Changing my filter.....to emperor 280

G13 · 03/19/2006, 12:17 PM

I run a penguin 330 without the biowheels in a 45 gallon tank with 60lbs of LR and 60 lbs of LS. I also run an aqua C Remora skimmer HOB. I wanted to change the penguin to a differnt power filter. I want something smaller and I'm leaning toward the emperor 280. I mainly use my filter to run carbon/phosguard and to filter out large particles with the filter cartridge. And I had a couple questions.

-Should I start running the bio-wheel on the new filter?

-Any idea if the emperor is noisier then the penguin filters?

-Do you guys recommend a different filter? Whisper?

fsn77 · 03/20/2006, 08:17 AM

I'll chime in since no one else has yet...

For sw, most people recommend not using the bio-wheel, but I don't have a real opinion on that because I don't run a HOB filter on my sw tank.

The Emperor filters I use on my fw set-ups are very quiet. I have some of the older Penguin filters on a couple of my smaller fw set-ups -- the Emperors are quieter than those, but I don't know how they compare to the newer Penguins. You should realize that if you take out the bio-wheel, you will increase the noise level some, since the spray bar is designed to spray onto the bio-wheel. You can rotate it to spray back towards your media, but you might still get the sound of water from the spray bar hitting water in the main part of the filter body.

Just my opinion, but I wouldn't buy a Whisper filter (new) for any reason. I have a couple that I got used when I bought some used set-ups and I don't like them (even after buying replacement parts and re-building them). I prefer the Emperors over any Whisper filter.

G13 · 03/20/2006, 05:22 PM

Thanks for responding.

I ran the bio-wheels on my reef tank for about 2 yrs without a problem. I only took them out because they would continually stop and i couldn't figure out why, but I knew that it would do some harm (nitrates) if it was to dry.

I was thinking of running the emperor without the bio-wheel but noise was a concern since it contained a spray bar, so your post does help me with that decision.

fsn77 · 03/20/2006, 08:38 PM

You're quite welcome... no problem.

If there gets to some build up around the edges of the bio-wheel, on the axle itself, or even on the spray bar, the bio-wheel will slow down considerably and even stop. I'd imagine in a sw environment that would happen to a greater degree than in fw considering the the numerous chemicals added to sw tanks, like salt and calcium.

The problem with bio-wheels and high nitrates is not so much when it stops, but the principle behind the bio-wheel to begin with. They are designed to house the bacteria that convert ammonia to nitrate. It's essentially the same as the discussions about the pros and cons of bio-balls. While bio-wheels and bio-balls are two different things, their purpose is one in the same.

If you're really interested in not using the bio-wheel but still getting an Emperor, I'd try the Emperor without it to see how much noise it makes. If you have a cartridge or media holder in the slot closest to the spray bar, you may be able to direct the spray onto it enough to have only the smallest amount of noise. If you're worried about the bio-wheel drying out while you test, you can float it for quite some time in your tank (if nothing will bother it), sump / refugium (if you have one), or just in a small bucket of your tank water without killing off the bacteria.

Another option that would more or less deactivate the spray bar would be to remove the diverter "cap" that goes on down by the impeller. Without that cap, there is virtually no water forced up into the spray bar. I've run an Emperor like that for a little while, as I lost that piece once, but I don't know how long term performance is effected. That cap doesn't hold the impeller in place (it just forces water up to the spray bar), so I don't see how it would harm anything, but that is just my opinion of course.

Having said all that... if you don't already have an Emperor, you really wouldn't be buying one to use it as designed (bio-wheel, spray bar)... so I suppose it may or may not be worth it depending on the cost versus another filter you might have in mind. I will say that the refillable media cartridge the Emperor has is very useful for running media like PhosGuard, as I run that in the Emperor on my fw planted tank. Extra ones are available for purchase, also, so if you were to get a 280, you'd be able to run two different types of media if a standard floss / carbon cartridge plus the provided fillable cartridge don't satisfy your needs.

G13 · 03/21/2006, 04:32 PM

cool, thanks....I'm thinking of getting the penguin 200, since it has no spray bar and has an extra slot for a cartridge. Less GPH but that's not much of a concern since it's only a 45 gallon tank and it runs 24/7.

