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#26 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,180
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Wow glad noone is blind from this! Well I must say I never realy worry to much about protecting myself when fragging zoas and palys. But you guys have freaked me out big time! My wife is a nurse so I think i'll have her bring me home some gloves!
Thanks for shareing your experence.
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150g sps display with basement sump. |
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#27 | |
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Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,682
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Quote:
Glad it's not bothering you Dan, but lets hope and pray there's no permanent damage. I'll check on you this week my friend. Hang tough and thanks for the update. Mucho Reef
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Anyone can build a reef.....the greater challenge......is to grow one. Current Tank Info: 70 gallon zoanthid, Palythoa and Mushroom Reef. |
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#28 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 685
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i just bought some frags from a local reefer who told me he grabbed a rock out one day, not realizing some zoas had grown on the underside. Somehow or other he squeezed it and ended up getting it directly in his eye. He said he was in the ER for 4 days where they drained 3 large bags of fluid from his eye. He says nowadays when fragging he wears full arm length thick gloves and a full face shield, and keeps a printed sheet detailing the specifics of zoa/paly toxins to take with him to the hospital. They had no idea what it was the first time, the doctor had to leave him and freakin go look it up and do research on it. Just goes to show how little is known about it.
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120G mixed reef, 6105's, Kent Nautilus. DIY LED array, Profilux 3. |
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#29 |
ReefKeeping Mag staff
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Location: Grand Rapids, MI
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Vote for August's Thread of the Month!
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Brian June 2013 TOTM Current Tank Info: 270 Starphire by Miracles in Glass*BK 250 Internal*Sequence Blackfin 1800*(2) 6105 Tunzes Streams*(3) 400 watt Blueline E-Ballast*400w 20k Radiums*(3) Lumanarc III*GEO 624 Ca Reactor*Tunze Osmolotor*PM SR45 and TLF PhosBan Reactor 150*Apex |
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#30 |
Registered Member
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such an important reminder! Thanks for posting this. It will definitely remind me to wash hands/be more careful.
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Karin Current Tank Info: 215g Caribbean Inspired Reef with Shadowbox |
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#31 |
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Location: Michigan
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Fyi !!!!!!!!!
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Anyone can build a reef.....the greater challenge......is to grow one. Current Tank Info: 70 gallon zoanthid, Palythoa and Mushroom Reef. |
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#32 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 168
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Just wanted to say thanks for this thread it saved me. I have always known this could happen but just never figured it would happen to me. Last night I was going to make some frags but got on the computer and I rarely visit this site because I have a local site I usually visit but thought I would just look around. I seen this thread and decided it wasn't worth risking it so I put my safety glasses on and sure enough the first cut I made it squirted all over the right eye of my glasses and it wasn't just a couple drops. I am sure that if it wasn't for reading this thread when I did I would be in some serious trouble so THANKS AGAIN!!!!!
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#33 |
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Greensboro, GA
Posts: 945
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Thx for Bumping this one Mucho...I never thought it would happen to me....but it did...ouch! Washing your hands is critical...and if you are fragging I would suggest eye protection. I didn't take pics..but my eye looks a lot like th OP. What was interesting is that the Dr. was aware of palytoxins and had a plan of action.
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Regards, Chris * Imaging the Cosmos, Astrophotography by Chris Hetlage * Current Tank Info: 70 Gal Shallow-Rimless Custom Build In-progress, Apex Controller, Canon 5D |
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#34 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 18
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I'm really glad this thread has helped people. Kinda makes my stupidity worth something. As a long term update to this.. my sight in the affected eye is actually better than it was before now... but that eye fatigues quicker than my other eye. I will probably deal with that the rest of my life. Small price to pay to still have sight anyway! I hardly notice it anymore, but I will always have that constant reminder to wash my hands and wear safety glasses!
Take care, Dan
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I bet if you drive your car off a cliff, you still hit that brake pedal on the way down. |
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#35 |
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Editing title and probably sticky worthy. If anyone else has links or other feedback they want to add, go for it.
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-Eric- |
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#36 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Oregon
Posts: 114
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I recently got sick not too long ago...
I was fragging up a big colony of Zoas then started on with a Toadstool colony. I didnt wear gloves like I usually do but I used DAWN dish soap and washed the life out of my hands That evening I started feeling ill..that night I was so sick it lasted for 13 hours straight. I was finally able to make my way to the couch but it started in again and I couldnt keep any liquids down. I was just about to go to the ER when I finally was able to drink something. In my opinion even if you wash your hands with soap and water its too late becuase the 'stuff' has soaked into your skin or maybe a hang nail. So now I wear gloves and a face mask when fragging ![]() |
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#37 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,872
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What an eye opener! (No pun intended)
Excellent information. This post has me rethinking what to put in my tank. I'm already blind in one eye and sure don't want to take any risks when it comes to eyesight. Is this type of poisoning/infection regulated to just Zoa's or can you have similar problems with other types of tank inhabitants such as hard/soft corals, macroalge or fish only tanks? |
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#38 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Columbus, Ohio, previously Surrey England.
Posts: 431
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heres another example where one of my fellow CORA members was fragging Nuclear Green and others and had a serious situation with poisoning ...
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...+poison&page=3 |
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#39 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 90
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*edited by staff*
Last edited by RokleM; 12/25/2010 at 07:01 PM. Reason: not amused |
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#40 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: FW Indiana
Posts: 582
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Glad to here that you are doing better Dan.
