Lanthanum Chloride and Tangs

[nouveaugosse]

I have a 65g reef setup with a 25g refugium. I've been having some issues with phosphates. At the advice of another reefer I tried using lanthanum chloride or phosphate remover that is used in swimming pools. I dosed < 1mL into my overflow which then passed through 10 micron filter socks carbon filters, skimmer etc. The water only became slightly cloudy (precipitate) and cleared within a few minutes.
Unfortunately this killed my Tangs . I had read that the precipitate is toxic to Tangs and was aware there was some risk,but I had also read that if filtered through a 10 micron sock most people had no trouble. This was not my experience and I would never recommend anyone use lanthanum chloride in a home aquarium. I am just going to move onto using a phosphate reactor.
My question however, is this, How long should I wait before introducing Tangs back into my aquarium? Should I do a massive water change before doing so?
If any of the precipitate remains on the sand bed will this harm Tangs. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[bertoni]

We don't know exactly how tangs are affected, so I personally would suggest using a fair amount of caution. I doubt that a water change will help all that much at this point, but I'd remove as much of the precipitate as I could get, and likely wait a few weeks for the water to clear and bacteria to weigh down more of the precipitate.

[supra400hptt]

I've used it with a purple tang in the tank with no problems. However, I use a 5 micron sock and mix 5ml in a gallon of rodi. Then I drip it over night.

[tmz]

I personally, saw a yellow tang drop in its tracks after swimming through a very light cloud . There are a number of reports of calms dieing and small fishes but tangs seem very sensitive to it as far as larger fish go. It may be the precipitant but it may also be free lanthanum precipitating with PO4 or carbonate on the gill tissue. It's dangerous stuff unless it is dosed very slowly and completely prefiltered. No cloudy water whatsoever ;very slow drip through the finest micron you can find.Personally, I only use it for treating rocks that are leaching Po4 outside the tank in a curing bin.I'veusedvery small amounts dripped very slowly into flowing water through fine filtration in the past but not in recent years.

I would guess the precipitant is settled by now and relatively benign but I'm not sure about that. Whatever free lanthanum was moving about is likely precipitated by now. I'm not sure how you could get all of the precipitant out in any case without something like a diatom filter.

[ironwill723]

I used it in a reef system with a purple tang and he developed HLLE soon after(within days). I will never use again. I'm running a diatom filter now to try to get out the fines that got through the 5 micron sock.

[ingtar_shinowa]

Thanks for this thread. I was thinking about using it but not anymore.

[slief]

Not sure who suggested that but that is the wrong way to use LaCl in my opinion. I'm actually surprised anybody with any longevity in this hobby would suggest using LaCl for that matter. I've been in this hobby 25 years now and despite the fact that I have used it successfully, I would never suggest anybody using this stuff without serious experience and plenty of their own research.

I would also never suggest dosing it straight into the overflow like that. What you should have done is dilute the LaCl into a large amount (relatively speaking) of RODI water. Then drip that water directly into the overflow and do it slowly so the 10 micron sock can catch every bit of the percipitate it creates. If you do it slow enough, the LaCl wont make it past the sock and the filter sock will catch all the percipitate.

I inject the LaCl into an IV bag that is filled with RODI water. Then drip the mixture into my socks over the course of hours (a drip or two a second) and change the 10 micron socks out as they clog up. I experienced no cloudiness and no casualties and my results were stellar.

LaCl is serious stuff and should not be taken lightly. It's also not something to just shot gun into. If you are going to mess with that stuff, you really need to do your own homework and not just take somebodies word for it.

There is a great thread here which I strongly suggest reading if you or anybody else is considering using LaCl.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...ight=lanthanum

[Plato]

It works but I managed to kill all LPS in a tank for dropping PO4 to low. Yes if dosed enough tangs start breathing very rapidly and don't like it. I dose by mixing 10ml into 16oz RO/DI water. That gets dosed 1ml per hour into a massive skimmer (old reeflow Orca Pro skimmer) using a CoralVue dosing pump. It take over a week to dose the whole 16oz. If you dose enough to notice cloudy water its too much. Try only one or two cc.