skimmer is sealed on top with no holes so I don't have to worry about that part (MTC MVX).

Waterkeeper pointed me to these articles a few moons ago and should be read by anyone looking to use ozone.

Ozone and the Reef Aquarium by Randy Holmes-Farley Parts 1, 2, and 3
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-03/rhf/index.php

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-04/rhf/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-05/rhf/index.php



Posted this just recently but shows how I used to duct tape the holes on top except one to suck back into the skimmer any unused ozone.


The MTC MVX is sealed with a rubber gasket and screwed down. No holes on top.

Now for how I have it all setup airline wise.

I use a T to split off and control freshair flow and airflow from the ozone generator. And you'll see I also use a CO2 scrubber pre ozone generator.

The sodalime CO2 scrubber actually does two things for me. It acts to reduce CO2 going into the skimmer which helps elevate my tanks pH slightly but it also drys the air some as well which makes the ozone generator more efficient.

I T off the air flow going through both the CO2 scrubber and ozone generator as the generator doesn't need that much flow and would actually restrict airflow if I didn't T off and restricting the air flow through the scrubber increases its life as the sodalime would be exhausted much faster if pulling 100% of the air draw through it and I found it doesn't help increase pH that much more doing so.

So
Air in > scrubber > generator > T > skimmer
Air in > T > skimmer.

If that wasn't confusing here's a picture of the airlines which may or may not help clear that up. And you'll love my way of connecting some of these hoses...shoving one into another. Im not concerned with airtight as the air flow through the generator is less then the total airflow.

Air in


Sceubber to generator




Generator to T



Air in to T and T to skimmer



And my ozone generator is controlled by my apex. Monitoring orp should be done when using ozone.

Fallback OFF
If DT_ORP < 400 Then ON
If DT_ORP > 425 Then OFF
If Outlet skimmer_7_5 = OFF Then OFF

[crook6693]

Interesting, I like the idea of the air inlet sucking back from the skimmer collection cup but I feed mine direct from outside for constant fresh air, this from what I understand keeps o2 up constantly rather than lower o2 from inside the house in colder months with all doors and windows shut.

May play around though with it.

[jason2459]

You could do that and have that open part of the T pull from outside.

[Greg 45]

After reading through this , is anyone using a quality redox controller on there system
If so what is the number you are trying to keep the tank at.
With a 1200 gallon system and a 200 mg ozotec ozone , I have a hard time trying to get the redox over 300 mv. I don't run any carbon after the skimmer. Also the initial investment is way cheaper than using carbon.

[jason2459]

Originally Posted by Greg 45

After reading through this , is anyone using a quality redox controller on there system
If so what is the number you are trying to keep the tank at.
With a 1200 gallon system and a 200 mg ozotec ozone , I have a hard time trying to get the redox over 300 mv. I don't run any carbon after the skimmer. Also the initial investment is way cheaper than using carbon.

I use an Apex to monitor the ORP and shut it down if by the off chance it goes to high (in quotes above my apex programming). But I do not try and control ORP at all or worry about. I think it would be a very frustrating thing to do and don't think it's necessary other then preventing it from going to high.

[bertoni]

I wouldn't target any specific ORP level. There are a lot of constituents of the ORP level, and some are more of a problem than others. If the tank is doing well enough without ozone, then I would suggest setting the controller to prevent the ORP level from rising more than 10-20 points, most likely, and work from there.