Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

[jimbob321]

lol
i am going for reds tomorrow and flounder next week.
i saw a red tailing this morning at the dock.and didn't have the time to fish

[Genera]

What fish do you have in there right now? Also, are you going to put any more fish in? If so I have some suggestions!

[Michael Hoaster]

I have four barnacle blennies. I have a fish list, but I'd be delighted to hear suggestions.

I see you have an Atlantic Biotope. Is there a thread for it?

I'm going for a peaceful, small fish community, with the most boisterous fish probably the atlantic blue tang. Any experience with this fish? Any other Caribbean fish you have dealt with I'd love to hear about!

[Genera]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

I have four barnacle blennies. I have a fish list, but I'd be delighted to hear suggestions.

I see you have an Atlantic Biotope. Is there a thread for it?

I'm going for a peaceful, small fish community, with the most boisterous fish probably the atlantic blue tang. Any experience with this fish? Any other Caribbean fish you have dealt with I'd love to hear about!

Great! No thread yet. Should I make one? The tank is two months old and only has a few mollies. It is way far behind equipmentwise and the 40B doesn't even have water due to family reasons but I have a definite fish list. Will be able to get lights, rocks, etc in a few weeks. So an Atlantic Blue Tang. They are just great! Make sure to QT, feed lots of marine based algae, proper tank husbandry, and you should be good! As long as there are no other tangs or conspecifics in the tank (there are two other Caribbean tangs that I'll mention later) unless added simultaneously, then they should be peaceful with other fish. I don't know if the tangs would go after your seagrass and macros or not. Tangs LOVE macroalgae. Am I allowed to reccomend a place to purchase things from? If so, I know two GREAT places for getting Caribbean life.

I have a bunch of fish in mind, but some/most of them eat certain invertebrates/plants that you have or may want to have in your tank. So, could you give me a list of inverts/plants that you currently have or want to have in your tank? For example, I have the Banded Butterflyfish on my list, but if you have or want to have gorgonians, anemones, zoanthids, and etc, then that wouldn't be an option unless you decide to not keep gorgonians, anemones, zoanthids, and etc. Thank you!

[Michael Hoaster]

Absolutely start a thread!

I also considered the doctor fish (another caribbean tang), but I think one tang will be enough.

I'm pretty sure the blue won't eat the sea grass, unless he's really, really hungry. The macros are filling in nicely on my rocks and fake wall. I plan to let it get a bit overgrown before I add the tang.

Yes, unfortunately I had to eliminate the caribbean butterflies from my list, because I plan to keep an anemone or two.

I have listed my plants, fish and inverts more than once on this thread. Given we're doing similar things, you might find it interesting. Basically, I have 3 seagrass species growing in my DSB, as well as lots of macros everywhere else, except for the dim end of the tank, where I plan to have gorgonians and sponges. For fish, royal grammas, sunshine chromis, chalk bass, cherub angels, blue tang and a few other candidates.

[Genera]

I read all 33 pages! But I didn't catch the dimensions or gallonage of your tank. Well, Cherub Angels can be aggressive little fish depending on the individual. Especially with conspecifics, but towards other fish as well. They is a slight chance that they may also eat your coral, feather worms, and other benthic inverts, again, depending on the individual, but I think they are more of the 'reef safe' angels there. I'd get a bonded pair and see how they do. Also, I'd get more rock, rearrange your current rock, or both, and create a pile somewhere with caves and crevices that any of your fish can fit in (especially for the Basslets/Grammas and Cherub Angels, and excluding the tang when it reaches full size)

So here's my stocking ideas for your tank. Also, could I have the gallonage and dimensions of your tank, I couldn't find it anywhere in the thread, maybe I'm blind. No I'm not.

•A harem/group of Royal Grammas (Gramma Loreto) and Black Cap Basslets (Gramma Melacara) in a ratio of 3.5 to 1. I'd go for a group of 7 Royals and 2 Black Caps. Semi aggressive, will establish a pecking order and will defend their 'area'.

•A pair of Cherub Angels (Centropyge Argi). Make sure they are a true mated pair though, and watch them for aggression. Watch for nipping at inverts too.

