Seahorse Unable to swallow their food - Help!

duraace9sp · 07/14/2015, 10:46 AM

My wife has a pair of mustangs that were purchased from Ocean Riders seven months ago, and they have been extremely healthy until now. They are in a 50 gallon tank with four damselfish, 2 cardinals and a dart fish. Within the past two days two of the damselfish developed red sores on their sides and white spots on their fins. Now both seahorses have appetites and are trying to eat their PE mysis shrimp, but when they snick food from their feeding tray, they are unable to swallow it. They suck up their food and try to swallow – you can see their neck appendage going up and down, they partially eject the mysis extending it mostly out and try to swallow again and again, but ultimately end up spitting it out after several tried to swallow the mysis. Nothing in their diet has changed; twice a day they get PE mysis shrimp enriched with Vibrance II.

Today the seahorses were separated from all of their tank mates, given a 30 minute Formalin dip and moved into a 30 gallon established tank with lots of hitching posts and macro algae. They are still sucking food into their mouths, but cannot swallow it. Is this caused by a parasite or infection from the damselfish? What can I do to get my beloved seahorses healthy?

rayjay · 07/14/2015, 11:23 AM

I would say it's a combination of two things. Parasites that are always present but tend to become problematic with stress of the seahorse.
The stress comes from the tankmates whether or not you may believe it.
Seahorses do best when in a species only tank, but at the least, with tankmates that get the best ratings on the Tankmates Guide where 0 is best and 4 is worst.
Here in Canada Formalin is almost impossible to get so I rely on freshwater dips to see if there are parasites present.
I dip in freshwater that has no chlorine or chloramines present, matching pH and temperature best I can. If parasites are present, you will most likely see a heavy thrashing about of the seahorses as parasites explode from the fresh water.
Unless a seahorse becomes completely unresponsive to the touch, I leave them in for 12 minutes. If there is no thrashing, then cause is probably other than parasites and could be an internal bacteria problem or an internal chemical imbalance causing some organ failure.
Description you give though leaves more to the parasite being the problem.
You may have introduced more types of parasites than the seahorse had to start with by having fish from other breeding sources.
Short term I would also try feeding a smaller food like adult brine or mid sized brine shrimp to see if they can get those down.
I'd be prepared for hospital tank situation in case a parasitic problem gets infected and needs antibiotic treatment as well.

duraace9sp · 07/14/2015, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rayjay

I would say it's a combination of two things. Parasites that are always present but tend to become problematic with stress of the seahorse.
The stress comes from the tankmates whether or not you may believe it.
Seahorses do best when in a species only tank, but at the least, with tankmates that get the best ratings on the Tankmates Guide where 0 is best and 4 is worst.
Here in Canada Formalin is almost impossible to get so I rely on freshwater dips to see if there are parasites present.
I dip in freshwater that has no chlorine or chloramines present, matching pH and temperature best I can. If parasites are present, you will most likely see a heavy thrashing about of the seahorses as parasites explode from the fresh water.
Unless a seahorse becomes completely unresponsive to the touch, I leave them in for 12 minutes. If there is no thrashing, then cause is probably other than parasites and could be an internal bacteria problem or an internal chemical imbalance causing some organ failure.
Description you give though leaves more to the parasite being the problem.
You may have introduced more types of parasites than the seahorse had to start with by having fish from other breeding sources.
Short term I would also try feeding a smaller food like adult brine or mid sized brine shrimp to see if they can get those down.
I'd be prepared for hospital tank situation in case a parasitic problem gets infected and needs antibiotic treatment as well.

Thank you for the reply - at this time they are in a seahorse only tank with some macros we moved with them. I did not see any thrashing with the formalin - but you referenced anti-biotics? What type and where could I obtain (with a name I can search). They had the same tank mates since last January - only recently were two small single lined damsel/chromis introduced with the other two - The fish are no longer with the seahorses. Again these are pets and family members to us - not objects and we appreciate any advice on helping them regain their health.

