Need some pointers

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 03:52 PM

Im planning to start turning my freshwater tank into a saltwater tank.MyTank is a 20 gallon long. I also have a 150 gallon fresh water tank where my oscars stay. When i bought my 150 it was used for saltwater and i have a bunch of the equipment still including the sump tank with bio balls and the universal eheim pump. I also have the the lighting for the salt water tank.
I have surfed the internet and haven't really found a whole lot on small reef tanks.
So here are the questions i have come up with
I was wondering a few things.
1st Where do i start
2nd What are good cheap fish that are somewhat hearty
3rd what should i use for sand or coral
4th How much i expect to pay for the other stuff that is needed to finish
my tank up
Thanks for the help Guys

Englishmatt · 06/20/2012, 03:56 PM

1.) What type of SW tank do you want? Reef or FOWLR?

2.) Good cheap "Hardy" fish are Chromis, Damsels, Clowns and a few others.

3.) Use an aragonite base. It'll help with Ca and KH level stability

4.) Can't help you there...it's a crap shoot depending on the answer to # 1

HTH,

Matt.

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 04:00 PM

What would you suggest for a beginner tank?
Could i upgrade to a reef tank later on down the road with out much more expense?

Englishmatt · 06/20/2012, 04:09 PM

Have you checked out the NANO reef section of this forum?

Fish only is certainly an easier way to go, but in a 20G you may get bored real quick with limited options.

You could do a small reef but you'll need a skimmer at bare minimum. Not sure about the Bio-Ball approach these days. I have no experience with them on SW, but they are "old-skool" for freshwater wet/dry sump filter environments.

What lights do you have? Reef will need good/great lighting, FOWLR...good lighting is acceptable.

You'll want good flow and filtration to keep the detritus from settling. 20G isn't a huge amount of water so the dilution rate for toxins/waste isn't very high.

You'll find coverting your 150 to SW will be easier...most likely.

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 04:13 PM

150 gallon tank Oscar tank

my 20 gallon long tank(might be trading it for a 30 gallon tall tank)

The sump that came with my 150

I have 2 of these

The eheim universal pump that came with it

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 04:32 PM

pics are up

mbd521 · 06/20/2012, 04:50 PM

looks to me like the only thing you need to do is get some plumbing pieces, and a portien skimmer and you would be ready for a FOWLR... get some quality lighting and youd be ready for a reef.

just a note... protien skimmers are HIGHLY recomended not absolutely nescessity. they will help keep the water alot cleaner and reduce water changes. I would think that on a 20 gal long you would be doing alot of water changes anyways.

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbd521

looks to me like the only thing you need to do is get some plumbing pieces, and a portien skimmer and you would be ready for a FOWLR... get some quality lighting and youd be ready for a reef.

just a note... protien skimmers are HIGHLY recomended not absolutely nescessity. they will help keep the water alot cleaner and reduce water changes. I would think that on a 20 gal long you would be doing alot of water changes anyways.

Well the lighting that came with my 150 gallon is made for a reef tank. Not sure the brand or the specifics but it has 2 switches on it one for a white-ish light and another for a dark blueish light. i have 2 of them on my 150 gallon and i was thinking of switching it out with the regular light on my 20 gallon or the one on the 30 gallon i might be trading for my 20 gallon

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 04:58 PM

i also have all the plumbing including the box that hangs on the back of the tank

mbd521 · 06/20/2012, 05:01 PM

I would definatley go for a bigger tank. if you can get a 30. I have found that my local craigst list has tanks on there for really really cheap... about average price for a 55gal by itself is around 50$ for a 75 gal around 150 with stand included.

Bigger tank means more stable water... Nicer for fish and corals... besides it also means a greater varitey of fishes to chose from.

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 05:12 PM

Just talked to one of my family members who wants to downsize to a 20 gallon from her 30 gallon... So looks like its a 30 gallon tall for me.... will fit perfect in my apartment.
Plus i think if i get a bigger tank than a 30 gallon..... My girlfriend will make me get out.... and i cant see myself living in my 150 gallon tank......

