Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

[Michael Hoaster]

Lushness is coming!

The turtle grass's blades are flat and about half an inch wide. The manatee grass is round (tubular?) about a sixteenth inch thick. I have two shoal grass shoots left. They're flat and about a sixteenth as well. I don't expect them to get much wider, but I'd love for them all to get taller!

[Michael Hoaster]

Sorry to those who have messaged me, and waited too long for a reply!

I wanted to point out a feature of RC that maybe not all of us know about. I've had some questions about my fake wall and fake root. I have build threads for both. So, how do you find them? Click on my name, on any post I've made. Click on 'view public profile'. Click the 'statistics' tab. Click on 'find all threads started by Michael Hoaster'. And there they are.

I hope this is helpful!

[Michael Hoaster]

My wife and I have talked of moving recently, and that got me to thinking. What if I had to start all over? How would I set my tank up differently?

Here are a few things that come to mind:

First off, I would have placed my coast to coast overflow about two inches lower. I'm not sure what led to this mistake, but it's a humdinger! I have to fill my tank almost to the top, which causes the top two inches of water to be hidden by my hood.

I would have better integrated the three separate pieces of the fake wall. The lower pieces are great, but the upper piece covering the overflow could be better. It would have been nice to put more foam at the top to get more overhang. Also, it would have been cool to put more ledges in it over the gramma caves.

The fake root functions fantastically, which was a huge relief. I wish I had made it a bit smaller, so that it took up only about a third of tank space, rather than almost half. Also, I wish I'd painted it darker-almost black.

The DSB Planter also turned out great. I do wish I'd put more sand, etc. in it. Filling it to the overflow point would be good.

For the deep sand bed itself, I think the grasses would have appreciated more dirt and/or live mud in it. With such a low fish load, I don't think that much 'gunk' is making it into the DSB, so the grasses are forced to take up more nutrients through their leaves. I have backed off water column dosing recently, to test substrate fertilization. I've noted the macros have slowed their growth, and the manatee grass has finally put out some daughter plants. Cause and effect? Hard to say. Since the manatee grasses grow slowly, they could be reacting to something I did two weeks ago!

Knowing what I know now about manatee grass, I think ideally, I would have started the tank, planting manatee grass only. No macros, no fish. Then I could try different things without worrying about harming the anemone or whatever. Then, once I figured out the magic formula, I could diversify the flora and fauna.

Well, that's about all I can think right now. Just writing this stuff down is helpful, I think.

[karimwassef]

Maybe a sump this time?

[Michael Hoaster]

Ha! Great Question, Karim.

Nope, I don't miss having a sump. The simplicity of this system is liberating! I had originally planned to have a sump and separate refugium, but the more I thought about it, the less I needed them. With no skimmer and a built-in refugium, why bother?

A year later and I'm still loving the K.I.S.S. method!

[saltwater sam]

I totally agree Michael. Not having to worry about the complexities of a sump is very liberating! Simplicity makes things easier.

[karimwassef]

A sump isn't complexity. It's zoning.

I have many zones in my system. Nature has zones, and so I do the same.

[saltwater sam]

Really? So you're saying that setting up and maintaining a sump is not more complex than not doing so? There aren't potential issues that can arise from having a sump that aren't an issue without one?

[karimwassef]

Avoiding a sump creates its own issues - yes. It's not more or less, just different.

[saltwater sam]

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

[karimwassef]

ok

[Michael Hoaster]

Avoiding a sump creates its own issues - NO. I speak from experience.

Saying that adding a vessel and its plumbing is not more complex is ludicrous. Sumps are great! Most folks should have them. But for some of us, they aren't needed. To each his own!

[karimwassef]

In your application, ok. In mine, avoiding a sump would be incredibly more complex if not disastrous.

[Michael Hoaster]

Agreed. I would never suggest you go sump-less.

[Michael Hoaster]

Hopefully this pic will give you a good idea what's happening here. This manatee grass split, then split again and again. The downturned stems (vertical arrows) are forming rhizomes, with the one on the left putting up a daughter plant (curved arrow). Pretty cool!



Today the anemone moved to the front side of the barnacles, which was much too close to the barnacle blennies. I saw one contact it, when returning to its home. He seemed unaffected but yikes! So I tried a relocation all the way at the left end of the tank. It seemed to settle in, but we'll see if it's still there in the morning. I got it moved minutes before lights out. I'd been thinking about getting into brighter light.



Spot ended up sheltering by this red macro.



The strange, brown macro.



Who dat!

[sam.basye]

Hey YOU!


Conch humor. lol

The plant reproduction pictogram is a good touch for us non plant experts.

