Algae Scrubber Advanced

[sea of cortez]

I have a 125 mixed reef with a 30 gal fuge.

I am getting ready to bulid a vertical A/S to fight my cyno problem.

I have skimmed through this thread and think I have the general concept. The one question I have is what size PVC are you guys using. I am sure it says this somewhere but. I didnt see where anyone stated this. I am quessing it 1" or 3/4".

[JohnnyB in SD]

I've always used 1" diameter PVC.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by sea of cortez

I have a 125 mixed reef with a 30 gal fuge.

I am getting ready to bulid a vertical A/S to fight my cyno problem.

I have skimmed through this thread and think I have the general concept. The one question I have is what size PVC are you guys using. I am sure it says this somewhere but. I didnt see where anyone stated this. I am quessing it 1" or 3/4".

I use 1", but it's best to match what is already being used to plumb the tank.

[yellowRubi]

Originally Posted by sea of cortez

I have a 125 mixed reef with a 30 gal fuge.

I am getting ready to bulid a vertical A/S to fight my cyno problem.

I have skimmed through this thread and think I have the general concept. The one question I have is what size PVC are you guys using. I am sure it says this somewhere but. I didnt see where anyone stated this. I am quessing it 1" or 3/4".

If you gonna use separate pump to feed the scrubber try to use the same size of pvc that would work with the pump, I used a QuietOne pump and it took 1/2" pvc so thats what i used for my build
If u will feed it off the return than use whatever u used for the return piping

[sea of cortez]

I didnt think that 1/2" was going to be big enough for the screen.

I have a butt load of 1/2" and 3/4" fittings. I was thinking I had to bush up to 1" for the screen or use 3/4 at the very least.

I plan on feeding it with the power head I am useing to feed my DIY Bio pellet reactor it is plumbed with 1/2".

[srusso]

Originally Posted by sea of cortez

I didnt think that 1/2" was going to be big enough for the screen.

I have a butt load of 1/2" and 3/4" fittings. I was thinking I had to bush up to 1" for the screen or use 3/4 at the very least.

I plan on feeding it with the power head I am useing to feed my DIY Bio pellet reactor it is plumbed with 1/2".

3/4" will be fine

[Floyd R Turbo]

1/2" will work too. It's about flow rate though, so if the pipe slot is too long you won't be able to push that much water through a 1/2" pipe, so you're limited as to the length of screen you can use and pump head loss will be greater with 1/2" also. I would use 3/4" if you're over 4 or 5" slot, IMO

[srusso]

I am researching the 4 halogens of salt water. I have a theory that slimy growth over healthy green growth maybe due to a limitation on one or more of the 4 oxidizers and adding more light could make things worse, as was previously believed we could "power" through the slime with more light. And that if one could correct the balance, the slimy growth would go away. Even been thinking of dosing small amounts of tap which is known to have bromine, fluoride etc. All just theory and I still have a lot more to learn...

"Craig Bingman - The Halogens"

Synthetic brominated compounds have been shown to inhibit the growth of unicellular algae (Walsh et al. 1987), so it is tempting to suggest that some of the brominated compounds made by algae are to either deter predators or to help the algae win battles for space against other algae.

[gregphoenix]

good stuff!!!! anybody know any links to more information on the "bucket method" or "angle scrubbers" just curios to learn more. many thanks to all.

[reeftanknewbie]

table saw worked best for me. Make sure to not make the slot longer then needed for the mesh. 3/4" piping is what I have and it's working great.

[Pny]

Anybody measured the PO4-levels of the water flowing in and out of an algae scrubber to determine how much PO4 it removes in reality? I recently did this using a Hanna low range P photometer on a recirculating bio pellets reactor and its quite interesting to know!

[crn005]

For the scrubbers where you're building a compartment, or isolated chamber out of acrylic, are you guys using standard plexi-glass from Home Depot for the clear sections or are you using a sturdier acrylic? I plan on making a unit similar to Floyd's that uses the t5s but with LEDs and it will be hanging on the lip of the sump.

[Jstdv8]

bump, i'd like to know about the plexi as well.

[JohnnyB in SD]

I get my acrylic from the scrape bin at local plastics supplier for $2/pound. I use 1/4" thick minimum for water containment applications. Sometimes they don't have exactly what you're looking for so you could just order it, but I never have.
Not sure how well that HD stuff glues, I think it's intended for windows.
Alaska and Korea, you guys may not have too many options.

[Jstdv8]

ive got a plasic guy right down the road from me, but his bin out front is always full of white plastic cutting board type stuff. i probably need to hit it more often to get what I want

[JohnnyB in SD]

Cutting board material is typically food grade HDPE. Sounds like it would be good, but I believe that in reality it does not glue at all. Plastic guy should be able to steer you towards what you need, maybe even alert you when scraps become available.