03/19/2006, 12:17 PM	#1
G13 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: chicago Posts: 810	Changing my filter.....to emperor 280 I run a penguin 330 without the biowheels in a 45 gallon tank with 60lbs of LR and 60 lbs of LS. I also run an aqua C Remora skimmer HOB. I wanted to change the penguin to a differnt power filter. I want something smaller and I'm leaning toward the emperor 280. I mainly use my filter to run carbon/phosguard and to filter out large particles with the filter cartridge. And I had a couple questions. -Should I start running the bio-wheel on the new filter? -Any idea if the emperor is noisier then the penguin filters? -Do you guys recommend a different filter? Whisper?

03/20/2006, 08:17 AM	#2
fsn77 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: SC Posts: 777	I'll chime in since no one else has yet... For sw, most people recommend not using the bio-wheel, but I don't have a real opinion on that because I don't run a HOB filter on my sw tank. The Emperor filters I use on my fw set-ups are very quiet. I have some of the older Penguin filters on a couple of my smaller fw set-ups -- the Emperors are quieter than those, but I don't know how they compare to the newer Penguins. You should realize that if you take out the bio-wheel, you will increase the noise level some, since the spray bar is designed to spray onto the bio-wheel. You can rotate it to spray back towards your media, but you might still get the sound of water from the spray bar hitting water in the main part of the filter body. Just my opinion, but I wouldn't buy a Whisper filter (new) for any reason. I have a couple that I got used when I bought some used set-ups and I don't like them (even after buying replacement parts and re-building them). I prefer the Emperors over any Whisper filter.

03/20/2006, 05:22 PM	#3
G13 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: chicago Posts: 810	Thanks for responding. I ran the bio-wheels on my reef tank for about 2 yrs without a problem. I only took them out because they would continually stop and i couldn't figure out why, but I knew that it would do some harm (nitrates) if it was to dry. I was thinking of running the emperor without the bio-wheel but noise was a concern since it contained a spray bar, so your post does help me with that decision.

03/20/2006, 08:38 PM	#4
fsn77 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: SC Posts: 777	You're quite welcome... no problem. If there gets to some build up around the edges of the bio-wheel, on the axle itself, or even on the spray bar, the bio-wheel will slow down considerably and even stop. I'd imagine in a sw environment that would happen to a greater degree than in fw considering the the numerous chemicals added to sw tanks, like salt and calcium. The problem with bio-wheels and high nitrates is not so much when it stops, but the principle behind the bio-wheel to begin with. They are designed to house the bacteria that convert ammonia to nitrate. It's essentially the same as the discussions about the pros and cons of bio-balls. While bio-wheels and bio-balls are two different things, their purpose is one in the same. If you're really interested in not using the bio-wheel but still getting an Emperor, I'd try the Emperor without it to see how much noise it makes. If you have a cartridge or media holder in the slot closest to the spray bar, you may be able to direct the spray onto it enough to have only the smallest amount of noise. If you're worried about the bio-wheel drying out while you test, you can float it for quite some time in your tank (if nothing will bother it), sump / refugium (if you have one), or just in a small bucket of your tank water without killing off the bacteria. Another option that would more or less deactivate the spray bar would be to remove the diverter "cap" that goes on down by the impeller. Without that cap, there is virtually no water forced up into the spray bar. I've run an Emperor like that for a little while, as I lost that piece once, but I don't know how long term performance is effected. That cap doesn't hold the impeller in place (it just forces water up to the spray bar), so I don't see how it would harm anything, but that is just my opinion of course. Having said all that... if you don't already have an Emperor, you really wouldn't be buying one to use it as designed (bio-wheel, spray bar)... so I suppose it may or may not be worth it depending on the cost versus another filter you might have in mind. I will say that the refillable media cartridge the Emperor has is very useful for running media like PhosGuard, as I run that in the Emperor on my fw planted tank. Extra ones are available for purchase, also, so if you were to get a 280, you'd be able to run two different types of media if a standard floss / carbon cartridge plus the provided fillable cartridge don't satisfy your needs.

03/21/2006, 04:32 PM	#5
G13 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: chicago Posts: 810	cool, thanks....I'm thinking of getting the penguin 200, since it has no spray bar and has an extra slot for a cartridge. Less GPH but that's not much of a concern since it's only a 45 gallon tank and it runs 24/7.