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 05:24 PM

If i had to guess the sump tank is about 20+gallons Is that over kill?
A few more questions

1st Should i use the sump tank i have?
2nd Should i keep the bio balls in there?
3rd If i keep don't use the bio balls, What should i use in there?
I really am thinking about using live coral and live sand in the tank

mbd521 · 06/20/2012, 05:24 PM

just let her pick out a fish! she will love it!! lol!!

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Englishmatt

1.) What type of SW tank do you want? Reef or FOWLR?

2.) Good cheap "Hardy" fish are Chromis, Damsels, Clowns and a few others.

3.) Use an aragonite base. It'll help with Ca and KH level stability

4.) Can't help you there...it's a crap shoot depending on the answer to # 1

HTH,

Matt.

I want to go with a reef tank. i am just not sure where to start with looking to buy stuff for a reef tank i did some looking on ebay and found a few things here are some links.. Let me know the pros and cons on what i have found
live rock
http://www.ebay.com/itm/390430174271...84.m1423.l2649
sand
http://www.ebay.com/itm/160803804565...84.m1423.l2649

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbd521

just let her pick out a fish! she will love it!! lol!!

That will be after i set up the tank...... I got to get the tank cycled before she will jump on the band wagon

exodus · 06/20/2012, 06:24 PM

Did you treat your freshwater tanks with any chemicals? If so, that could spell disaster for any invertebrates (and potentially fish). Find out what if anything was dosed in the tank - especially copper.

I would start by reading all the stickies on this forum and don't think that you're different.

Reefs definitely do cost more $$$. Both in lighting and keeping your water quality where it needs to be vis a vis equipment. You'll also be spending more money on corals, etc.

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exodus

Did you treat your freshwater tanks with any chemicals? If so, that could spell disaster for any invertebrates (and potentially fish). Find out what if anything was dosed in the tank - especially copper.

I would start by reading all the stickies on this forum and don't think that you're different.

Reefs definitely do cost more $$$. Both in lighting and keeping your water quality where it needs to be vis a vis equipment. You'll also be spending more money on corals, etc.

i have slowly been reading thru the stickies.... there is a ton of them.. I figured i would just post my questions up to see if there was a quick answer... I know i am not different than any other noob on here... I have done quite a bit of research and i am just trying to sketch my design up

Noobtosalty · 06/20/2012, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exodus

Did you treat your freshwater tanks with any chemicals? If so, that could spell disaster for any invertebrates (and potentially fish). Find out what if anything was dosed in the tank - especially copper.

I would start by reading all the stickies on this forum and don't think that you're different.

Reefs definitely do cost more $$$. Both in lighting and keeping your water quality where it needs to be vis a vis equipment. You'll also be spending more money on corals, etc.

no chemicals in any of my tanks

KCombs · 06/20/2012, 09:20 PM

Quote:

1st Where do i start
2nd What are good cheap fish that are somewhat hearty
3rd what should i use for sand or coral
4th How much i expect to pay for the other stuff that is needed to finish
my tank up
Thanks for the help Guys

pointers: rather than be specific, here is a soapbox oratory that might be helpful

1) not everything you read, nor every poster on the net is a expert
2) expensive/trendy doesn't always equal better
3) There are few quick fixes, especially "chemical" ones
4) Take your time, be patient and expect failure; its all part of it and the challenge or potential for failure is what makes this hobby
5) Don't be afraid to experiment a lil (to a point and in moderation) ...always use reasoning and accumulated experience ...

...anyway, this hobby is cyclical; one person will expound this salt is the greatest o9r this skimmer is the greatest or this (insert expensive product) is all the rage and woebegone to any and all that challenge that trend...

Don't fall into that trap. enjoy the hobby and stick with it

Noobtosalty · 06/21/2012, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCombs

pointers: rather than be specific, here is a soapbox oratory that might be helpful

1) not everything you read, nor every poster on the net is a expert
2) expensive/trendy doesn't always equal better
3) There are few quick fixes, especially "chemical" ones
4) Take your time, be patient and expect failure; its all part of it and the challenge or potential for failure is what makes this hobby
5) Don't be afraid to experiment a lil (to a point and in moderation) ...always use reasoning and accumulated experience ...