[crn005]

Oh I'll be back in the states for this build. When you guys say "local plastic supplier," is this like a retail or commercial type place? I don't think I've ever seen one of those around my home.

[crazzyreefer]

I read through most if not all of the thread (s) but I didn't find the information needed, sorry if I missed it. What I was looking for, I know someone looked at lighting with a par meter, but My question is what if any difference is it when the light is behind a filter, ie,,, (glass or plastic splash guard), I know it blocks out some UV spectrum, but isn't that the light you want for the growth? so having a shield changes the spectrum doses it not? And limits growth.

I have used ATS for years, early 80's and I had no problems, of course there has been refinements, and I'm building another one, and will be using either Pilkington Activ™ or PPG Sun Clean, for the splash screen, with an auto screen/mesh cleaner . Was there a problem with too much water flow? I will be pumping about 16-20 gal a minute about 1000 gph over a 20" screen with. From a high pressurized water pump over the screens, was there a point where the flow stopped the growth? you are requiring max 700 gal for 20" screen

Tank is 1000 gal cube 800-1000 lbs live rock, bare bottom, (2) 400w DE 20k lights (I think or they are 16k)
Skimmer is custom self cleaning wet neck 12" Diameter x 336" Height (28') Compressor air driven, Auto cleans once a week.

The ATS will be auto cleaning once a week, and will be fed water that exits directly from the skimmer and the chiller. The ATS will be housed on top of a 40 gal dump tank , It dumps every 1.3-1.5 min 30 gal of clean water (hopefully with pods)

Reason for ATS= Pods and lower Phosphate while increasing PH, The skimmer is 87% efficient and is used for removal of all organics and metals. I know the ATF will be in competition with the skimmer, but it will still produce some algae, just not a lot. Will adjust the self cleaning cycle to coincide with the algae build up. Budget = Wife's tank no budget needed

[Crazy_Beaver]

Originally Posted by crazzyreefer

I read through most if not all of the thread (s) but I didn't find the information needed, sorry if I missed it. What I was looking for, I know someone looked at lighting with a par meter, but My question is what if any difference is it when the light is behind a filter, ie,,, (glass or plastic splash guard), I know it blocks out some UV spectrum, but isn't that the light you want for the growth? so having a shield changes the spectrum doses it not? And limits growth.

I have used ATS for years, early 80's and I had no problems, of course there has been refinements, and I'm building another one, and will be using either Pilkington Activ™ or PPG Sun Clean, for the splash screen, with an auto screen/mesh cleaner . Was there a problem with too much water flow? I will be pumping about 16-20 gal a minute about 1000 gph over a 20" screen with. From a high pressurized water pump over the screens, was there a point where the flow stopped the growth? you are requiring max 700 gal for 20" screen

Tank is 1000 gal cube 800-1000 lbs live rock, bare bottom, (2) 400w DE 20k lights (I think or they are 16k)
Skimmer is custom self cleaning wet neck 12" Diameter x 336" Height (28') Compressor air driven, Auto cleans once a week.

The ATS will be auto cleaning once a week, and will be fed water that exits directly from the skimmer and the chiller. The ATS will be housed on top of a 40 gal dump tank , It dumps every 1.3-1.5 min 30 gal of clean water (hopefully with pods)

Reason for ATS= Pods and lower Phosphate while increasing PH, The skimmer is 87% efficient and is used for removal of all organics and metals. I know the ATF will be in competition with the skimmer, but it will still produce some algae, just not a lot. Will adjust the self cleaning cycle to coincide with the algae build up. Budget = Wife's tank no budget needed

Do you have a build thread for your tank!I d love to follow it!

[inky]

Originally Posted by crazzyreefer

I read through most if not all of the thread (s) but I didn't find the information needed, sorry if I missed it. What I was looking for, I know someone looked at lighting with a par meter, but My question is what if any difference is it when the light is behind a filter, ie,,, (glass or plastic splash guard), I know it blocks out some UV spectrum, but isn't that the light you want for the growth? so having a shield changes the spectrum doses it not? And limits growth.

It might well filter out some UV, not sure on that, but if we have bright enough light, then some of the UV will get through.....

Originally Posted by crazzyreefer

I have used ATS for years, early 80's and I had no problems, of course there has been refinements, and I'm building another one, and will be using either Pilkington Activ™ or PPG Sun Clean, for the splash screen, with an auto screen/mesh cleaner . Was there a problem with too much water flow? I will be pumping about 16-20 gal a minute about 1000 gph over a 20" screen with. From a high pressurized water pump over the screens, was there a point where the flow stopped the growth? you are requiring max 700 gal for 20" screen

I think you need a wider slot for the greater flow rate. Just experiment to get even flow.

