5ft long white tip reef shark at my LFS (Pic & Video) - Page 2

boxfishpooalot · 01/11/2007, 03:17 PM

a long time ago maybee 10 years ago a lfs (No longer in business) had a 300gallon tank with a 2ft nurse shark in it..... I thought that was pretty cruel.

Get this. About 1 year later, he had it in the sump of the system(100gallon sump) supposedly because it was sick!?!? I think it would do better in the tank, no?

FWIW, i paid 12.00lb for my live rock 112 pounds at almost 1100$. Right now its sitting in a rubbermaid curing

HBtank · 01/11/2007, 03:53 PM

I find these threads to be ironic.

I would swear that this was a PETA forum and not a bunch of people with animals and harvested reef stuffed into small glass cages for their viewing amusment preaching.

It seems people are in denial about what the hobby they love actually is.

I see two goals in this hobby:

1. Healthy specimens
2. A nice place to view them

The sentiments regarding how the animal "feels" just does not vibe with me from other hobbyists. What stance do we have to preach from? We are all doing the same thing to a degree and really have no ground to stand on.

Poor shark? Poor tang? Whats the difference, all have been robbed of their natural environment.

Just my thoughts. Sorry, I am not on this bandwagon.

As long as they keep it healthy for the duration of it's captive life, than go for it. If I said anything different I would be a big hipocrite.....

oxkisses12ox · 01/11/2007, 04:05 PM

you should locate an aquarium in that area and call the animal rescue crew to demand it be given to an aquarium ,.. they have the power to do that

snslarison · 01/11/2007, 04:05 PM

Bummer.

reefshadow · 01/11/2007, 04:09 PM

I see that point of view, HBtank. Denying any wild animal the opportunity to reproduce isn't very nice, just different degrees of "bad" in this hobby.

I guess the hobby has advanced to the point that you can do a tank with zero impact (all propagated corals, fishes and live rock) but not many folks do that.

In some locals that shark would have its dorsal fin cut off and be thrown bleeding back into the sea to die.

HBtank · 01/11/2007, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxkisses12ox
you should locate an aquarium in that area and call the animal rescue crew to demand it be given to an aquarium ,.. they have the power to do that

The power to rescue a healthy pet?

Some people here need a reality check.

Yeh, aquariums are saints, I love killer whales stuffed into swimming pools. I have seen worse exhibits at aquariums than that tank...

Seriously, we are all on the same side. The people who would really care would also want to dump your whole tank into the ocean. You realize that, don't you?

HBtank · 01/11/2007, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by reefshadow
I see that point of view, HBtank. Denying any wild animal the opportunity to reproduce isn't very nice, just different degrees of "bad" in this hobby.

I guess the hobby has advanced to the point that you can do a tank with zero impact (all propagated corals, fishes and live rock) but not many folks do that.

In some locals that shark would have its dorsal fin cut off and be thrown bleeding back into the sea to die.

Just playing devils advocate.

It is a hard hobby for me in this respect, so this is something I have thought about alot.

Anyways, in the end it's a personal thing. I hope that people try to make the most natural environment possible and not collect wild caught specimens, but I would never preach to someone about their methods if they are keeping their animals healthy.

Rosseau · 01/11/2007, 05:49 PM

Agreed, although some good must come out of aquarium keeping. Not necessarily directly positive for the environment but rather through a sense of awareness which could change people's perspective on things.

For me, personally speaking, just trying to maintain pH, alkalinity, nitrates... blah blah in a miniscule sampling of an ocean environment that sits on my desk furthers my appreciation for the natural systems that have in some sense esablished a balance.

Anything you put into, take away from or change in your tank will have some effect on it as a system.

But... realistically this positive effect is likely outweighed by the negatives of the hobby.

zemuron114 · 01/15/2007, 01:49 PM

haitian is not vanuatu... only within the year has vanuatu been exporting live rock... like I said. 11.99 is a good price for vanuatu live rock for a retail store, especially in Canada where it is probably harder to import it. I think my LFS sells it for 9$ a lb... but they sell everything else for 4-5$... overall it is very expensive to get.

risika67 · 01/15/2007, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MikeBrke
I love the fact that he is trying to sell live rock at 11.99 lb (middle right hand side of pic)! That is crazy! When are people going to stop paying those crazy prices and let LFS's know we want it cheaper!

My LFS (The only one within 60 miles of me) sells Fiji at $10/lb and Tonga at $15/lb

hammerswinger · 01/15/2007, 02:28 PM

its called capitalism and they must be selling it if they are still in business. Heck If they can sell it for $50 a pound let em sell it all day long. God forbid a business try and make a profit!

sean48183 · 01/15/2007, 03:10 PM

Who says that says that shark is unhappy? Couple of square meals per day, no fishing nets to get caught in and none of his buddy's waiting to get ill a little so they can eat him. If i were a fish I would rather be in my tank than out in that big bad ocean.

