Reeflo/Sequence Skimmer Club

[yaktop]

Originally posted by tgreene
Reeflo has refused to warranty their products!

I need to start by stating that I have an Orca-250 and an Orca-200 for a client, and was getting ready to buy another Orca-200 for a new client...

About 2 1/2 weeks ago, I contacted Chris at Reeflo in regards to the air-silencers which have quite literally disintegrated due to the use of Ozone (I had been told the acrylic was O3 friendly) connected as per the method that Mike used and posted here about.



After hearing absolutely nothing back from Chris since our initial conversation, I called again this past Friday and he returned my call later in the day, stating that it was not his problem, since Reeflo isn't actually the manufacturer, and that I needed to speak w/ the company that actually built the skimmers. WTH???

I have a call into this other company, but have yet to get any type of response back from them. Also, I thought that it was quite odd that Chris stated that he had already talked to the other company, and that he was told that the other person had stated that we had already "gone round and round" on this issue and had "agreed to disagree"... Again, I say WTH??? because I have not once spoken w/ this other person in regards to this issue, NOT ONCE! I also have nothing but high regards for the other person, so if what Chris is saying actually has some element of merit to it, then I absolutely believe that I am somehow being confused with somebody else!

The bottom line is this: The box that the products came in are very clearly labeled REEFLO, as is all of the paperwork included with the skimmers. Absolutely nowhere is their any indication that another US company should be responsible for warranty issue, and in fact the paperwork (I keep everything in 3-ring binders) very clearly states that all warranty issues are handled directly by Reeflo, and not dealers or distributors.

Chris was also very quick to point out that since I had purchased these through a distributor, that he didn't really make any money off of them, so again it's not his problem... Again, WTH???

If you are afraid of making less money, then you need to discontinue the use of dealers and distributors, and opt to handle everything internally. Of coarse, as we all know, that too comes at a price, because it is your dealers and distributors that have the marketing, distribution and STAFF in place to be able to handle these things so YOU don't have to.

All that I have asked for is a pair of replacement Air-Silencers (one for each skimmer), because everything else is running flawlessly.. I did get told by a girl at Reeflo that their pumps are not capable of handling O3, and that it's an extremely expensive upgrade to put new seals in, to which Chris actually correctly stated the exact opposite, stating that the seals are very inexpensive and quite simple to install (which we all know to be true).

Anyway, I'm quite infuriated with the responses and actions of a company whose products I use on a very regular basis for both my own and my clients' systems.

I'll also state that this is NOT the first issue w/ Chris. Back in January I was installing a very large system for the client that has the Orca-200, and the Hammerhead pump sounded like it was going to explode due to "grinding" and even occasionally seizing up. I called Chris and he assured me that a new replacement pump would be sent right out, but also that these sometimes do that due to grit in the grease or something to that effect (I've never had any other pumps do that!). I assured my very concerned clients that a new pump was on the way, but after a week of receiving nothing, I began to get a bit concerned so I called Chris back. He told me that he said the problem should resolve itself after it ran for a bit, which it eventually did after several days, and so since he never heard anything back, he decided not to ship out a new pump. He didn't hear anything, because I was WAITING for a new pump to arrive, which he had very clearly said he was going to ship, and even took down my clients' address to ship it directly to them.


All that said, I have a VERY large system (just under $20k) that I will begin ordering the necessary parts for over the next couple of weeks, and unless something quickly changes on their end, I will be forced to re-write the proposal to a different set of pumps and skimmers from a more honorable and reputable manufacturer.

-Tim

this is interesting. I am also running ozone but how much are you running? I've had it setup from the second wave of orders and the silencer is clear not like yours which is cloudy. Are you able to order them?

[tgreene]

I use Enaly O3 rectors that are controlled via Lighthouse Controllers, set to 400 ORP... They are off far more than they are on, but that shouldn't matter anyway, because I also have one running on a Coralife CSS-220 skimmer for 3 years without a single hiccup!

If a $200 skimmer can handle it, then $1000 - $1500 skimmers damn well ought to be able to as well!

The acrylic was crystal clear originally.

[RokleM]

That's interesting to hear. I had a new dart gold that had issues running at a higher wattage than should be expected (and in turn hotter). He had a new pump at my door pretty quickly without asking for a payment and allowed me to keep the old one online until the new one arrived. I'm very happy with the service supplied. I haven't had any issues with the skimmer however that I've needed to inquire about.