Originally Posted by crazzyreefer

The ATS will be auto cleaning once a week, and will be fed water that exits directly from the skimmer and the chiller. The ATS will be housed on top of a 40 gal dump tank , It dumps every 1.3-1.5 min 30 gal of clean water (hopefully with pods)

I thought algae grew better and quicker with warmer water, so by feeding the ATS from the chiller, you might stunt growth. BUT, I'm not 100% sure on that. I've put my heater in the first section of the sump, where the scrubber is based.

[crazzyreefer]

Sorry I don't have a build thread, The tank and skimmer is built and we are rebuilding/re-plumbing it after our flood, (not the tank) it should be operational in a month. I never factored in the chiller having any affect on the ATS, There isn't much else I can do without adding another high pressure pump. I originally thought to light up the ATS with a solar tube since we are at roof level, but I know it will need supplemental lighting during the night, and I cant see that there is room for both, has anyone tried both?

[_shorty_]

Originally Posted by crazzyreefer

Sorry I don't have a build thread, The tank and skimmer is built and we are rebuilding/re-plumbing it after our flood, (not the tank) it should be operational in a month. I never factored in the chiller having any affect on the ATS, There isn't much else I can do without adding another high pressure pump. I originally thought to light up the ATS with a solar tube since we are at roof level, but I know it will need supplemental lighting during the night, and I cant see that there is room for both, has anyone tried both?

Anyone ever seen anyone back up a tank to a window? LOL - uncontrollable algae in what I've seen. However - they probably weren't the most experienced - and I wasn't either at the time (11yrs ago) - but thinking back, I was recently wondering how well a solar powered scrubber might work. Probably have good growth - but you'd end up losing the bennifet of the alternating light cycles and pH swing.

No suggestion for chiller.. I have read that temperature can affect growth (probably from one of these threads), but my suspicion it will still work - but is just not 'optimal'. that's a guess, though. Haven't had to run a chiller yet - currently been able to get by with using fans and my scrubber for water cooling with my 250W halides so far. It's still early stages for this tank though - so I don't know if that will change or not.

As per your other question about flow - I was playing with a similar scenario - where return pump fed above tank scrubber. I had about 1000 GPH split to two 10" or 12" screens. It was loud and I believe did knock algae off the screen although I believe it still would have worked. I believe there would have been considerable salt creep in the container if I'd have left it. I did plumb in an exit from the pipe elbowed down from each pipe to quietly drop the extra flow below water level. I think I reduced pipe diameter and added a valve to each so that I could adjust how much flow was going over the scrubber without losing my over-all flow through the system.

How does your dump bucket work? What method/plumbing for emptying the water into the DT? Does it introduce bubbles? I've been playing with that just recently and was about to try a gravity feed solinoid valve and float switch, but don't know how loud that solinoid is going to be. Seems that most other dump methods introduce a lot of air bubbles (that I've played with).

[JohnnyB in SD]

I've got my 20gl QT in a south window, essentially one big ATS tank. Very low cost to operate. Only uses a small HOB filter and heater, couple CFLs in the early evening hours just so there's enough light to feed the critters. Occasionally siphon out accumulated detritus. Isn't exactly the appearance you'd want for a DT, but water quality is no problem.

[crazzyreefer]

I use (3) +GF+ Georg Fischer 24v 1 1/4 Valves fed by a 3" line, for the dump tank alone, the dump tank is 10' higher then the tank, this has the effect to pressurize the water, like placer mining, and if they are shut off prior to emptying the tank no air bubbles are formed. Just the sound of a breaking surf as it reaches the overflow. They each are on duel adjustable timers controls, and one controller resets all of them to keep them in sync. I program them to alternate for about 1 min then off, I tried every other type of control, and only this worked, I also went to 3" feed tube/bulkhead from a 2" because of the amount of suction created a toilet bowl effect in the dump tank.

At the Makers Fair a engineer gave me the Idea to use a Arduino board and a pizo electric weight measurement under the Dump tank so when the tank was full it would open the valve and when it was almost empty it would close it.

I prefer to use industrial automation equipment, as its 100% duty cycle. It was simple, and cheap, but I might try an Arduino set up in the future.

Yes the solar tube would work but I need the PH to stabilize, this was one of the best attributes of a ATS that I noticed from the past. and to do this I would have to automate a lighting change, or I might be able to use LED in the Solar tube?

I am looking into a Oriental Electric motor, Waterproof, and gear it to rotate the netting over high pressure clean water jets for self cleaning, at the present I have the skimmer plumbed into the house drains, so If I set it up it would rotate the mesh through a separate chamber that has the jets and a drain once a week. Additionally I could also place an optical sensor to know when to turn on the cleaning cycle. Continually running the mesh would give me 3X the surface area, and only the cleaning jets would be on a timer.

[xtinataguba]

this is a good stuff! im glad i read this, but anybody knows angle scrubbers?