AndyB4784 · 01/15/2007, 03:16 PM

exactly. I don't know how a LFS could servive up in the UP. Especially with the mildness of the winter so far. no snow = no money up there. A buddy of mine's family owns a resturant and motel up in copper harbor and i know times are tough for them right now. I'll bet that the store selling at those prices has to get that margin to make it worth their while (and to stay in business).

SptfireXIV · 01/15/2007, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by HBtank
I find these threads to be ironic.

I would swear that this was a PETA forum and not a bunch of people with animals and harvested reef stuffed into small glass cages for their viewing amusment preaching.

It seems people are in denial about what the hobby they love actually is.

I see two goals in this hobby:

1. Healthy specimens
2. A nice place to view them

The sentiments regarding how the animal "feels" just does not vibe with me from other hobbyists. What stance do we have to preach from? We are all doing the same thing to a degree and really have no ground to stand on.

Poor shark? Poor tang? Whats the difference, all have been robbed of their natural environment.

Just my thoughts. Sorry, I am not on this bandwagon.

As long as they keep it healthy for the duration of it's captive life, than go for it. If I said anything different I would be a big hipocrite.....

Thank goodness I'm not alone in feeling this way.

hammerswinger · 01/15/2007, 04:09 PM

I am with the above statement also. I always laugh at goofy stuff like the tang police, oh well keeps life interesting!

[17]shawn[17] · 01/15/2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by xenon
There is two bigals in my city (Ottawa & Kanata, Ontario) with a shark in the exact same size tank.

the last time i was in Kanata i think they had two i could be wrong though

scrmbld33 · 01/15/2007, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Poor shark? Poor tang? Whats the difference, all have been robbed of their natural environment.

i agree completlely, imo i think that shark has it pretty other than being in the ocean, i had to stop going to a lfs near me cause of the"we only have 4 salt tanks so dump everything into them regardless of compatablity or size" ive seen full grown emperators in a 20g, 10+ med to large tangs of everykind in a 20g long, honestly it could be alot worse for the shark

vessxpress1 · 01/15/2007, 09:53 PM

I'm gonna be a hypocrite on this one. This is like putting a full grown tang in a 10 gallon because you don't have a bigger tank. If that's a temporary holding tank, then I could let off a little. But if they purchased it in hopes of finding a buyer, I can't agree with that. Sure, a 4-6 ft. tank is a far cry from the wild but at least the tangs have some swimming room. They can go forward and not immediately bump into the other end. I've seen some large tanks where the tangs seemed pretty content to me. This shark is about one and a half times as long as the tank. I don't know how there's even a comparison.

risika67 · 01/15/2007, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AndyB4784
exactly. I don't know how a LFS could servive up in the UP. Especially with the mildness of the winter so far. no snow = no money up there. A buddy of mine's family owns a resturant and motel up in copper harbor and i know times are tough for them right now. I'll bet that the store selling at those prices has to get that margin to make it worth their while (and to stay in business).

The prices have been like this for a few years now. We are getting a lot of snow now though

BMW///M3 · 01/15/2007, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fish like me
Boycott Big Al Now!!

I saw the video, and it's sickening how the poor animal is going round and round. You can clearly see that he's cramped in there and very unhappy. This suXX. Just like eXXon.

I'm going to call this store tomorrow and register my disgust with them. You guys should do the same.

Ok,

so I don't agree with keeping a shark in a tank like that, or sharks in ANY tank period. But dude, honestly calm down, people like you really bug me, and many other people. You fly off the handle and do this and that. Honestly, do you think Big Al's give a S*IT what you think? What do you mean to them? Do you even shop there? They arn't going to loose any business due to your whining. You're going to call them and some highschool kid who makes $6/hr will pick up the phone when you call and think your a whack job. All of us on here calling and *****ing will not change ANYTHING it's a medium sized corporation. People boycott wallmart in much worse ways, are they not building over 300 new wallmarts throughout the country this year? We are peaons to these people.

Rosseau · 01/15/2007, 09:58 PM

Some people seem to think if we're going to cage these animals then a large cage is the same as a small cage.. I think that's where we're all diverging.

In the end it is all your own personal 'ethics' .. So hammerswinger if you think the quality of life of a tang in a 10 gal is comparable to one living in this tank... well as far off as that seems to me, if you can convince your self of that then you're just as responsible of a reefkeeper as anyone else

This debate goes back a loooooong time

vessxpress1 · 01/15/2007, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sean48183
Who says that says that shark is unhappy? Couple of square meals per day, no fishing nets to get caught in and none of his buddy's waiting to get ill a little so they can eat him. If i were a fish I would rather be in my tank than out in that big bad ocean.