[kingsland]

Originally posted by jmckdvm
The top of my T is about level with the midpoint of the beveled section. I just set it up last night.

[/B]

I love this skimmer, but the instructions are lousy (or I'm a bad plumber and didn't read carefully). It sounds like you assembled it the same way I did, although I hate to admit it. I glued the long pipe to the union fitting on one end and the tee on the other. This made the assembly too tall. The long pipe should have been glued to the tee so that it was in a horizontal position coming out of the tee and the short pipe to the union and bottom of the tee.

I fixed the problem by measuring the distance of the short pipe including the distance that would have been inserted into the tee and the union on the other end. I cut the pipe that I had installed at the same distance of the shorter pipe (measured from the union). The tee was flipped over so that the end that would normally take the wedge pipe is now glued to the shorter cut pipe. You must mark this distance, as the tee has been ground out to accept the wedge pipe gasket and when the glued pipe is inserted into the ground out tee, it will slip too far into the tee if it is not marked. I had planned to use a gate valve instead of the wedge pipe and this little error sent me there a bit faster. I have not purchased the gate valve yet, but glued the horizontal pipe where the end is ground to fit 2" US to a union. The union is glued to a ball valve that is working very well to adjust the water level for almost three months now.

I searched the web for metric fittings to rebuild the assembly. It would have required placing orders with two or more businesses or getting replacements from the factory.

[JRaquatics]

Originally posted by tgreene
Reeflo has refused to warranty their products!

I need to start by stating that I have an Orca-250 and an Orca-200 for a client, and was getting ready to buy another Orca-200 for a new client...

About 2 1/2 weeks ago, I contacted Chris at Reeflo in regards to the air-silencers which have quite literally disintegrated due to the use of Ozone (I had been told the acrylic was O3 friendly) connected as per the method that Mike used and posted here about.



After hearing absolutely nothing back from Chris since our initial conversation, I called again this past Friday and he returned my call later in the day, stating that it was not his problem, since Reeflo isn't actually the manufacturer, and that I needed to speak w/ the company that actually built the skimmers. WTH???

I have a call into this other company, but have yet to get any type of response back from them. Also, I thought that it was quite odd that Chris stated that he had already talked to the other company, and that he was told that the other person had stated that we had already "gone round and round" on this issue and had "agreed to disagree"... Again, I say WTH??? because I have not once spoken w/ this other person in regards to this issue, NOT ONCE! I also have nothing but high regards for the other person, so if what Chris is saying actually has some element of merit to it, then I absolutely believe that I am somehow being confused with somebody else!

The bottom line is this: The box that the products came in are very clearly labeled REEFLO, as is all of the paperwork included with the skimmers. Absolutely nowhere is their any indication that another US company should be responsible for warranty issue, and in fact the paperwork (I keep everything in 3-ring binders) very clearly states that all warranty issues are handled directly by Reeflo, and not dealers or distributors.

Chris was also very quick to point out that since I had purchased these through a distributor, that he didn't really make any money off of them, so again it's not his problem... Again, WTH???

If you are afraid of making less money, then you need to discontinue the use of dealers and distributors, and opt to handle everything internally. Of coarse, as we all know, that too comes at a price, because it is your dealers and distributors that have the marketing, distribution and STAFF in place to be able to handle these things so YOU don't have to.

All that I have asked for is a pair of replacement Air-Silencers (one for each skimmer), because everything else is running flawlessly.. I did get told by a girl at Reeflo that their pumps are not capable of handling O3, and that it's an extremely expensive upgrade to put new seals in, to which Chris actually correctly stated the exact opposite, stating that the seals are very inexpensive and quite simple to install (which we all know to be true).

Anyway, I'm quite infuriated with the responses and actions of a company whose products I use on a very regular basis for both my own and my clients' systems.

I'll also state that this is NOT the first issue w/ Chris. Back in January I was installing a very large system for the client that has the Orca-200, and the Hammerhead pump sounded like it was going to explode due to "grinding" and even occasionally seizing up. I called Chris and he assured me that a new replacement pump would be sent right out, but also that these sometimes do that due to grit in the grease or something to that effect (I've never had any other pumps do that!). I assured my very concerned clients that a new pump was on the way, but after a week of receiving nothing, I began to get a bit concerned so I called Chris back. He told me that he said the problem should resolve itself after it ran for a bit, which it eventually did after several days, and so since he never heard anything back, he decided not to ship out a new pump. He didn't hear anything, because I was WAITING for a new pump to arrive, which he had very clearly said he was going to ship, and even took down my clients' address to ship it directly to them.


