New EcoTech Marine Vectra Return Pump

[clynch08]

hey everyone. i currently have a 300 gallon reef tank. im looking at purchasing a vectra pump. my tank is in a living space so the more silent the pump the better. i would like to run my pump at 1200 GPH. my question is what pump would be the most silent. the M1 at almost full capacity or the L1 at half capacity. any info would be appreciated. im still not sure if the pump will be in the sump or external to the sump. thank you fellow reefers.

[rjallen]

No difference in sound....at least to my ear, L1 could perhaps run a manifold for reactors and thus replace more than one louder pump.

RJ

[clynch08]

how silent are they both? my main concern is that the tank is in a living space and i would like the pump as silent as possible. and thank you very much for the idea of running the reactor off of the vectra also.

[rjallen]

My Vectras are the quietest pumps I have used in all the time I have been keeping fish. Some pumps, like the Waveline are fairly quiet but have a deep hum. The Vectra have no motor noise at all and very little vibration. I find myself sometimes wanting to touch the pump [ running externally] to see if it is running. The only problem you may experience is you may now hear other water noises coming from you water moving through your plumbing.

Wish there was a smaller unit to power my skimmer.

RJ

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by rjallen

I find myself sometimes wanting to touch the pump [ running externally] to see if it is running.

Haha, I do the same. Even with my ear an inch from the pump it is barely noticeable. Fans in my LED lights, slight trickle from the overflows, and fish hitting the screen are far louder.

[mfinn]

Originally Posted by rjallen

The Vectra have no motor noise at all and very little vibration. I find myself sometimes wanting to touch the pump [ running externally] to see if it is running. The only problem you may experience is you may now hear other water noises coming from you water moving through your plumbing.

Wish there was a smaller unit to power my skimmer.

RJ

Exact same thing here.
I am looking into a quieter skimmer pump.

[clynch08]

So what do you think would be my best bet on to buy. I would like to run at 1200 GPH. Would the L1 or the M1 be my best bet. I would run the m1 at near full power and the l1 at about half power. What do you think would be in my best interest? Thanks everyone. I would just like to do my homework before I spend the money on a pump

[skinsncanes]

For anyone considering between the m1 and the l1, I'd definitely get the L1. I didn't realize how fast you lost head pressure with them. I have three L1s that I thought would all be throttled way back but I run them all at 100 percent. One is just running three canisters and uv but the manifold and the t fittings must cut it way down because it doesn't seem like there's much pressure. Most of the recent people that asked all had 180+ tanks, no way the m1 will work. I'd say only very small tanks you could get away with a m1

[clynch08]

Is it that's the motor isn't that powerful? Or they lose pressure over time? Has anyone else had the same issue? I'm more leaning to the L1 pump

[mfinn]

I use a M1 as a return on my 240 and it's plenty of flow.

[mfinn]

Originally Posted by clynch08

Is it that's the motor isn't that powerful? Or they lose pressure over time? Has anyone else had the same issue? I'm more leaning to the L1 pump

The flow chart is on this page.

http://ecotechmarine.com/products/vectra/vectra-m1

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by clynch08

Is it that's the motor isn't that powerful? Or they lose pressure over time? Has anyone else had the same issue? I'm more leaning to the L1 pump

I believe it's just the pumps are designed more for flow than for pressure. If you look at something like a panworld pump, there are two configurations for many of the motor sizes, with different impellar/volutes based on wanting either pressure or flow. I'd not use one of these to pump up against significant head pressure, but it's great for something like a closed loop where the pressure requirement is minimal.

[Eud]

Originally Posted by ca1ore

I believe it's just the pumps are designed more for flow than for pressure. If you look at something like a panworld pump, there are two configurations for many of the motor sizes, with different impellar/volutes based on wanting either pressure or flow. I'd not use one of these to pump up against significant head pressure, but it's great for something like a closed loop where the pressure requirement is minimal.

I'm getting an L1 in the next few days to replace my noisy Reeflo which pushes around 1000gph upstairs through about 12 feet total of resistance. From the flow curve published this looks realistic for the L1 to handle. I will soon be using it on a downstairs tank when the upstairs one is taken down instead. Are you saying that the flow curve isn't accurate and it won't push this much to the upstairs?

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by Eud

Are you saying that the flow curve isn't accurate and it won't push this much to the upstairs?

I'm not saying the flow curve isn't accurate. If the published curves say you'll get 1,000 against 12 feet, then I see no reason to doubt that. All I am saying is that if you look at the design, it appears to be a pump designed more for flow than for pressure, so I'd expect the gph to fall off more rapidly than a pump designed for pressure. The question is whether you still get a power use advantage. For example, I'd been thinking about using the L1 as my main pump, but concluded the power savings wasn't worth the cost:

L1: Flow 3,100; max head 21 feet; 130 watts - loses about 70% of flow at 12 feet
PW150: Flow 1,100; max head 28; 180 watts - loses about 15% of flow at 12 feet

Figure if the numbers are accurate, that the L1 would save me about $35/year which, against a $450 purchase price is a long payback. Probably not worth it. Other folks may have other reasons to change beyond just cost of course.

I'll be every interested in your experience though.

[Eud]

Thanks for the good response. I get what you're saying. I'll be on the steep part of the curve.

For a pressure rated pump the flow curve is optimized for pressure, the curve looks different, and more even as you go to higher head.

I currently have a Reeflo Blackfin 3600 which is a pressure rated pump, but loud and getting louder (and leaking a bit) after running for 1.5 years without a pause. It could probably use a bearing replacement and a good cleanout. It's also around 275W, so my payoff will be a bit faster.

