DIY Sump Design: What do you think? PICS!

scaryperson27 · 09/21/2008, 11:17 PM

This is the sump that's going under my 26"L x 24"W x 22"T (59 gallon) shallow cube. The stand will be 36" tall and have an inside footprint of about 24"L x 22"W (with open back) and 32"T

the sump is very simple:
3/8" construction
23"L x 14"W x 14"H

1st compartment: Skimmer and the tank to overflow into filter socks.
-The acrylic piece that the socks sit in will be removable.

2nd compartment: Refugium.

3rd compartment: Return section.

Kannin · 09/21/2008, 11:46 PM

I made a similar set up and there were two problems with it... both, relating to the fuge in the center.

#1. If you've got 600 or more gallons draining into the sump... you shouldn't have that much running through the fuge.

#2. The return section was too small. All of the evap shows up there.

I solved both problems by switching the return section with the fuge. I pump a third of the water over the center return section to the fuge and then it drains back to the center return. I use a maxi jet 900 which pumps around 200 gph.

scaryperson27 · 09/22/2008, 01:03 AM

Here is a new design. I don't see the problem with the sock and return section being in the same spot seeing as how all of my equipment is external.

The lid over the Sock section is completely removable. the socks are completely and sock holder are completely removable. I can essentially take the sump apart for maintenance!!

The new dimentions are 15"L x 14"W x 23"T

What do you guys think?

Quote:

Originally posted by Kannin
I made a similar set up and there were two problems with it... both, relating to the fuge in the center.

#1. If you've got 600 or more gallons draining into the sump... you shouldn't have that much running through the fuge.

#2. The return section was too small. All of the evap shows up there.

I solved both problems by switching the return section with the fuge. I pump a third of the water over the center return section to the fuge and then it drains back to the center return. I use a maxi jet 900 which pumps around 200 gph.

I took your thoughts into consideration and this is what I came up with.

coralfragger101 · 09/22/2008, 03:45 AM

That means the ATO needs to go in that first compartment as well and that surface water "might" be a bit chaotic.

Almon · 09/22/2008, 03:59 AM

I liked your first design better.

Quote:

#2. The return section was too small. All of the evap shows up there.

I think that's exactly what you want, the return section being smaller. When that section is smaller, the auto top-off will turn on/off many more times throughout the day, dispensing top-off water or Kalk in smaller doses. For example, if you evaporate 5 gallons per day: a larger compartment may trigger the auto-topoff 5 times per day, dispensing 1 gallon each time. A smaller compartment may trigger the auto-topoff 20 times per day dispensing 1/4 gallon each time. IMO, the latter is prefered.

Quote:

#1. If you've got 600 or more gallons draining into the sump... you shouldn't have that much running through the fuge.

I'm not sure why you wouldn't want that much flow through the fuge, maybe because low flow is more effective? Maybe Kannin could explain more?

nitroxgas diver · 09/22/2008, 04:35 AM

Your first one is how I have my 55 gal tank fuge conversion made, without the sock. The fuge works out to almost 30 gal in my set up. Although there is alot of flow through the fuge , it is quite calm in there. The only flaw in this is keeping things that move around out of the return pump area (ie sea horses,fish,etc.) Once all the sand settled it has been working great for over 2 years. IMHO.

Almon · 09/22/2008, 04:57 AM

If the skimmer is in the first section, how are you going to provide maintenance to it, to clean it and such?

AZDesertRat · 09/22/2008, 08:47 AM

It does not appear to me to have enough room for backsiphonage in a power outage. You need to keep the baffles and water level low enough to contain the extra water when the return pump is shut off. I would guess your cube is going to return at least a couple gallons to the sump in a power outage situation. I get 3.5 gallons back to the sump with my 100G dropping about 3/4".

scaryperson27 · 09/22/2008, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AZDesertRat
It does not appear to me to have enough room for backsiphonage in a power outage. You need to keep the baffles and water level low enough to contain the extra water when the return pump is shut off. I would guess your cube is going to return at least a couple gallons to the sump in a power outage situation. I get 3.5 gallons back to the sump with my 100G dropping about 3/4".

The volume of the first one running will be roughly 11 gallons. The total sump volume will be roughly 19 gallons. The second one will be roughly 15 gallons running and 21 gallons total. So in the first one, i will have 8 gallons until it is to the brim and ready to overflow. In the second one, I will have only six gallons until it overflows.

I will have a 1080GPH @ 3' head pressure pump on the tank.

Poseidon PS4

I'll probably do 900 at 5' head pressure. 200GPH will be delivered to the Octopus recirc 150, and probably about 100GPH through the media reactor. All of which will be running off a Manifold.

I guess i'll have in between 500-600 going through the tank and back to the sump through the Glass-Holes 1.5" 700GPH overflow kit.