Your strange brown macro looks to me like you dropped some chow mein in there...

[nawilson89]

Looking great! Are the Barnacle Blennies the only fish you have in there?

I really like them!

[karimwassef]

Where's the tang?

[Michael Hoaster]

I couldn't resist, after seeing your pic! It was good to convey the progress of the manatee grass, for which I've waited so long! The brown macro looks to me like it would prefer dimmer light, the way it is bleaching out. I'll try moving a fragment of it. It's a weird plant.

Yes, right now, I have only 4 barnacle blennies in my tank. Earlier in the tank's life, I employed up to 4 (saltwater acclimated) black mollies for algae control. I didn't feed them at all. They even helped a little with cyanobacteria. I highly recommend them, along with an army of Cerith snails, which reproduce in your tank. The young ones are small enough to keep your grasses and macros free of micro algae.

The tang should come in this week. My LFS has been waiting for one in really good shape for me.

[Michael Hoaster]

Oh, I forgot to mention, the anemone stayed put. The downside to this placement, is that there isn't much current there. It was a situation where I needed to act quickly, so it's not a perfect solution.

I'll probably move it, but I want to see if it reacts favorably to the higher light level first. I'll give it a few days there, while I consider better locations. Also, I may be able to direct a little flow its way.

Considering all the horror stories I've read regarding these anemones' tendency to cruise around and sting stuff, I've been lucky with this one.

[Michael Hoaster]

The condylactis anemone moved an inch or two down the left end wall. It looks bigger, happier there. My original placement of it, by the barnacles, may have been too far from the light. I haven't decided on a better placement for it, so I think I'll leave it be for awhile. Maybe it will go right where it wants to be.

The atlantic blue tang comes tomorrow, I hope. They're going to call me when it comes in, so I can bring it home before they unbag it. That way it won't have the stress of acclimating twice in one day. I'm very excited and a little terrified! If all goes well, it'll keep the caulerpa cropped, so I don't have to. The pics I've seen of this fish are very impressive! Imagine a yellow tang, with vivid blue fin edges and rings around the eyes! Just having a fish that constantly swims around the tank is going to be a huge change!

There will be pics! It will be a new challenge photographing a fish that moves…

[Michael Hoaster]

No tang. The one they got was already turning blue, and bigger than I wanted. Oh well. They can try again…

[karimwassef]

I've been thinking... Warning warning!

What you need is poo! Lots of it.

It's like you have a field and no cows to fertilize it. You need dem cows, man! The little hamsters running underground don't do much.

The poo is the start. Phosphates from fish food. Nitrates from poo and respiration. The tank is begging for natural organic poo.

My 7" hippo leaves a beautiful trail of sausage like poo and that's what your fields are waiting for. Get non-algae eaters like angels if you fear the munching.

Irish accent "Feed your lawn! Feed it!"

[Michael Hoaster]

No.

I have no idea why you think something is wrong with my tank, and that you know how to fix it, with POO! On the contrary, my tank is doing very well. I have deliberately kept my fish load very low, while I learn how to best care for these plants. I get what you're saying, but I like my PL (poo level) just the way it is, thank you.

Keep in mind that what you are doing and what I am doing are at opposite ends of the spectrum (hi tech reef v low tech planted). I'm sorry, but I don't consider you an authority on the subject. I have spent many hours researching seagrasses. One of the surprising facts I learned is that seagrasses flourish in pristine, nutrient poor conditions, so they are able to outcompete algae. So poo, and lots of it, is not what I want. Don't worry, I have hundreds of tiny snails. They poop. Let me also repeat that I am not using a skimmer, and when I do water changes, I do not vacuum the substrate. So maybe, if you were to drop by and actually look at my tank, you may conclude my PL is adequate.

One of the tricky differences between our tanks and the sea, is that we do not have the luxury of allowing things like detritus and poo to accumulate to 'natural' levels. We just don't have the water volume capacity, so we have to keep things a little tidier. If I allowed my grasses (in my tiny plastic box) to accumulate all the stuff they do in nature, I'd have a real mess.

Sure, I'd like my seagrasses to grow faster (and my caulerpa to grow slower). I am still researching and experimenting. I am having success increasing growth rates. But it is a slow process and I'm being pretty cautious. It would have been easy to just buy more grasses, but I'm trying to better understand their needs. Unlike the reef side of the hobby, there is a dearth of information regarding keeping seagrasses in captivity.

From seven turtle grass plants I now have twenty-three. I have six new manatee grass plants in the last two weeks. I'm going to go ahead and be happy with that.

[rick12]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

No.

On the contrary, my tank is doing very well.

I agree, many of us are envious