Well, you're a human. Would you rather be in jail than out in the big bad world? It's about the same. You'd still have room to move around in an 8x8 cell. You'd be safe from crime. Wouldn't have to work in order to survive. They'll give you 3 meals a day. Somehow I still doubt many of us would prefer that over being free.

We aren't talking about a clownfish here. No offense. I'm not in the mood to argue over it. Just making the point.

waif · 01/15/2007, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by HBtank
I find these threads to be ironic.

I would swear that this was a PETA forum and not a bunch of people with animals and harvested reef stuffed into small glass cages for their viewing amusment preaching.

It seems people are in denial about what the hobby they love actually is.

I see two goals in this hobby:

1. Healthy specimens
2. A nice place to view them

The sentiments regarding how the animal "feels" just does not vibe with me from other hobbyists. What stance do we have to preach from? We are all doing the same thing to a degree and really have no ground to stand on.

Poor shark? Poor tang? Whats the difference, all have been robbed of their natural environment.

Just my thoughts. Sorry, I am not on this bandwagon.

As long as they keep it healthy for the duration of it's captive life, than go for it. If I said anything different I would be a big hipocrite.....

I don't know about you sir but there is no wild harvsted anything in my tank. Everything in my tank is captive raised or cultured. If you "plunder" the reefs don't assume everyone does.

waif · 01/15/2007, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BMW///M3
Ok,

so I don't agree with keeping a shark in a tank like that, or sharks in ANY tank period. But dude, honestly calm down, people like you really bug me, and many other people. You fly off the handle and do this and that. Honestly, do you think Big Al's give a S*IT what you think? What do you mean to them? Do you even shop there? They arn't going to loose any business due to your whining. You're going to call them and some highschool kid who makes $6/hr will pick up the phone when you call and think your a whack job. All of us on here calling and *****ing will not change ANYTHING it's a medium sized corporation. People boycott wallmart in much worse ways, are they not building over 300 new wallmarts throughout the country this year? We are peaons to these people.

Incidentally everyone in my local area made sure walmart didn't come in. But for a different reason

Rosseau · 01/15/2007, 10:04 PM

BMW///M3

Sure we can make a difference, each of us likely spends upwards of $1000 on aquaria related items... and already, just on this one site in the 5 days that this post has existed it has been viewed over 1000 times, you tell me that isn't significant?!

yeah right. of course we matter and of course what the CONSUMER does will affect what big al's have to do.... everything counts.

01/11/2007, 03:17 PM	#26
boxfishpooalot Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: canada, Grande Praire, Ab Posts: 5,824	a long time ago maybee 10 years ago a lfs (No longer in business) had a 300gallon tank with a 2ft nurse shark in it..... I thought that was pretty cruel. Get this. About 1 year later, he had it in the sump of the system(100gallon sump) supposedly because it was sick!?!? I think it would do better in the tank, no? FWIW, i paid 12.00lb for my live rock 112 pounds at almost 1100$. Right now its sitting in a rubbermaid curing __________________ Its a good idea to have a refrence sample for alk test kits. 1.1350 grams of baking soda in 1gallon of distilled water=10dkh. Check your alkalinity test kit! Algae is Mother Natures phosphate remover Current Tank Info: 220 galon mixed reef.

01/11/2007, 03:53 PM	#27
HBtank Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Huntington Beach, CA Posts: 2,957	I find these threads to be ironic. I would swear that this was a PETA forum and not a bunch of people with animals and harvested reef stuffed into small glass cages for their viewing amusment preaching. It seems people are in denial about what the hobby they love actually is. I see two goals in this hobby: 1. Healthy specimens 2. A nice place to view them The sentiments regarding how the animal "feels" just does not vibe with me from other hobbyists. What stance do we have to preach from? We are all doing the same thing to a degree and really have no ground to stand on. Poor shark? Poor tang? Whats the difference, all have been robbed of their natural environment. Just my thoughts. Sorry, I am not on this bandwagon. As long as they keep it healthy for the duration of it's captive life, than go for it. If I said anything different I would be a big hipocrite..... __________________ 80g Aiptasia dominated reef tank.. with fish and now a bunch of berghia! Current Tank Info: 80g tank, re-starting a reef after a zoanthid nudibranch plauge, followed by months of steady and unstoppable STN/RTN, crashed; stayed FOWLR for a couple years, currently an aiptasia dominated reef tank with fishies and BERGHIA

01/11/2007, 04:05 PM	#28
oxkisses12ox Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Key West Posts: 353	you should locate an aquarium in that area and call the animal rescue crew to demand it be given to an aquarium ,.. they have the power to do that __________________ 14 Gallon Biocube Plate Coral 2 serpent stars 2 hermits and 4 snails 1 cleaner shrimp 2 false clowns 1 horseshoe crab water : nirates nitrite amonia = 0 PH 8.2 temp 79 calc 400 Current Tank Info: 14 gallon biocube