All that said, I have a VERY large system (just under $20k) that I will begin ordering the necessary parts for over the next couple of weeks, and unless something quickly changes on their end, I will be forced to re-write the proposal to a different set of pumps and skimmers from a more honorable and reputable manufacturer.

-Tim

I wanted to start off, I am not calling you or anyone else a lier.

There is only one way that acrylic can deteriorate is when it comes in contact with a high V.O.C. (viscosity) liquid or fumes. High viscosity chemicals are found in most household paints, cleaning agents and lacquers. You can open a can of denatured alcohol and put acrylic close to the fumes coming out of the can and you can watch the acrylic start to craze and break down. Ozone will not cause acrylic to do this. Even the acrylic material that I have seen that crazes will still hold up and not fall apart unless it was dropped or something hard hit it, then again if the acrylic is in perfect condition it could break easily from a fall which is a more likely situation than from the effects of ozone.

With that being said it is just strange that acrylic which is highly resistant to ozone could have that effect on the silenser. Mike from Reef Specialty had the very first Reeflo 250 and uses 300-400 mg/ph to this day and his is in perfect condition. Mine the same, no hazing discoloration or weeknesses. It is just hard to comprehend that with all the Octopus, Euro Reef, Aqua Euro USA, and other private label skimmers that are on the market have not had this problem with ozone use. Are you certain that there weren't any VOCs used in the area or dropped or mishandled by your client?

I also have nothing but good things to say about Reeflos customer service and the way they handle things. Responses to questions and concerns were always prompt and handled with the utmost perfessionalism.

[tgreene]

Originally posted by JRaquatics
I wanted to start off, I am not calling you or anyone else a lier.

There is only one way that acrylic can deteriorate is when it comes in contact with a high V.O.C. (viscosity) liquid or fumes. High viscosity chemicals are found in most household paints, cleaning agents and lacquers. You can open a can of denatured alcohol and put acrylic close to the fumes coming out of the can and you can watch the acrylic start to craze and break down. Ozone will not cause acrylic to do this.

Are you certain that there weren't any VOCs used in the area or dropped or mishandled by your client?

My 250 sits less than 3 feet away from an Octopus FDNW-400 that is just now a year old, and 8 feet from those sits an Octopus DNW-200 skimmer, again, without even the slightest hint of a scratch.

Both systems are surrounded by numerous other acrylic reactors which if chemicals were to blame, would also be in shambles, but it's not the case! It is also only the air silencers that have shown any distress.

-Tim

[tgreene]

The following is a quote that Chris made in regards to the guy building the Mako skimmers...

Originally posted by reeflo/sequence
We made the mistake of selling some of our Dart Needlewheel pumps before we came out with the ORCA skimmers. We no longer do this. While I cannot comment on the MAKO, i can tell you that having inventiry to fill orders, psare parts to handle accidents and prompt customer service to answer questions and treat you like family is more important that thick walls on the skimmer body.
Thank you for the tech comments, we will see what can be done to improve them...the 200's are now available at Premium Aquatics

This quote is towards the bottom of page 2, which is where I have a series of pics of my setup which clearly shows the Orca-250 and FDNW-400 skimmers.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...t=mako+skimmer

[SouthernK]

After the money you spent on these expensive a$$ skimmers you think they would be willing to help you out with a replacement part.
I guess since they DON'T want to stand behind their product I would definitely do as you said here......

All that said, I have a VERY large system (just under $20k) that I will begin ordering the necessary parts for over the next couple of weeks, and unless something quickly changes on their end, I will be forced to re-write the proposal to a different set of pumps and skimmers from a more honorable and reputable manufacturer.

I bet if you bought a Volcano and had issues they would be rectified!

[tgreene]

Just so everyone is aware; the "other company" just contacted me and is taking care of what I consider to be Chris' problems, immediately.

I have always had great faith and respect for this other company, and hope to always be able to continue to do business with them!

-Tim

[reeflopumps]

please base you conclusions about our company and its service from your own experience and from people that you KNOW..do not take the word of someone who is a professional shakedown artist. If you or anyone that you know has had a problem that we have not resolved, please let me know. We have sent out parts the harrassment is endless.

