What would you do?

squealy · 07/03/2008, 07:24 PM

Today I received a blue chin trigger purchased from an on-line retailer (V.A.-a sponsor). When I opened the styrofoam box, there was water all over with only a minimal amount left in the plastic bag containing the fish. The bag was collapsed, so obviously the oxygen had escaped. The leak came from a poorly secured clip (only one clip was used to close three bags). I floated the bag, without even knowing if the fish was alive, and then added tank water. Miraculously the fish was alive. I eventually put him into a QT.

Obviously he does not look good. He is breathing heavily. He has obvious ich on his fins. He is not swimming around much.

I called the retailer and very nonchalantly the salesperson said "no problem-if he dies within 14 days we'll give you a refund". This attitude ****ed me off.

How would you feel if this happened to you? Is there anything special I should do for the fish? I will put him in hypo tomorrow and will watch him closely. Do fish get hypoxic damage to their organs and should I expect delayed problems?

I really feel bad for the fish, angry at the retailer for packing the fish so poorly, and frustrated.

kau_cinta_ku · 07/03/2008, 07:50 PM

things happen during transit that the retailer can't avoid.

I don't see why you are so angry at the place when they will gladly refund the fish if it does die. what more do you want from them?

yes it is sad things like this do happen but they do. you just have to move on and hope for the best.

for the fish, I would start a hypo treatment for the ich and start feeding foods soaked in garlic to get him to eat well.

abulgin · 07/03/2008, 07:52 PM

mistake

squealy · 07/03/2008, 08:23 PM

This wasn't a problem with transit, like we hear about heavy boxes of LR being dropped by FedEx. I guess I think that problems can be anticipated and avoided. If I were packing something valuable in water, I would secure each bag separately, so in case one opened the others would still be secure. If I were called by a customer that this problem occurred, I probably would have said something like "I'm really sorry that happened. Maybe we can change our practices to avoid this in the future". We're not talking about a candy dish breaking in the mail. I feel that retailers have an obligation to do all they can do to ensure that a fish arrives safely at a destination. Maybe because I'm new at this, I expect more than others who've been at this for a while. I may have to revise my expectations.

Thanks for the advice about hypo and garlic. We'll see how this guy does in the coming weeks.

snorvich · 07/03/2008, 08:29 PM

I agree with kau_cinta_ku about treatment but I tend to agree with squealy on attitude and packing. My prototypical online vendor is, of course Reef Hotspot or Live Aquaria. They triple bag; you need a degree in logistics to get into the bag. But the animals rarely have a problem during shipping. it takes a little extra work, but it means their arrive alive rate is very high (97+ if I remember correctly)

squealy · 07/03/2008, 09:09 PM

Live Aquaria has always been my first choice, and I've never had a problem with them. Unfortunately, they didn't have the fish I was looking for at this time. Next time I'll wait until they do.

reefergeorge · 07/03/2008, 09:24 PM

Triggers are very hardy fish. Ime he will be ok. Start lowering the sg as soon as you can to lower stress.

chatyak · 07/03/2008, 09:52 PM

Yea both opinions are valid. Mistakes do happen but they skimmed out on the packaging job.

Hope all is well.

Lotus99 · 07/04/2008, 02:08 PM

I guess the customer service rep considers it a product, not a living animal. I think I'd be upset, too.

Guarantee or no guarantee, I think we expect a little compassion from livestock retailers. A refund is nice, but a dead fish isn't.

Any updates on him? I'm hoping he made it.

uscharalph · 07/04/2008, 02:28 PM

I think it will be a great story when he survives and then thrives.

Playa-1 · 07/04/2008, 04:15 PM

Well what I would do is to try and save the fish. Then I would alert my fellow hobbyist about who they might want to think twice about doing business with and why. I'm sure the mistake was not intentional, but businesses these days have gotten away from proper customer service. As consumers and patrons, We need to rise together and send a clear message that we can and will take our business elsewhere. It's also wise to research companies before you do business with them. Just because they post the cheapest price doesn't mean that they are worthy of your hard earned dollars.

squealy · 07/04/2008, 04:32 PM

So here's an update. He's actually looking much better today. Moving around a little but shy. He is reluctantly eating frozen brine shrimp. Breathing a little better. Obviously still has ich spots and one bigger spot that may be lympho. I've done two water changes with ro/di water on the way down to 1.009.

Overall he is looking pretty good given the circumstances. Maybe there is something to these hardy fish. I doubt that a butterfly or tang would have survived the trip.

Thanks for all the well wishes. I'll periodically give you updates on his condition.