Thank you

rayjay · 07/14/2015, 01:02 PM

Well you have started off well by doing the formalin dip as I believe Dan Underwood of seahorsesource.com recommends either a freshwater dip or a 30 to 60 minute formalin dip for parasites.
In any event, after treating for parasites I would think it will take a day or so for things to get better so they do eat.
Hopefully the tank they are in now won't have any tankmates to bother them, or stinging corals or unprotected intakes or unprotected heaters.
You could lower the temperature down to 68° to help prevent bacteria from becoming a problem if it isn't already. Probably about 2° a day would work.
Normal temperature recommendation would be to run between 68° and 74° because of their affinity to infections from bacteria.
I personally don't believe in using antibacteria agents (and only in a hospital tank) unless I know that they are needed or at least likely needed, but when I do, the most common one I use is Furan II. I've also used trisulpha in combination with others, and, I have used erythromycin. Can't remember several others I've used over the years right now.
Just because they have survived with the other tankmates til now doesn't mean they were not having a negative effect on the seahorses.
Hopefully Dan U will see your post and give you the best advice on how to proceed.
I'd still try smaller food as they are still trying to eat so maybe a smaller piece will enable them to get some nutrition while they heal.

duraace9sp · 07/14/2015, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rayjay

Well you have started off well by doing the formalin dip as I believe Dan Underwood of seahorsesource.com recommends either a freshwater dip or a 30 to 60 minute formalin dip for parasites.
In any event, after treating for parasites I would think it will take a day or so for things to get better so they do eat.
Hopefully the tank they are in now won't have any tankmates to bother them, or stinging corals or unprotected intakes or unprotected heaters.
You could lower the temperature down to 68° to help prevent bacteria from becoming a problem if it isn't already. Probably about 2° a day would work.
Normal temperature recommendation would be to run between 68° and 74° because of their affinity to infections from bacteria.
I personally don't believe in using antibacteria agents (and only in a hospital tank) unless I know that they are needed or at least likely needed, but when I do, the most common one I use is Furan II. I've also used trisulpha in combination with others, and, I have used erythromycin. Can't remember several others I've used over the years right now.
Just because they have survived with the other tankmates til now doesn't mean they were not having a negative effect on the seahorses.
Hopefully Dan U will see your post and give you the best advice on how to proceed.
I'd still try smaller food as they are still trying to eat so maybe a smaller piece will enable them to get some nutrition while they heal.

We are running 74/75 degrees now - as all the measuring devices are not aligned it seems happiest here - we will lower another degree. Also will try smaller food. My intent is to dip again tomorrow - is it better to wait a couple days between dips. I don't recall where but I have heard Formalin is most effective with a follow-up dip next day then another in 2 days and so on for five or so dips. More important to us is of course the H Erectus health.....

Thanks again.....

rayjay · 07/14/2015, 01:29 PM

I don't have the experience needed to advise on the formalin treatment as I've only ever used it for treating seahorse fry and then only when I could find some here in Canada.
Here is one blurb on it. https://seahorse.com/faqs/seahorse-medicines/formalin

DanU · 07/14/2015, 03:47 PM

The question that comes into play is whether this is bacterial, parasitic or mechanical injury in nature. History would indicate that mechanical is not in question. If you give them a Freshwater dip it may help but also help as a diagnostic tool. If it is parasitic in nature, the seahorses should react to the FW dip. If they don't react, then I would look more at treating for a bacterial issue.
To do a FW dip you want RO or distilled water same temp as the tank in some type of container with an airline. Dip for at least 8 minutes. If they are clean they will just hang out and not react much to the dip. If they begin to thrash about or become agitated during the dip, then they likely have a parasitic load and the parasites are trying burrow deeper and get away from the freshwater. In this case, I continue the FW dip for at least 12 minutes but you can go as long as 15 minutes. This process is counter intuitive and most folks pull them at the first sign of distress but in reality, the process is just beginning to work. A FW water dip is the fastest remedy for weak snick cause by parasites.
Formalin is very good as an antiparasitic medication but should be done for 45 minutes as a dip at 1 ml/gal with 37%. I usually prefer the FW dip first and if not improved enough after 24 hours then follow with a formalin dip follow by a formalin long term bath at 1 ml/10 gal (37%) dosed every other day for 3 doses.
Offering a smaller food would be smart. Hikari mysis is generally smaller and is a decent quality product. Also live brine is easy to take in.

