Clown deaths

SteveNMegz · 08/30/2016, 04:58 PM

Hi, we added our first fish being 2 gladiator clowns to our new 3 week old zeovit system this past weekend and have now had one death and probably another coming up. The first 36 hours both fish looked well except the one that died was not eating. The next morning he was swimming around on its side and vertical and by noon was stuck in the overflow dead.

Now the next morning the other clown will not eat anymore and has lost a lot of colour and has been swimming near the top of the tank all day. Parameters are all in check and cannot for the life of me figure out what's happening. Crabs and snails are all fine.

Test : ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 0-2.5, ph 7.8, Alk 7, mag 1160, calc 375

I've added an air bubbler in case of a lack of oxygen but does not seem to be helping now 24 hours later (we had lots of flow and surface agitation to start but worth a shot) I've now added a grounding probe just in case. I'm not sure what else I can do. I've spent almost $100 on different kinds of food and he will not eat a thing not even frozen foods.

Any help would be appreciated!!!!!

mcgyvr · 08/30/2016, 05:13 PM

Well.. fish do die and shock alone from transportation can do it..
Did you buy them locally or have it shipped?
Any acclimation? Quarantine?

You do run everything that is submerged on a GFCI outlet/breaker right? If not don't use a ground probe..

SteveNMegz · 08/30/2016, 05:21 PM

We bought them about an hour away from us acclimated over an hour, about 1/2cup changed at a time while floating in the tank. No quarantine setup.

Yes our panel is all breakers, no gfci outlet though.

mcgyvr · 08/30/2016, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveNMegz

We bought them about an hour away from us acclimated over an hour, about 1/2cup changed at a time while floating in the tank. No quarantine setup.

Yes our panel is all breakers, no gfci outlet though.

All breakers are not GFCI.. If not a GFCI breaker then remove the ground probe and get GFCI protected..(swap out outlet.. get power strip with GFCI built int.. swap breaker to GFCI breaker)

ALL mains powered submerged equipment should/must be GFCI protected..
Its for your safety..

A ground probe without GFCI just gives a path to ground with nothing stopping current from flowing unless it exceeds the current rating of the breaker..
Voltage/Current won't do anything without a path to ground..

anthonys51 · 08/30/2016, 06:30 PM

sounds like the fish where either sick or you didn't accumulate them probably.

when fish die there is really no need to test alk, cal, mag.
you should always quarantine new fish and match the qt tank to salinity of lfs.

but if you dont want to do that at least float for 10 mins, then empty the bag into a clean bucket. slowely drip water from your tank in, until it gets double. then empty half the water and do it again.

so dealer tank lets say in 1.18 your tank 1.26
half done water becomes 1.22
then water becomes 1.24

SteveNMegz · 08/30/2016, 06:39 PM

Looks like stray voltage may be at play here. With grounding probe in the tank there is 0V with it not in there is 4-5V. If I unplug the skimmer it jumps to 10V as I unplug things the voltage jumps all around from 20V to 0V depending one what is plugged in. Why would I see a jump when I unplug the skimmer???????

SteveNMegz · 08/30/2016, 06:48 PM

Im on my way to Walmart right now to pick up a gfci power bar. I'm guessing this will suffice until I can install the new outlet?

mcgyvr · 08/31/2016, 05:16 AM

um.. no.. Forget you ever heard the term "stray voltage"..
Its totally normal and just a fallacy in the aquarium world..

snorvich · 08/31/2016, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anthonys51

sounds like the fish where either sick or you didn't accumulate them probably.

when fish die there is really no need to test alk, cal, mag.
you should always quarantine new fish and match the qt tank to salinity of lfs.

but if you dont want to do that at least float for 10 mins, then empty the bag into a clean bucket. slowely drip water from your tank in, until it gets double. then empty half the water and do it again.

so dealer tank lets say in 1.18 your tank 1.26
half done water becomes 1.22
then water becomes 1.24

My vote. Time of acclimation is not relevant. They should always be placed in water matching the transport water (SG) ideally for quarantine.

Percula9 · 09/04/2016, 09:58 PM

Were the fish eating at the fish store?Never by a fish unless you see him eat first.Fish that are caught with cyanide will most likely die.Go back to the fish store and ask if they will replace them.At least one of them should be replaced.Always look for clear eyes and if the fish are rubbing against the rocks don't buy it.

Dogshowgrl · 09/05/2016, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Percula9

Were the fish eating at the fish store?Never by a fish unless you see him eat first.Fish that are caught with cyanide will most likely die.Go back to the fish store and ask if they will replace them.At least one of them should be replaced.Always look for clear eyes and if the fish are rubbing against the rocks don't buy it.

Did you miss that they are gladiators? Those are not available in the the wild they are a designer clown. They were not caught with canidae.

But yes wild caught fish are caught with poison. Either buy MAC certified, or CB to avoid the toxins.

But an issue all fish no matter the source have, is ammonia burn to their gills. They are not purged, then placed in bags and shipped for 24 or more hours. Their waste produces ammonia in the bag and it burns the gills. They act fine for a couple days then the damage shows with symptoms of not breathing well. They sit at the top or bottom of then tank, not in the middle water column.

This is common with CB fish.

MuShu · 09/05/2016, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveNMegz

We bought them about an hour away from us acclimated over an hour, about 1/2cup changed at a time while floating in the tank. No quarantine setup.

Yes our panel is all breakers, no gfci outlet though.

Did you match salinity of the store's water to your tank water? In most cases, stores are running hypo tanks. If you are not drip acclimating your fish to slowly bring up the salinity, you run the risk of them dying due to too big of a salinity difference.

