How much Po4 is too much?

[brians_224]

Hi -

A fellow reef club member has an electronic po4 tester made by Hanna. He tested a sample of my tank warer, it measureed .12 MG/L. Does a po4 of this level cause nuisance algae?

I tested with salifert and it measures 0?

Thanks

[Holyreefer]

Was his device calibrated?
The tank can also get nuisance algae by water, if your not using RO water, if your not performing water changes nuisance algae could come

But heres a great thread i was just reading today about phostphates

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=606552

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Not only can it contribute to algae, but that level will make it harder for hard corals to deposit their skeletons. I'd aim for 0.03 ppm or less.

This article has more:

Phosphorus: Algae’s Best Friend
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...t2002/chem.htm

[brians_224]

Thanks for your posts.

Randy -
How do I convert .12 MG/L to ppm?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

ppm is about the same as mg/L

[brians_224]

yikes.

I have a refugium with chaeto lit 24X7. I top off with kalk. I'm considering a new skimmer vs my DIY EAP. Should I consider chemical means? I have a kent product for phosphate absorption, but I don't like the way it works - it makes the water a bit clowdy and leaves a white milky sort of film on stuff. I've rinsed and rinsed and rinsed - same results.

I have a light case of brownish hair algae.

I reaquascaped my tank last weekend and scrubbed my LR in the process to try to remove.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

How big is the refugium? How much Chaeto in it? Is it growing rapidly? Ever add any iron to boost it?

[brians_224]

My refugium is about 10 gallons. I supply it with a mj 600 pumping about 10 inches high - I'd say medium flow/ I pruned two days ago - it seems like the growth has slowed a bit recently and its seems less green than it once was. I removed a bunch - the maco area is probably 16 x 9 x 6. It was pretty dense. I thought removing some might encourage growth?

Iron? Got a link for that too?

As always - thanks for your help!

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

How is it lit? I'd let the macro pack up until it is quite dense. I grow both Chaeto and Caulerpa racemosa.

Here are some iron articles:

First Iron Article: Macroalgae and Dosing Recommendations
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/aug2002/chem.htm

Second Iron Article: Iron: A Look at Organisms Other than Macroalgae
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/oct2002/chem.htm

Since those came out, I've seen Seachem's ferrous gluconate supplement that might be a good one to use.

[brians_224]

I use one of the lights recommended my melev - 6700k spiral shaped regular socket bulb - in a HD alluminum reflector. I haven't read your links yet - any of them recommend a low cost grocery store type solution?

Its winter here in WI - I have a basement sump, tank is a bit cooler than I'd like - 77-78 degrees. Could this be a contributor to poor macro growth - there for phosphurous?

I started to notice this hair algae problem early fall when I started to keep my first SPS frags. This coincides with a cooler tank temp(77-78) previous 81-82 and i started topping off with kalk - mrs wages. I've always used RO/DI tds of 0.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Here's a link on my lighting experiences:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...hreadid=216369

I don't have any grocery store iron recommendations, but do have a recipe in the first one if you can buy chemicals.

[brians_224]

Thanks.
I'll change bulbs this weekend.

Any thoughts on the lower temps?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't know. I hypothesize in my discussion above that perhaps elevated temp is why my incandescents seemed to work better.

[brians_224]

One last question then I'll leave you alone.

Are you still using the same (as in manuf and specs) bulb as described in your post - Phillips 75 w par 30 halogen spot?

I lied...two questions-
How quiclky can I reduce to .03 or better?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have 4 different refugia now. One is lit by two bulbs of the same or similar type to those. One is lit by a 175 w, 4300 k mh bulb, and 2 are together lit by 8 fluorescent tubes that are, IIRC, 34 w 3000k, 4 foot tubes.

Caulerpa grows best in the mh refugium.

Chaeto and aulerpa grow similarly under those fluorescents.

Under the incandescents, Chaeto grows best. It's hard to compare overall since they are different size tanks and watts of light, but all seem to work well.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You can drop the phosphate to low levels rapidly with GFO (an iron based binder), but I prefer macroalgae if you can get there that way.

Iron Oxide Hydroxide (GFO) Phosphate Binders
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-11/rhf/index.htm

[MichaelKim]

Randy, I have chaeto growing in a sump but it gets hair algae, red and green, growing on it. Do you ever experience this? I am using 2x65w PC lights for the lighting.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy, I have chaeto growing in a sump but it gets hair algae, red and green, growing on it. Do you ever experience this?

Yes. Adding iron can reduce that, IME. Someone suggested that to me years ago, and it worked, and no green hair algae ever came back to the refugium (cyano sometimes, however, in low flow areas).

[MichaelKim]

Thanks, I'll try that.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You're welcome.

Good luck.

[Cody Ray]

I'm by no means an expert, however from what I have read, macro algae is very poor at using phosphate. Algae use phosphate to bond and store the sugar produced though photosythesis. So, if you want to increase the amount of phosphate your macro algae absorbs, increase the amount of sugar needed to be stored. To do this, just increase the amount of light they are recieving. Algae use par in the specturms of red and yellow. However, I believe that if that sugar needs to be used, it may release the phosphate back into the water (I'm not too sure if that is true though, I may be wrong).

I would use a bag of mud substrate to absorb phosphates from the water. This will also add Iron to the water to aid in the growth of your macro algae. Macro algae uses nitrates very well though

[Cody Ray]

And by a bag od mud substrate, I am refering to putting the mud in a nylon bag in the refugium.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm by no means an expert, however from what I have read, macro algae is very poor at using phosphate.

I'm not sure what you mean, but it is a perfectly adequate means of keeping nitrate and phosphate low in reef aquaria. It is the primary export means that I use,and phosphate is undetectable with a Hach kit (less than about 0.03 ppm). I do agree that the brighter the light, the faster it will grow, as long as other factors like iron are not limiting, and that increased growth will necessitate more phosphate and nitrogen.

I've not heard of folks putting mud in a bag to bind phosphate. Do you do that yourself?

[brians_224]

Hi Randy -

I just found a Phillips 75 w par30l halogen spot. I replaced my current complact flourescent with this bulb. Does yours burn REALLY yellow?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I think it is pretty yellow, yes. Like other incandescents. The warmer lights seem to do well for macroalgae.