Dan

duraace9sp · 07/14/2015, 08:42 PM

Thanks......letting them recover tomorrow. Tonite they got hilarious spiraling rather than PE mysis. They didn't eat much, but ate a single piece each (1 ea male/female). Interesting is the female didn't do her usual "snap the food up" rather every so slowly drew the piece in, but for the first time in few days didn't spit it back out. Day after tomorrow I'll do another carful formalin dip. I'll watch and see if I'm wishing them to turn around vs really improving as it has only been 12 hours since dip........thx!

DanU · 07/14/2015, 09:30 PM

You can formalin dip them every day or every other day without issue. Of course, this is assuming it is not a forever thing. A formalin dip doesn't have as a dramatic reaction as a FW dip, thus from a diagnostic standpoint, it may be a bit harder to understand what is going on. Formalin does have some very mild antibacterial properties to it.

Dan

07/14/2015, 10:46 AM	#1
duraace9sp Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: California Posts: 61	Seahorse Unable to swallow their food - Help! My wife has a pair of mustangs that were purchased from Ocean Riders seven months ago, and they have been extremely healthy until now. They are in a 50 gallon tank with four damselfish, 2 cardinals and a dart fish. Within the past two days two of the damselfish developed red sores on their sides and white spots on their fins. Now both seahorses have appetites and are trying to eat their PE mysis shrimp, but when they snick food from their feeding tray, they are unable to swallow it. They suck up their food and try to swallow – you can see their neck appendage going up and down, they partially eject the mysis extending it mostly out and try to swallow again and again, but ultimately end up spitting it out after several tried to swallow the mysis. Nothing in their diet has changed; twice a day they get PE mysis shrimp enriched with Vibrance II. Today the seahorses were separated from all of their tank mates, given a 30 minute Formalin dip and moved into a 30 gallon established tank with lots of hitching posts and macro algae. They are still sucking food into their mouths, but cannot swallow it. Is this caused by a parasite or infection from the damselfish? What can I do to get my beloved seahorses healthy?

07/14/2015, 11:23 AM	#2
rayjay Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 3,969	I would say it's a combination of two things. Parasites that are always present but tend to become problematic with stress of the seahorse. The stress comes from the tankmates whether or not you may believe it. Seahorses do best when in a species only tank, but at the least, with tankmates that get the best ratings on the Tankmates Guide where 0 is best and 4 is worst. Here in Canada Formalin is almost impossible to get so I rely on freshwater dips to see if there are parasites present. I dip in freshwater that has no chlorine or chloramines present, matching pH and temperature best I can. If parasites are present, you will most likely see a heavy thrashing about of the seahorses as parasites explode from the fresh water. Unless a seahorse becomes completely unresponsive to the touch, I leave them in for 12 minutes. If there is no thrashing, then cause is probably other than parasites and could be an internal bacteria problem or an internal chemical imbalance causing some organ failure. Description you give though leaves more to the parasite being the problem. You may have introduced more types of parasites than the seahorse had to start with by having fish from other breeding sources. Short term I would also try feeding a smaller food like adult brine or mid sized brine shrimp to see if they can get those down. I'd be prepared for hospital tank situation in case a parasitic problem gets infected and needs antibiotic treatment as well. __________________ Seahorses. Culture nanno, rotifers and brine shrimp. Current Tank Info: Seahorses