•Atlantic Blue Tang (Acanthurus Coeruleus). Swims a lot. May eat all of your macros over time. IME tangs never turn down any macros except for calcified species such as Halimeda Opuntia. If having more than one tang, introduce simultaneously in the evening and turn off lights for the night. Feed lots of marine based algae (you have some living ones in your tank too), and quarantine well.

•Ocean Surgeon (Acanthurus Bahianus) See Atlantic Blue Tang

•Doctorfish (Acanthurus Chirurgus) See Atlantic Blue Tang

•A group of Chalk Basslets (Serranus Tortugarrum). Amazing and often overlooked fish! A group around 5-8 would be nice. May eat small shrimp such as Periclimenes Pedersoni.

•A group of Sailfin Mollies or other Mollies (Poecilia Latipinna or Poecilia Spp.). Grazers, peaceful, have more females than males ratio about 4:1

•A group of Inland Silversides (Menidia Beryllina) I'm pretty sure they are peaceful planktivores, would be at their best in a school of 7 or more.

•A group of Sunshine Chromis (Chromis Insolata) also called the Olive Chromis due to their drab adult coloration of olive greenish black with a creme underbelly and hints of juvenile coloration. Juveniles are brilliantly colored. These are peaceful, hardy, grow to 6in, may be a bit aggressive and turn on conspecifics with age. School of about 5 or so.

•A group of Purple Reef Fish (Chromis Scotti). See Sunshine Chromis. Bright purple, as adults are olive greenish black with purple tint. Grow to 4in.

•A group of Blue Chromis (Chromis Cyanea) Grows to 6in. Blue, peaceful-ish, may be a bit aggressive and turn on conspecifics with age. Hardy and a nice blue color.

•Two pairs of Yellowhead Jawfish (Opistognathus Aurifrons) Love to watch them 'dance' in their sandbed holes. Peaceful and a bit timid.

•Pair of Neon Gobies (Elacatinus Oceanops). Small peaceful fish, hardy, colorful blue and black lines, may eat parasites/dead tissue off of other fish. Make sure it is a true mated pair. May fight with conspecifics if not a pair.

•2 Saddled Blennies (Malacoctenus Triangulatus) Will help consume microalgae, hops around on rocks/sand/etc, peaceful.

•A group of Masked Gobies (Coryphopterus Personatus) Small peaceful fish, a group of 6 or so would look great.

•2 Goldline Blennies (Malacoctenus Aurolineatus) See Saddled Blenny. Different

•Seminole Gobies (Microgobius Carri) Really cool fish, peaceful, live in shallow holes, cool fish. A pair, or a group of 6-8 would be work best.

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks for reading! It's basically a 180 gallon tall - 64Lx24Dx30H. And thanks for your stocking ideas.

I realize the cherub can be a bastard. They will be the next to last fish added. My thoughts with a harem of 4, rather than a pair, is that they may be more interested in each other, rather than their other tank mates. And having 3 females to one male, means the male's attention gets spread amongst the harem, rather than one female. I'm going to attempt the same strategy with the grammas.

I have no plans to move or add rocks. I'm hoping both the grammas and cherubs take up residence in the caves in my fake wall. For more info on that, check out my thread on the fake wall. Seeing how a large harem of grammas does with it, will determine how daring I get with the cherubs.

I may do a black cap basslet. I'm a little more interested in the swiss guard basslet. Maybe I'll get one of each.

I'd love to do multiple tangs, but I've settled on just one-the blue. I'm especially excited to get a small, yellow phase juvenile. If it doesn't work out, I may try another, like the doctor fish, or if I can find a non-aggressive herbivorous blenny, one of those.

I considered the silversides, but I want to limit the number of planktivores, so my plankton populations don't get decimated. A large school of these fish would be awesome though!

Great info on the chromises! May go with the purples rather than the sunshines, or both.

I love jawfish! I my experience, they're just a little too timid to survive long term in a fast-paced community tank. I may keep a couple in my quarantine tank.

I think I will choose cleaner shrimps over the neons, but they are a possibility.

The last 4 fish you listed are interesting, because I hadn't considered them. I'll have to take a look! Also, any personal experience you've had with any of your suggestions would be extremely helpful.