I defiantly will change the way i handle corals. Not to mention my wife is all over me like a cheap suit about it know.LOl |
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#41 |
Wishin' I Was Fishin'
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Michigan
Posts: 472
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Dan, glad things turned around for you buddy! To this day i still feel terrible about it, and partially responsible. As i was walking out the door i thought to myself, maybe i should remind him to wash his hands... nah he will definately do it after i'm gone...
I will never assume again. ![]() |
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#42 |
Premium Member
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Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 761
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Well after 7 years of keeping zoanthids I managed to learn a valuable lesson yesterday. I have fragged ordinary zoas many times and after time, I too have become lax in taking precautions. The polyps that I was working with are Nuclear Greens, very similar to the Purple Deaths the OP was working with. These varieties secrete a mucous that I don't see from ordinary zoas. I was fragging as usual and subconsiously rubbed the corner of my right eye. Soon it started to feel like something was in it so I washed my hands and went to take my contact out, figuring I got an eyelash in it. The contact had adhered to my cornea. I had to pull it off much like when back in the day when we slept in them and it was dry in the morning. I thought it was weird but whatever, washed the contact off and put it back in. An hour later I couldn't handle it anymore and went to take the contact out and it was stuck again, took it out and put my glasses on.. Soon my vision in that eye was cloudy like looking through a thick fog and it was getting painful, more than just irritated like before. I finally went to the doctor and after putting fluorescein in it and viewing unde uv light, he determined that it was not the result of a corneal abrasion but some irritant. He determined at that point supportive therapy was indicated and I decided to forgo an antibiotic at that time due to it probably being an irritant rather than infection. When I went to bed it was very painful, and the lower lid was quite swollen but the cloudiness had gone. This morning it was mattered shut but the swelling was mostly gone and my vision is normal. At the visit, I mentioned palytoxin but after discussing my symptoms vs what has been reported we determined that it is possibly a different toxin but very strong nonetheless. Some medications used in the eye can manifest systemic side effects due to absorbtion through the conjunctiva and sinuses & GI tract through lacrimal duct drainage so it seems reasonable to conclude that if it was palytoxin, I would have had some systemic symptoms. This it a localized reaction that affected my eye, and my sinus on the right side which was running. Now, just about 24 hours later, the swelling is mostly gone, the eye is still red and mattering a bit and the pain is about 25 percent of what it was. If it is not substantially better by the end of the day I will start on antibotic eye drops as a precaution.
Bottom line, this genus of zoanthids seems to have some sort of powerful toxin / irritant that should not be underestimated. 6 hours - note the blister on the inner lower eyelid ![]() 9 hours lower lid swollen and eye discharging ![]() ![]() 18 hours - mattered shut upon awakening ![]()
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Scott Current Tank Info: 210 gallon 72"L x 25"H x 27"W custom 3/4" acrylic reef tank with custom sump, 3 x Radion XR30 Pro with 2 80 watt T5, Aqua C EV180 skimmer, Geo 818 CA reactor, 4 x Vortech mp40 & 2 MP60, Apex controller |
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#43 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2
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goodness... thanks for the info... i'll make sure to wash my hand
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#44 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Perth/Australia
Posts: 83
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Thats insane ! it has never occured to me that this might happen ,never heard of this or seen anyrthing like this before but I tell you now I WILL ALWAYS WASH MY HANDS ,by the way this really freaked me out as I'm legaly blind in one eye already,scary stuff dude!
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#45 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Bloomfield, NY
Posts: 3,471
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Not palytoxin poisoning but still wasn't enjoyable...I always wear gloves now ;(
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1954411
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"Everyday I go to work I pray my gf wont sell my tank before I get home!" Cameron0611 -Justin |
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#46 |
Premium Member
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Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 761
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My eye improved a little every day and this morning was back to normal and I was able to wear contacts again today. No apparent permanent damage. Whew.
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Scott Current Tank Info: 210 gallon 72"L x 25"H x 27"W custom 3/4" acrylic reef tank with custom sump, 3 x Radion XR30 Pro with 2 80 watt T5, Aqua C EV180 skimmer, Geo 818 CA reactor, 4 x Vortech mp40 & 2 MP60, Apex controller |
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#47 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 2
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Thanks for all the insight.. I am a new newbie 1st year.. Zoas are one of my favorites. I will keep all your horror stories in mind..
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#48 |
Moved On
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 66
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Dude I have been doing this reef propagation thing for over ten years and found your experience shocking. This could be me easily! I have terrible habits of not using eye protection not gloves. I have simply been lucky. Thanks for sharing your experience, I will make some changes. TODAY!
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#49 |
still pretending
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Monmouth IL
Posts: 228
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I've dodged a shot of fluid from fragging Zoas. Guess I better use more caution, versus my split second reaction time (dumb luck) next time. Thanks for the experiences, although not pleasant. BTW, I met a person (will remain anonymous) who, everytime she/he fragged, got sick, and had to be put on antibiotics. Said reacted with bad sinus infections, and it was like had the flu everytime, they ended up getting out of the hobby because of it. Maybe they were allergic to all, and all that comes with the hobby, but something else to be aware of.
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I think this part is hard to understand sometimes, it's all about the time of day. Current Tank Info: In wall 100gal from Innovative Plastics/with a 12x12 work area. Euroreef CS6-2, and a "few" Cree LEDs. Hoping to get a new QT, frag setup going. |
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#50 |
Registered Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: South Bay
Posts: 128
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Thanks to everyone who is joining this thread. I must change my bad habit of cutting zoas and other corals. Man, I was lucky enough to not getting poison when handling them without glasses and gloves, and I know the luck does not always come to me. I should have these pictures on my wet saw as a reminder for the safeness.
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