...anyway, this hobby is cyclical; one person will expound this salt is the greatest o9r this skimmer is the greatest or this (insert expensive product) is all the rage and woebegone to any and all that challenge that trend...

Don't fall into that trap. enjoy the hobby and stick with it

All what u said really makes sense.....
2 its like that with any hobby or most things in general...
The ordering starts today

rogermccray · 06/21/2012, 07:53 AM

If it were me I would definitely keep the sump, but get rid of the bio balls. For now the only thing I would add to the sump is the protein skimmer and heaters (if you need them). The real great thing about a sump is the ability to hide all that equipment.

If you want to do a sump I would recommend checking out glass holes as a way to drill the tank and save yourself a possible disaster of an over flow box. If you are not a DIY kind of guy then stick with the overflow box just know that they can lose suction and cause an overflow of your main tank.

sponger0 · 06/21/2012, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exodus

Find out what if anything was dosed in the tank - especially copper.

This is a myth. Silicone doesnt absorb copper.

Noobtosalty · 06/21/2012, 10:08 AM

Well i have done more researching and i have found this article which is very informative
http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/fil...filtration.htm
You there is a ton of different links in there including choosing you filter media and also how each system works

sponger0 · 06/21/2012, 10:11 AM

You will get alot better information on here as opposed that site.

Noobtosalty · 06/21/2012, 10:18 AM

OK that's good to know..... I am just really stumped on my filter setup...
Not really sure if i should keep the bio balls. Is there such thing as too much filter for a reef tank?
And i don't want to flood my house if the sump tank over flows or over flow the tank...
i am trading tanks this weekend with my relative
I am going to be running a 30 gallon tall tank
Would a protein skimmer be neccesary for my set up?
After i get the tank i am headed to the pet store to pick up sand and salt and i guess going from there

06/20/2012, 03:52 PM	#1
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	Need some pointers Im planning to start turning my freshwater tank into a saltwater tank.MyTank is a 20 gallon long. I also have a 150 gallon fresh water tank where my oscars stay. When i bought my 150 it was used for saltwater and i have a bunch of the equipment still including the sump tank with bio balls and the universal eheim pump. I also have the the lighting for the salt water tank. I have surfed the internet and haven't really found a whole lot on small reef tanks. So here are the questions i have come up with I was wondering a few things. 1st Where do i start 2nd What are good cheap fish that are somewhat hearty 3rd what should i use for sand or coral 4th How much i expect to pay for the other stuff that is needed to finish my tank up Thanks for the help Guys

06/20/2012, 03:56 PM	#2
Englishmatt Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Woodstock, GA Posts: 162	1.) What type of SW tank do you want? Reef or FOWLR? 2.) Good cheap "Hardy" fish are Chromis, Damsels, Clowns and a few others. 3.) Use an aragonite base. It'll help with Ca and KH level stability 4.) Can't help you there...it's a crap shoot depending on the answer to # 1 HTH, Matt. __________________ DT Info: 220G (72x30x24), 40G Refugium, 40G QT, 60G Sump (Berlin 400 Sump and Eshopps RS300 Sump), Bubble Magnus Curve 9 Skimmer, BP Reactor, Reeflo Manta Ray Return, 2 x MP40s, 2 Maxspect Gyre XF250

06/20/2012, 04:09 PM	#4
Englishmatt Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Woodstock, GA Posts: 162	Have you checked out the NANO reef section of this forum? Fish only is certainly an easier way to go, but in a 20G you may get bored real quick with limited options. You could do a small reef but you'll need a skimmer at bare minimum. Not sure about the Bio-Ball approach these days. I have no experience with them on SW, but they are "old-skool" for freshwater wet/dry sump filter environments. What lights do you have? Reef will need good/great lighting, FOWLR...good lighting is acceptable. You'll want good flow and filtration to keep the detritus from settling. 20G isn't a huge amount of water so the dilution rate for toxins/waste isn't very high. You'll find coverting your 150 to SW will be easier...most likely. __________________ DT Info: 220G (72x30x24), 40G Refugium, 40G QT, 60G Sump (Berlin 400 Sump and Eshopps RS300 Sump), Bubble Magnus Curve 9 Skimmer, BP Reactor, Reeflo Manta Ray Return, 2 x MP40s, 2 Maxspect Gyre XF250

06/20/2012, 04:13 PM	#5
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	150 gallon tank Oscar tank my 20 gallon long tank(might be trading it for a 30 gallon tall tank) The sump that came with my 150 I have 2 of these The eheim universal pump that came with it Last edited by Noobtosalty; 06/20/2012 at 04:32 PM.