I'm primarily excited about the silence and hope it stays silent at full speed. I'll also appreciate the fact that it's not a direct AC motor, so I don't have to worry as much about feeding it with a true sine wave and can have it on a cheaper UPS.

[ksed]

its dead silent even at full speed.
I would confirm with Ecotech about running it on a UPS though. It might not be Sinewave.

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by Eud

I currently have a Reeflo Blackfin 3600 which is a pressure rated pump, but loud and getting louder (and leaking a bit) after running for 1.5 years without a pause. It could probably use a bearing replacement and a good cleanout. It's also around 275W, so my payoff will be a bit faster.

Leaking's not good My panworld runs in a part of the basement that is separated so noise isn't really a concern to me. In the tank's stand, where my closed loop M1 resides, noise is a VERY BIG deal. I've spent a lot of time, effort .... and $$ .... trying to get the tank as quiet as possible, particularly at night. GL

[pdiehm]

I am thinking of upgrading my return pump from a sicce 5 to a waveline dc 10000 or the ecotech vectra M1.

The thing that I'm struggling with in regards to the ecotech is whether it's strong enough to feed my refugium, a frag tank, and the display. I probably have 5 foot of head to the display tank alone, and while I am positive that this would feed the display easily, add in say 250-300 gph to the refugium, and another 200 to the frag tank...

right now, my sicce 5 is rated for about 1300-1400 gph. I'm probably getting 800 or so (without feeding my refugium). If I am feeding my refugium, my gate valve on the beananimal siphon drain is virtually closed (and by that I mean, I'm literally 1/2 turn from being fully closed.

Then comes the kicker, according to BRS, you don't want a lot of flow through the sump...but others say, you want the flow because you don't want stuff settling in the sump and want to keep it suspended so it gets picked up by the skimmer at some point.

the Vectra M1 is 2000 gph. Has what? 21' head capacity? I figure I'm running 5 to the display tank, and will be another 2-3' to the frag tank (not sure if that counts as it will be t'd off the return) along with a T and a 15" vertical drop to the refugium housed in the last compartment of the sump.

The bigger waveline would give me more gph, and more cushion to feed the refugium and eventual frag tank that I'm building.

[MrsReefK]

Just ordered the Vectra M1 to run our skimmer (lifereef S3-36) and an L1 for our return. Can't wait for this all to arrive. DT is 290 hex flat back, 90 gallon fuge, 30 gallon sump, frag tank and external skimmer.

[ca1ore]

Originally Posted by pdiehm

Then comes the kicker, according to BRS, you don't want a lot of flow through the sump...but others say, you want the flow because you don't want stuff settling in the sump and want to keep it suspended so it gets picked up by the skimmer at some point.

It's an age old debate. I subscribe to the former position because, if you think about it, the level of flow that would be required to effectively keep particulates in suspension across the full cross-section of the sump is impractical. Plus, a skimmer will remove very fine particulates as they'll adhere to the bubbles, but it won't remove much else. I've yet to hear a really cogent argument supporting high flow rates through the sump.

[power boat jim]

Originally Posted by Eud

Thanks for the good response. I get what you're saying. I'll be on the steep part of the curve.

For a pressure rated pump the flow curve is optimized for pressure, the curve looks different, and more even as you go to higher head.

I currently have a Reeflo Blackfin 3600 which is a pressure rated pump, but loud and getting louder (and leaking a bit) after running for 1.5 years without a pause. It could probably use a bearing replacement and a good cleanout. It's also around 275W, so my payoff will be a bit faster.

I'm primarily excited about the silence and hope it stays silent at full speed. I'll also appreciate the fact that it's not a direct AC motor, so I don't have to worry as much about feeding it with a true sine wave and can have it on a cheaper UPS.

A pump rated at 80 watts will not push anywhere the water the reeflo will. DC is not that much more efficient then AC. I ran a Barracuda for 10 years nonstop without a problem. It just started making some noise. There is no DC pump that can lift water 15 feet and give the volume of a reeflo type pressure rated pump. It takes a certain amount of energy to move that much water that high. DC pumps just dont provide that kind of power, especially for about 400 bucks.

Not a knock on any DC pumps but the laws of physics are what they are.

[pdiehm]

Originally Posted by ca1ore

It's an age old debate. I subscribe to the former position because, if you think about it, the level of flow that would be required to effectively keep particulates in suspension across the full cross-section of the sump is impractical. Plus, a skimmer will remove very fine particulates as they'll adhere to the bubbles, but it won't remove much else. I've yet to hear a really cogent argument supporting high flow rates through the sump.

sending you a pm. follow up not relevant to the thread topic

[mnkykng77]

Need some help, currently running an eheim 1262 as a return pump. I would like to make a manifold to run a UV sterilizer from the return line, so should I go with the L1 vs the M1?
Head hieght is 5ft to a 90 and then to 2 3/4" outputs with the furthest being another 5ft on the far end.

[rjallen]

Originally Posted by mnkykng77

Need some help, currently running an eheim 1262 as a return pump. I would like to make a manifold to run a UV sterilizer from the return line, so should I go with the L1 vs the M1?
Head hieght is 5ft to a 90 and then to 2 3/4" outputs with the furthest being another 5ft on the far end.

The M1 would be a great improvement on your 1262. But if you add a manifold, the L1 will give you much more. Problems with a manifold usually come from having not enough volume. You could make it work with the M1 but you might end up with a little less flow through your return.

RJ

[gus6464]

Originally Posted by mnkykng77

Need some help, currently running an eheim 1262 as a return pump. I would like to make a manifold to run a UV sterilizer from the return line, so should I go with the L1 vs the M1?
Head hieght is 5ft to a 90 and then to 2 3/4" outputs with the furthest being another 5ft on the far end.

If you got the cash go for the biggest one. You can always dial it down.