01/11/2007, 04:05 PM	#29
snslarison Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Downey, CA Posts: 1,430	Bummer. __________________ "Ok you Primitive Screwheads, listen up! You see this? This... is my BOOMSTICK! " -Army of Darkness

01/11/2007, 04:09 PM	#30
reefshadow Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Central Washington Posts: 1,786	I see that point of view, HBtank. Denying any wild animal the opportunity to reproduce isn't very nice, just different degrees of "bad" in this hobby. I guess the hobby has advanced to the point that you can do a tank with zero impact (all propagated corals, fishes and live rock) but not many folks do that. In some locals that shark would have its dorsal fin cut off and be thrown bleeding back into the sea to die. __________________ All Your Coral Are Belong To Us Current Tank Info: 30 Deep Blue shallow mixed rimless, MP10, Ecoxotic LED's, SCA 301 skimmer.

01/11/2007, 05:49 PM	#33
Rosseau Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Kingston, Ontario Posts: 2,049	Agreed, although some good must come out of aquarium keeping. Not necessarily directly positive for the environment but rather through a sense of awareness which could change people's perspective on things. For me, personally speaking, just trying to maintain pH, alkalinity, nitrates... blah blah in a miniscule sampling of an ocean environment that sits on my desk furthers my appreciation for the natural systems that have in some sense esablished a balance. Anything you put into, take away from or change in your tank will have some effect on it as a system. But... realistically this positive effect is likely outweighed by the negatives of the hobby. __________________ Still fighting entropy.

01/15/2007, 01:49 PM	#34
zemuron114 Moved On Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Pilgrim State (Mass) Posts: 4,039	haitian is not vanuatu... only within the year has vanuatu been exporting live rock... like I said. 11.99 is a good price for vanuatu live rock for a retail store, especially in Canada where it is probably harder to import it. I think my LFS sells it for 9$ a lb... but they sell everything else for 4-5$... overall it is very expensive to get.

01/15/2007, 02:28 PM	#36
hammerswinger Moved On Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: USA Posts: 315	its called capitalism and they must be selling it if they are still in business. Heck If they can sell it for $50 a pound let em sell it all day long. God forbid a business try and make a profit!

01/15/2007, 03:10 PM	#37
sean48183 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: michigan Posts: 1,577	Who says that says that shark is unhappy? Couple of square meals per day, no fishing nets to get caught in and none of his buddy's waiting to get ill a little so they can eat him. If i were a fish I would rather be in my tank than out in that big bad ocean.

01/15/2007, 03:16 PM	#38
AndyB4784 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: lansing, mi Posts: 309	exactly. I don't know how a LFS could servive up in the UP. Especially with the mildness of the winter so far. no snow = no money up there. A buddy of mine's family owns a resturant and motel up in copper harbor and i know times are tough for them right now. I'll bet that the store selling at those prices has to get that margin to make it worth their while (and to stay in business).

01/15/2007, 04:09 PM	#40
hammerswinger Moved On Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: USA Posts: 315	I am with the above statement also. I always laugh at goofy stuff like the tang police, oh well keeps life interesting!

01/15/2007, 09:53 PM	#43
vessxpress1 Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: NW IL Posts: 1,603	I'm gonna be a hypocrite on this one. This is like putting a full grown tang in a 10 gallon because you don't have a bigger tank. If that's a temporary holding tank, then I could let off a little. But if they purchased it in hopes of finding a buyer, I can't agree with that. Sure, a 4-6 ft. tank is a far cry from the wild but at least the tangs have some swimming room. They can go forward and not immediately bump into the other end. I've seen some large tanks where the tangs seemed pretty content to me. This shark is about one and a half times as long as the tank. I don't know how there's even a comparison.

01/15/2007, 09:58 PM	#46
Rosseau Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Kingston, Ontario Posts: 2,049	Some people seem to think if we're going to cage these animals then a large cage is the same as a small cage.. I think that's where we're all diverging. In the end it is all your own personal 'ethics' .. So hammerswinger if you think the quality of life of a tang in a 10 gal is comparable to one living in this tank... well as far off as that seems to me, if you can convince your self of that then you're just as responsible of a reefkeeper as anyone else This debate goes back a loooooong time

01/15/2007, 10:04 PM	#50
Rosseau Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Kingston, Ontario Posts: 2,049	BMW///M3 Sure we can make a difference, each of us likely spends upwards of $1000 on aquaria related items... and already, just on this one site in the 5 days that this post has existed it has been viewed over 1000 times, you tell me that isn't significant?! yeah right. of course we matter and of course what the CONSUMER does will affect what big al's have to do.... everything counts. __________________ Still fighting entropy.