[tgreene]

Originally posted by reeflopumps
please base you conclusions about our company and its service from your own experience and from people that you KNOW..do not take the word of someone who is a professional shakedown artist. If you or anyone that you know has had a problem that we have not resolved, please let me know. We have sent out parts the harrassment is endless.

So now you're calling me a PROFESSIONAL SHAKEDOWN ARTIST ... Are you F'n kidding me..?

I was first notified via email at 11:17am central time this morning that parts were being shipped out, and I immediately posted as such here...

-Tim

[tgreene]

Originally posted by reeflopumps
please base you conclusions about our company and its service from your own experience and from people that you KNOW..do not take the word of someone who is a professional shakedown artist. If you or anyone that you know has had a problem that we have not resolved, please let me know. We have sent out parts the harrassment is endless.

I would also like you to point out what part of my post is untrue, since you feel compelled to want to call me names!

-Tim

[SouthernK]

Originally posted by reeflopumps
please base you conclusions about our company and its service from your own experience and from people that you KNOW..do not take the word of someone who is a professional shakedown artist. If you or anyone that you know has had a problem that we have not resolved, please let me know. We have sent out parts the harrassment is endless.

I do know tgreene personally and his setups are pristine and he does have a legitimate issue with your products and so does one of his clients that i also know personally. I have seen both locations and setups in fact I was the one who looked up the number for reeflo while tim was at his clients office trying to sort out the pump issue a while back. I know for a fact that issue with her pump was not resolved. So yes I am listening to people I know about your products and services.

[JRaquatics]

Originally posted by tgreene
So now you're calling me a PROFESSIONAL SHAKEDOWN ARTIST ... Are you F'n kidding me..?

I was first notified via email at 11:17am central time this morning that parts were being shipped out, and I immediately posted as such here...

-Tim

Remember this one?
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...5&pagenumber=1

[tgreene]

Yes I do, and I also recall several others that had similar issues that posted about them!

[tgreene]

Keep in mind that I LOVE these skimmers, and had said so quite frequently in the first portion of this thread, before the split...

My sole issue was the handling of a warranty claim, and it was reinforced by the pump issue several months prior.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...&pagenumber=33

[JRaquatics]

Here is the Reeflo 200 upgrade cup just shy of a week running. And cleaned the cup twice.





And for those that are looking forward to the upgraded wheel. Here is the prototype on the 200


as you can see I need a Dwyer that reads higher than the one I am using to see what it is actually pulling. It is pinned at 50 and sounds like a hoover.

[koa79]

Originally posted by tgreene
Yes I do, and I also recall several others that had similar issues that posted about them!

I think he did the right thing here. If someone sells something on this board and doesn't go though with the sell what does everyone do...they post about it.... samething here.. it's funny how things workout after a bad post comes up on the forums

[twinreef]

JRaquatics = will they have a upgraded wheel for the 250. if so an idea as to when they will be available and how much.

[JRaquatics]

They will have a wheel for the 250. Infact Mike at Reef Specialty got one on his 250 and the results are amazing. I was told that they should be getting the final wheels at the end of July. I don't know how much they will be though.

[spongebobby]

Here are a few pics of the Reef Specialty prototype NW attached to the Dart Gold. I currently am testing on a Reeflo 200 .



So far I am really impressed. These will definately take the 200 and 250 to a whole new level.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

[mariocaz]

Hi guys,

I am considering a lot in change my Euro-Reef RC 500 that I have in my 180 gal. Reef Aquarium heavly stocked with fishes (tangs, angels, triggers, etc.) with an Orca 250 Skimmer w/Orca Gold pump.

So what do you think and recommend me my friends ???

Do you do this change also ??

Which one of this both skimmers do you think is better ?

Any comment or recommendation will be very helpful for me.

Thank you in advance!!

Mario

[benf]

I switched from the Euro dual RC pumps for the Orca 250 for my 200gal/295sys. In addition to the gold pump make sure u get the cup upgrade.

[mariocaz]

Hi benf, so you recommend me to do this switch-change the RC 500 for the Orca 250 ??

Yes I saw the upgrade the only problem is that the Orca 250 skimmer wouldn´t fit inside the stand with the bigger cup, because I have a 35" space there.

Thanx

Mario

[NuReef]

Can some one post a pic of the new and old wheel together/side by side???