I do appreciate the input! I'm very excited about the fish, but before I add more, I plan to get the sessile invertebrates settled in place. So, it'll be anemone(s), gorgonians and sponges next.

[sam.basye]

A little motivation to start checking off items on that fish list.

Wild atlantic blue tang seen in Curacao on my honeymoon.



**I wish my tank looked like these poles! Sponge and christmas tree worm galore.

[ichthyogeek]

Michael, while we're on the topic of fish, how are your barnacle blennies and mollies? Oh, and in case the grammas decide to get...frisky, you may want to provide them with a little bit more macroalgae. They'll tear some off to make nests and then you're off to the fish breeding forum!

[Genera]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

Thanks for reading! It's basically a 180 gallon tall - 64Lx24Dx30H. And thanks for your stocking ideas.

I realize the cherub can be a bastard. They will be the next to last fish added. My thoughts with a harem of 4, rather than a pair, is that they may be more interested in each other, rather than their other tank mates. And having 3 females to one male, means the male's attention gets spread amongst the harem, rather than one female. I'm going to attempt the same strategy with the grammas.
Oh! I didn't realize the male would turn his attention towards each female resulting in less aggression, lol
I have no plans to move or add rocks. I'm hoping both the grammas and cherubs take up residence in the caves in my fake wall. For more info on that, check out my thread on the fake wall. Seeing how a large harem of grammas does with it, will determine how daring I get with the cherubs.

I may do a black cap basslet. I'm a little more interested in the swiss guard basslet. Maybe I'll get one of each.
Swissguard Basslets won't 'harem up' with the royals, but they sure are cool fisj
I'd love to do multiple tangs, but I've settled on just one-the blue. I'm especially excited to get a small, yellow phase juvenile. If it doesn't work out, I may try another, like the doctor fish, or if I can find a non-aggressive herbivorous blenny, one of those.

I considered the silversides, but I want to limit the number of planktivores, so my plankton populations don't get decimated. A large school of these fish would be awesome though!
Maybe you could set up your own plankton cultures, I'm going to start doing that, once I get home from vacation. Then you could 'plankton dose' your tank to keep populations up. I'd also love to have a school of silversides in my tank, but it might not be big enough for that many fish.
Great info on the chromises! May go with the purples rather than the sunshines, or both.

I love jawfish! I my experience, they're just a little too timid to survive long term in a fast-paced community tank. I may keep a couple in my quarantine tank.

I think I will choose cleaner shrimps over the neons, but they are a possibility.
The Caribbean cleaner shrimps are a little different than the Indo-Pacifics, their white line goes straight in the tail, while the Indo-Pacifics split into four corners and a V. The Caribbeans are Lysmata Grabhami, and are a bit more expensive that Lysmata Amboinensis, which is the Indo-Pacific.

Amboinensis Vs. Grabhami

The last 4 fish you listed are interesting, because I hadn't considered them. I'll have to take a look! Also, any personal experience you've had with any of your suggestions would be extremely helpful.
All are great fish, peaceful too, most will hang out or hover over the rocks and plants, and consume a bit of microalgae
I do appreciate the input! I'm very excited about the fish, but before I add more, I plan to get the sessile invertebrates settled in place. So, it'll be anemone(s), gorgonians and sponges next.

Sponges! Ah, one of my favorite inverts. Hard to keep alive for their simplicity though. Need lots of plankton and foods in the .01-5µm range. Some species I'd like to get are Callyspongia Vaginalis, Callyspongia Plicifera, Halichondria Sp, Haliclona Compressa, Pseudoaxinella Lunchearta, Niphates Digitalis, Cinachyra Sp, Ptilocaulis Sp, Etc.

I'd get a bunch of Rock Flower Anemones!!! (Epicystis Crucifer). AMAZING anemones that tend to stay in one place, and prefer to be in the sand rather than on rocks. You should get a small group (3-5) of Pederson's Anemone Shrimp (Periclimenes Pedersoni) to go with them! They will dance around on the anemones, and chillax and enjoy life lol. Some other Caribbean anemones, such as Bartholomea Annulata, tend to eat fish that are sleeping or slow enough to catch. Cool anemones though!