07/03/2008, 07:24 PM	#1
squealy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 113	What would you do? Today I received a blue chin trigger purchased from an on-line retailer (V.A.-a sponsor). When I opened the styrofoam box, there was water all over with only a minimal amount left in the plastic bag containing the fish. The bag was collapsed, so obviously the oxygen had escaped. The leak came from a poorly secured clip (only one clip was used to close three bags). I floated the bag, without even knowing if the fish was alive, and then added tank water. Miraculously the fish was alive. I eventually put him into a QT. Obviously he does not look good. He is breathing heavily. He has obvious ich on his fins. He is not swimming around much. I called the retailer and very nonchalantly the salesperson said "no problem-if he dies within 14 days we'll give you a refund". This attitude ****ed me off. How would you feel if this happened to you? Is there anything special I should do for the fish? I will put him in hypo tomorrow and will watch him closely. Do fish get hypoxic damage to their organs and should I expect delayed problems? I really feel bad for the fish, angry at the retailer for packing the fish so poorly, and frustrated.

07/03/2008, 08:29 PM	#5
snorvich Team RC member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Outlander Posts: 40,953 Blog Entries: 46	I agree with kau_cinta_ku about treatment but I tend to agree with squealy on attitude and packing. My prototypical online vendor is, of course Reef Hotspot or Live Aquaria. They triple bag; you need a degree in logistics to get into the bag. But the animals rarely have a problem during shipping. it takes a little extra work, but it means their arrive alive rate is very high (97+ if I remember correctly) __________________ Warmest regards, ~Steve~

07/03/2008, 09:24 PM	#7
reefergeorge Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: St Louis MO Posts: 4,222	Triggers are very hardy fish. Ime he will be ok. Start lowering the sg as soon as you can to lower stress. __________________ $35-50 for a <1" frag of some stupid named thing that came from a colony you bought for $40-60 wholesale and chopped into 20-40 pieces? No thanks. "JasonH" Current Tank Info: 125 aggressive reef, DIY led lighting, swc cone skimmer, 33 gallon sump, posiden Ps3 return.

07/03/2008, 09:52 PM	#8
chatyak Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 2,090	Yea both opinions are valid. Mistakes do happen but they skimmed out on the packaging job. Hope all is well. __________________ Fishville

07/04/2008, 02:08 PM	#9
Lotus99 Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southern California Posts: 1,398	I guess the customer service rep considers it a product, not a living animal. I think I'd be upset, too. Guarantee or no guarantee, I think we expect a little compassion from livestock retailers. A refund is nice, but a dead fish isn't. Any updates on him? I'm hoping he made it. __________________ "So long, and thanks for all the fish" Current Tank Info: 125g reef, gobies, cardinals, softies and LPS; 36g Neo Nano tank; 10+ FW tanks

07/03/2008, 07:50 PM	#2
kau_cinta_ku Moved On Join Date: May 2005 Location: NW Iowa Posts: 8,669	things happen during transit that the retailer can't avoid. I don't see why you are so angry at the place when they will gladly refund the fish if it does die. what more do you want from them? yes it is sad things like this do happen but they do. you just have to move on and hope for the best. for the fish, I would start a hypo treatment for the ich and start feeding foods soaked in garlic to get him to eat well.

07/03/2008, 07:52 PM	#3
abulgin Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 2,664	mistake

07/03/2008, 08:23 PM	#4
squealy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 113	This wasn't a problem with transit, like we hear about heavy boxes of LR being dropped by FedEx. I guess I think that problems can be anticipated and avoided. If I were packing something valuable in water, I would secure each bag separately, so in case one opened the others would still be secure. If I were called by a customer that this problem occurred, I probably would have said something like "I'm really sorry that happened. Maybe we can change our practices to avoid this in the future". We're not talking about a candy dish breaking in the mail. I feel that retailers have an obligation to do all they can do to ensure that a fish arrives safely at a destination. Maybe because I'm new at this, I expect more than others who've been at this for a while. I may have to revise my expectations. Thanks for the advice about hypo and garlic. We'll see how this guy does in the coming weeks.

07/03/2008, 09:09 PM	#6
squealy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 113	Live Aquaria has always been my first choice, and I've never had a problem with them. Unfortunately, they didn't have the fish I was looking for at this time. Next time I'll wait until they do.

07/04/2008, 02:28 PM	#10
uscharalph Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 1,248	I think it will be a great story when he survives and then thrives. __________________ Ralph Mendoza Jr. Long Beach, CA Current Tank Info: 80 Gallon Reef Tank

07/04/2008, 04:15 PM	#11
Playa-1 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Laguna Niguel, CA Posts: 7,497	Well what I would do is to try and save the fish. Then I would alert my fellow hobbyist about who they might want to think twice about doing business with and why. I'm sure the mistake was not intentional, but businesses these days have gotten away from proper customer service. As consumers and patrons, We need to rise together and send a clear message that we can and will take our business elsewhere. It's also wise to research companies before you do business with them. Just because they post the cheapest price doesn't mean that they are worthy of your hard earned dollars.

07/04/2008, 04:32 PM	#12
squealy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 113	So here's an update. He's actually looking much better today. Moving around a little but shy. He is reluctantly eating frozen brine shrimp. Breathing a little better. Obviously still has ich spots and one bigger spot that may be lympho. I've done two water changes with ro/di water on the way down to 1.009. Overall he is looking pretty good given the circumstances. Maybe there is something to these hardy fish. I doubt that a butterfly or tang would have survived the trip. Thanks for all the well wishes. I'll periodically give you updates on his condition.