06/20/2012, 06:24 PM	#16
exodus Reefer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 551	Did you treat your freshwater tanks with any chemicals? If so, that could spell disaster for any invertebrates (and potentially fish). Find out what if anything was dosed in the tank - especially copper. I would start by reading all the stickies on this forum and don't think that you're different. Reefs definitely do cost more $$$. Both in lighting and keeping your water quality where it needs to be vis a vis equipment. You'll also be spending more money on corals, etc. __________________ <>< "For God created all the swimming and living things in the ocean ... and He saw that it was good." <>< Current Tank Info: TBD

06/20/2012, 04:00 PM	#3
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	What would you suggest for a beginner tank? Could i upgrade to a reef tank later on down the road with out much more expense?

06/20/2012, 04:32 PM	#6
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	pics are up

06/20/2012, 04:50 PM	#7
mbd521 Registered Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Akron, Ohio Posts: 113	looks to me like the only thing you need to do is get some plumbing pieces, and a portien skimmer and you would be ready for a FOWLR... get some quality lighting and youd be ready for a reef. just a note... protien skimmers are HIGHLY recomended not absolutely nescessity. they will help keep the water alot cleaner and reduce water changes. I would think that on a 20 gal long you would be doing alot of water changes anyways.

06/20/2012, 04:58 PM	#9
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	i also have all the plumbing including the box that hangs on the back of the tank

06/20/2012, 05:01 PM	#10
mbd521 Registered Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Akron, Ohio Posts: 113	I would definatley go for a bigger tank. if you can get a 30. I have found that my local craigst list has tanks on there for really really cheap... about average price for a 55gal by itself is around 50$ for a 75 gal around 150 with stand included. Bigger tank means more stable water... Nicer for fish and corals... besides it also means a greater varitey of fishes to chose from.

06/20/2012, 05:12 PM	#11
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	Just talked to one of my family members who wants to downsize to a 20 gallon from her 30 gallon... So looks like its a 30 gallon tall for me.... will fit perfect in my apartment. Plus i think if i get a bigger tank than a 30 gallon..... My girlfriend will make me get out.... and i cant see myself living in my 150 gallon tank......

06/20/2012, 05:24 PM	#12
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	If i had to guess the sump tank is about 20+gallons Is that over kill? A few more questions 1st Should i use the sump tank i have? 2nd Should i keep the bio balls in there? 3rd If i keep don't use the bio balls, What should i use in there? I really am thinking about using live coral and live sand in the tank

06/21/2012, 07:53 AM	#21
rogermccray Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,050	If it were me I would definitely keep the sump, but get rid of the bio balls. For now the only thing I would add to the sump is the protein skimmer and heaters (if you need them). The real great thing about a sump is the ability to hide all that equipment. If you want to do a sump I would recommend checking out glass holes as a way to drill the tank and save yourself a possible disaster of an over flow box. If you are not a DIY kind of guy then stick with the overflow box just know that they can lose suction and cause an overflow of your main tank.

06/21/2012, 10:08 AM	#23
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	Well i have done more researching and i have found this article which is very informative http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/fil...filtration.htm You there is a ton of different links in there including choosing you filter media and also how each system works

06/21/2012, 10:11 AM	#24
sponger0 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Virginia Beach Posts: 6,659	You will get alot better information on here as opposed that site.

06/21/2012, 10:18 AM	#25
Noobtosalty Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Vermont Posts: 410	OK that's good to know..... I am just really stumped on my filter setup... Not really sure if i should keep the bio balls. Is there such thing as too much filter for a reef tank? And i don't want to flood my house if the sump tank over flows or over flow the tank... i am trading tanks this weekend with my relative I am going to be running a 30 gallon tall tank Would a protein skimmer be neccesary for my set up? After i get the tank i am headed to the pet store to pick up sand and salt and i guess going from there