For gorgonians, I'd just go for a diverse group of photosynthetic ones. The non photosynthetic gorgonians seem to have few success stories. Some cool ones are Corky Sea Fingers (Briareum Asbestinum), Green Gorgonian (Pterogorgia Citrina), Spiny Orange Gorgonian (Muricea Elongate), Encrusting Gorgonian (Briareum Sp.), and the various purple gorgonians. A few rocks full of Ricordea Florida would be cool too! They like low-ish flow, with basically any light. Very hardy too.

Have you heard of Sea Biscuits(Meoma Ventricosa) which are relatives of sand dollars? I believe they mainly eat detritus and bits and pieces of algae and dead things. Great sand sifters too. You can get them over at Diver Tom in the 'Urchins' section. You may want to purposefully feed them small chunks of shrimp/algae every so often.

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks for the Blue Tang pic, Sam! I hope to get sponge growth like that on my fake roots.

[Michael Hoaster]

Ichthyogeek, the Barnacle Blennies are doing great. They are amusing and sturdy fish.

The Mollies disappeared! I came back from a camping trip, and there is no sign of them - not even a corpse. I suspect they are the victims of my snail population explosion. Not enough micro algae left to support them.

I'm very concerned with the possibility of a snail crash. However, I don't want to have to remove snails. I'd rather their numbers reached an equilibrium naturally. I may consider adding a small snail predator. Off the top of my head maybe a wrasse or hermit crab.

Any suggestions?

[Genera]

If you want to get rid of some snails, hermit crabs will do that. I had both one time, 10 hermits and 10 snails, and all of the snails were gone by the next week. Just remove the crabs after a while so they don't eat every snail.

[Michael Hoaster]

Genera, it's anybody guess, as to what the cherubs will do. I've read that they form harems in the wild, and have even spawned in captivity using the 'harem method', so that's what I'm going to attempt. Also, adding them (almost) last should help.

Plankton 'dosing' would be a great addition to any plankitivore-heavy tank. I, however, am much too lazy for that! I even bailed on my planned refugium, for simplicity's sake.

I love the caribbean anemone shrimps and the porcelain crabs. I want rock anemones and one conylactis gigantea.

[Michael Hoaster]

Genera, what kind of hermits did you have?

It would be pretty handy to have a few serious snail killers, that could be relegated to the quarantine tank when their job is done.

[Genera]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

Genera, what kind of hermits did you have?

It would be pretty handy to have a few serious snail killers, that could be relegated to the quarantine tank when their job is done.

Condylactis Giganteas are gorgeous. I had Dwarf Red Tip Hermits (Clibanarius Sp.). They go crazy and kill other dwarf hermits and snails when they need a new shell, which doesn't take very long. Now I have a snail only clean up crew, with 2 hitchhiker dwarf red tips that I found in a bucket of live rock that has been sitting at room temperature with no water for a few weeks, those crabs are one of those things that you have to kill with a flamethrower lol. I have plenty of empty shells from them killing snails and other crabs in my previous tank, but they'll be banished to the LFS or something if they touch any snails though.

[Genera]

Any pics of your Banded Coral Shrimp pair?

[Michael Hoaster]

They're in the tank, but not in a good place to get a pic-I tried. I'll try again later, when they've gotten more settled in.

[Michael Hoaster]

Added 4 hermit crabs today. I'm hoping they'll go after some snails. And maybe the coral banded shrimps will follow suit. I have no idea if they have gone after any or not. They just chill in a shady spot all day. More active at night, but I can't see.

[Genera]

I just caught one of my technically hitchhiker crabs eating a snail. To the LFS, with you (two)!

[Devaji108]

great photo! but a bummer at least you have a LFS to send him to tho...

[carmelpi]

I just picked up a pair of bonded gold coral banded shrimp. i'm hoping they'll be nice to my hermits.

[saltwater sam]

Coral banded shrimp are the devil. Very aggressive to all tank inhabitants

[karimwassef]

They have to be. Do you see what they eat?

[Michael Hoaster]

My pair have found a gap in the fake wall, and they hide out there all day. They do appear to move around at night. Hopefully, they're getting after some snails.

Sam, I didn't know they were aggressive to all. Yikes!