07/14/2015, 01:02 PM	#4
rayjay Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 3,969	Well you have started off well by doing the formalin dip as I believe Dan Underwood of seahorsesource.com recommends either a freshwater dip or a 30 to 60 minute formalin dip for parasites. In any event, after treating for parasites I would think it will take a day or so for things to get better so they do eat. Hopefully the tank they are in now won't have any tankmates to bother them, or stinging corals or unprotected intakes or unprotected heaters. You could lower the temperature down to 68° to help prevent bacteria from becoming a problem if it isn't already. Probably about 2° a day would work. Normal temperature recommendation would be to run between 68° and 74° because of their affinity to infections from bacteria. I personally don't believe in using antibacteria agents (and only in a hospital tank) unless I know that they are needed or at least likely needed, but when I do, the most common one I use is Furan II. I've also used trisulpha in combination with others, and, I have used erythromycin. Can't remember several others I've used over the years right now. Just because they have survived with the other tankmates til now doesn't mean they were not having a negative effect on the seahorses. Hopefully Dan U will see your post and give you the best advice on how to proceed. I'd still try smaller food as they are still trying to eat so maybe a smaller piece will enable them to get some nutrition while they heal. __________________ Seahorses. Culture nanno, rotifers and brine shrimp. Current Tank Info: Seahorses

07/14/2015, 01:29 PM	#6
rayjay Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 3,969	I don't have the experience needed to advise on the formalin treatment as I've only ever used it for treating seahorse fry and then only when I could find some here in Canada. Here is one blurb on it. https://seahorse.com/faqs/seahorse-medicines/formalin __________________ Seahorses. Culture nanno, rotifers and brine shrimp. Current Tank Info: Seahorses

07/14/2015, 03:47 PM	#7
DanU Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Ft. Pierce, FL Posts: 698	The question that comes into play is whether this is bacterial, parasitic or mechanical injury in nature. History would indicate that mechanical is not in question. If you give them a Freshwater dip it may help but also help as a diagnostic tool. If it is parasitic in nature, the seahorses should react to the FW dip. If they don't react, then I would look more at treating for a bacterial issue. To do a FW dip you want RO or distilled water same temp as the tank in some type of container with an airline. Dip for at least 8 minutes. If they are clean they will just hang out and not react much to the dip. If they begin to thrash about or become agitated during the dip, then they likely have a parasitic load and the parasites are trying burrow deeper and get away from the freshwater. In this case, I continue the FW dip for at least 12 minutes but you can go as long as 15 minutes. This process is counter intuitive and most folks pull them at the first sign of distress but in reality, the process is just beginning to work. A FW water dip is the fastest remedy for weak snick cause by parasites. Formalin is very good as an antiparasitic medication but should be done for 45 minutes as a dip at 1 ml/gal with 37%. I usually prefer the FW dip first and if not improved enough after 24 hours then follow with a formalin dip follow by a formalin long term bath at 1 ml/10 gal (37%) dosed every other day for 3 doses. Offering a smaller food would be smart. Hikari mysis is generally smaller and is a decent quality product. Also live brine is easy to take in. Dan

07/14/2015, 08:42 PM	#8
duraace9sp Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: California Posts: 61	Thanks......letting them recover tomorrow. Tonite they got hilarious spiraling rather than PE mysis. They didn't eat much, but ate a single piece each (1 ea male/female). Interesting is the female didn't do her usual "snap the food up" rather every so slowly drew the piece in, but for the first time in few days didn't spit it back out. Day after tomorrow I'll do another carful formalin dip. I'll watch and see if I'm wishing them to turn around vs really improving as it has only been 12 hours since dip........thx!

07/14/2015, 09:30 PM	#9
DanU Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Ft. Pierce, FL Posts: 698	You can formalin dip them every day or every other day without issue. Of course, this is assuming it is not a forever thing. A formalin dip doesn't have as a dramatic reaction as a FW dip, thus from a diagnostic standpoint, it may be a bit harder to understand what is going on. Formalin does have some very mild antibacterial properties to it. Dan