JMorris271 · 09/05/2016, 10:04 AM

Match the salinity of the stores water first in the the tank the fish will move to.. Temp acclimate the fish and put fish into the qt if you use it or the DT if you don't. Then begin to adjust the tanks salinity to where it should be slowly over a few days. The difference between the stores salt level and your tanks level may require the fish to remain in the plastic bag itself too long without the ammonia rising.JM2C

08/30/2016, 04:58 PM	#1
SteveNMegz Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Port Colborne Posts: 1,140	Clown deaths Hi, we added our first fish being 2 gladiator clowns to our new 3 week old zeovit system this past weekend and have now had one death and probably another coming up. The first 36 hours both fish looked well except the one that died was not eating. The next morning he was swimming around on its side and vertical and by noon was stuck in the overflow dead. Now the next morning the other clown will not eat anymore and has lost a lot of colour and has been swimming near the top of the tank all day. Parameters are all in check and cannot for the life of me figure out what's happening. Crabs and snails are all fine. Test : ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 0-2.5, ph 7.8, Alk 7, mag 1160, calc 375 I've added an air bubbler in case of a lack of oxygen but does not seem to be helping now 24 hours later (we had lots of flow and surface agitation to start but worth a shot) I've now added a grounding probe just in case. I'm not sure what else I can do. I've spent almost $100 on different kinds of food and he will not eat a thing not even frozen foods. Any help would be appreciated!!!!! __________________ Steve and Megz Current Tank Info: 55G Shallow Reef (30x30x14) - Equip: Ecotech Radion XR30 G3 Pro, 2 Tunze 6055, Vertex Omega 130 Skimmer, Ecotech Vectra M1 return, Vertex Rx1.5 Zeovit Reactor

08/30/2016, 05:13 PM	#2
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	Well.. fish do die and shock alone from transportation can do it.. Did you buy them locally or have it shipped? Any acclimation? Quarantine? You do run everything that is submerged on a GFCI outlet/breaker right? If not don't use a ground probe.. __________________ Who me?

08/30/2016, 05:21 PM	#3
SteveNMegz Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Port Colborne Posts: 1,140	We bought them about an hour away from us acclimated over an hour, about 1/2cup changed at a time while floating in the tank. No quarantine setup. Yes our panel is all breakers, no gfci outlet though. __________________ Steve and Megz Current Tank Info: 55G Shallow Reef (30x30x14) - Equip: Ecotech Radion XR30 G3 Pro, 2 Tunze 6055, Vertex Omega 130 Skimmer, Ecotech Vectra M1 return, Vertex Rx1.5 Zeovit Reactor

08/30/2016, 06:39 PM	#6
SteveNMegz Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Port Colborne Posts: 1,140	Looks like stray voltage may be at play here. With grounding probe in the tank there is 0V with it not in there is 4-5V. If I unplug the skimmer it jumps to 10V as I unplug things the voltage jumps all around from 20V to 0V depending one what is plugged in. Why would I see a jump when I unplug the skimmer??????? __________________ Steve and Megz Current Tank Info: 55G Shallow Reef (30x30x14) - Equip: Ecotech Radion XR30 G3 Pro, 2 Tunze 6055, Vertex Omega 130 Skimmer, Ecotech Vectra M1 return, Vertex Rx1.5 Zeovit Reactor

08/30/2016, 06:48 PM	#7
SteveNMegz Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Port Colborne Posts: 1,140	Im on my way to Walmart right now to pick up a gfci power bar. I'm guessing this will suffice until I can install the new outlet? __________________ Steve and Megz Current Tank Info: 55G Shallow Reef (30x30x14) - Equip: Ecotech Radion XR30 G3 Pro, 2 Tunze 6055, Vertex Omega 130 Skimmer, Ecotech Vectra M1 return, Vertex Rx1.5 Zeovit Reactor

08/30/2016, 06:30 PM	#5
anthonys51 Registered Member. Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kings Park, NY Posts: 2,789	sounds like the fish where either sick or you didn't accumulate them probably. when fish die there is really no need to test alk, cal, mag. you should always quarantine new fish and match the qt tank to salinity of lfs. but if you dont want to do that at least float for 10 mins, then empty the bag into a clean bucket. slowely drip water from your tank in, until it gets double. then empty half the water and do it again. so dealer tank lets say in 1.18 your tank 1.26 half done water becomes 1.22 then water becomes 1.24

08/31/2016, 05:16 AM	#8
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	um.. no.. Forget you ever heard the term "stray voltage".. Its totally normal and just a fallacy in the aquarium world.. __________________ Who me?

09/04/2016, 09:58 PM	#10
Percula9 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Orange County CA Posts: 3,819	Were the fish eating at the fish store?Never by a fish unless you see him eat first.Fish that are caught with cyanide will most likely die.Go back to the fish store and ask if they will replace them.At least one of them should be replaced.Always look for clear eyes and if the fish are rubbing against the rocks don't buy it.

09/05/2016, 10:04 AM	#13
JMorris271 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Foothills of SC Posts: 2,010	Match the salinity of the stores water first in the the tank the fish will move to.. Temp acclimate the fish and put fish into the qt if you use it or the DT if you don't. Then begin to adjust the tanks salinity to where it should be slowly over a few days. The difference between the stores salt level and your tanks level may require the fish to remain in the plastic bag itself too long without the ammonia rising.JM2C __________________ 120 gal mixed tank. Lightly stocked now but.... Last edited by JMorris271; 09/05/2016 at 10:13 AM.