Overflow

Do you think this will be a problem?

Quote:

Originally posted by Almon
If the skimmer is in the first section, how are you going to provide maintenance to it, to clean it and such?

The skimmer will be external from the sump completely.

scaryperson27 · 09/22/2008, 12:47 PM

I'm thinking of using the first design, raising the entire sump height to 15 inches, raising the second baffles to 13 inches to achieve a 9.5 gallon sump height. that'll also give me 6 gallons before overflow.

That will give me 3 1/4 gallons up to the height of the baffles before the pump runs dry. I'll have to have some sort of ATO set on a shelf inside the stand.

AZDesertRat · 09/22/2008, 12:51 PM

I am not sure how you arrived at the sump volumes when running? In the first one the lowest baffles are at least 3/4 as tall as the sump so I would say if the total static volume is 19 gallons you will have close to 15 in it running since the water level will always be as high as the lowest baffle.
In the second one the water level is always going to be at the bottom of the drilled hole between the two sections so it has almost zero capacity for backflow?
Am I looking at this wrong?

scaryperson27 · 09/22/2008, 01:12 PM

Here is an explanation of the sump how I figure the sump volume will work.

Do you think the math was done right?

09/22/2008, 03:45 AM	#4
coralfragger101 Gone Postal Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Coral Springs, FL Posts: 5,461	That means the ATO needs to go in that first compartment as well and that surface water "might" be a bit chaotic. __________________ Views expressed by this person are not neccessarily the views of any other person and may never be. Apology extended to any member who takes offense to any post. Offense is not meant nor intended. Current Tank Info: NONE - Sold - Can't afford it right now!

09/22/2008, 04:57 AM	#7
Almon Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Laurel, Maryland Posts: 66	If the skimmer is in the first section, how are you going to provide maintenance to it, to clean it and such? __________________ Almon Current Tank Info: 220g Mixed Reef, 55g Refugium, 55g Fish tank, 40g Frag tank

09/21/2008, 11:17 PM	#1
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,106	DIY Sump Design: What do you think? PICS! This is the sump that's going under my 26"L x 24"W x 22"T (59 gallon) shallow cube. The stand will be 36" tall and have an inside footprint of about 24"L x 22"W (with open back) and 32"T the sump is very simple: 3/8" construction 23"L x 14"W x 14"H 1st compartment: Skimmer and the tank to overflow into filter socks. -The acrylic piece that the socks sit in will be removable. 2nd compartment: Refugium. 3rd compartment: Return section.

09/21/2008, 11:46 PM	#2
Kannin Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Fall City, WA Posts: 1,538	I made a similar set up and there were two problems with it... both, relating to the fuge in the center. #1. If you've got 600 or more gallons draining into the sump... you shouldn't have that much running through the fuge. #2. The return section was too small. All of the evap shows up there. I solved both problems by switching the return section with the fuge. I pump a third of the water over the center return section to the fuge and then it drains back to the center return. I use a maxi jet 900 which pumps around 200 gph. __________________ I used to target feed mojanos... until I found out that they weren't baby bubble tips.

09/22/2008, 04:35 AM	#6
nitroxgas diver Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: northern arizona Posts: 48	Your first one is how I have my 55 gal tank fuge conversion made, without the sock. The fuge works out to almost 30 gal in my set up. Although there is alot of flow through the fuge , it is quite calm in there. The only flaw in this is keeping things that move around out of the return pump area (ie sea horses,fish,etc.) Once all the sand settled it has been working great for over 2 years. IMHO.

09/22/2008, 08:47 AM	#8
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	It does not appear to me to have enough room for backsiphonage in a power outage. You need to keep the baffles and water level low enough to contain the extra water when the return pump is shut off. I would guess your cube is going to return at least a couple gallons to the sump in a power outage situation. I get 3.5 gallons back to the sump with my 100G dropping about 3/4".

09/22/2008, 12:47 PM	#10
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,106	I'm thinking of using the first design, raising the entire sump height to 15 inches, raising the second baffles to 13 inches to achieve a 9.5 gallon sump height. that'll also give me 6 gallons before overflow. That will give me 3 1/4 gallons up to the height of the baffles before the pump runs dry. I'll have to have some sort of ATO set on a shelf inside the stand.

09/22/2008, 12:51 PM	#11
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	I am not sure how you arrived at the sump volumes when running? In the first one the lowest baffles are at least 3/4 as tall as the sump so I would say if the total static volume is 19 gallons you will have close to 15 in it running since the water level will always be as high as the lowest baffle. In the second one the water level is always going to be at the bottom of the drilled hole between the two sections so it has almost zero capacity for backflow? Am I looking at this wrong?

09/22/2008, 01:12 PM	#12
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,106	Here is an explanation of the sump how I figure the sump volume will work. Do you think the math was done right?