Kessil Club

[WaReefer458]

Originally Posted by JamesHolt

For a 40g Breeder would it be better to use two 160's or one 360

The 2 160's will give you less shadowing. If you don't plan on upgrading any time soon I'd stick with that. I will be upgrading my 40 to a 180 eventually so I just did 1 360 and it covers the whole tank about 8" off the surface. I just had the shuffle rock around until I got the shadowing to a minimum.

[JamesHolt]

Originally Posted by WaReefer458

The 2 160's will give you less shadowing. If you don't plan on upgrading any time soon I'd stick with that. I will be upgrading my 40 to a 180 eventually so I just did 1 360 and it covers the whole tank about 8" off the surface. I just had the shuffle rock around until I got the shadowing to a minimum.

Coral wise I wont be getting any bigger, just staying in the 40g breeder for my corals...
Wanting to try to keep more corals than just shrooms and GSP..Looking at getting some chalices,acans,blasto's, maybe a favia or two..
If I go too big with my coral tank, it will blow my spending money, the 40g breeder is perfect for me, as a coral only tank..It is big enough for a good variety but small enough to be reasonable to keep up..
I have a 180 in the works for a predator tank..(using t5's, IO salt, staying "cheap" with this one)
And my frag tank I have setup as a shallow softie tank..

I am just trying to decide if I want to go from a twin 175w MH setup to the kessils on the 40..

I can get 110par on the sand with the MH using plusrite 20k bulbs, 9" off the water.
What kind of par can you get with the kessil like you have??

[WaReefer458]

Dunno. Don't have a par meter but I ramp them to 80% and my sps look happy with it. I'd go with the kessils over the halides just for the power savings. Do the math. 350 watts of hot halides or 90 watts of cool led's that are programmable. Seems like an easy choice to me.

[oseymour]

Any thoughts on the BRS 160 Series on LEDS. The A360 and AP700 get's some good coverage and some par values - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7XLgLiA0PM

[ERIC85854]

Originally Posted by oseymour

Any thoughts on the BRS 160 Series on LEDS. The A360 and AP700 get's some good coverage and some par values - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7XLgLiA0PM

I saw it. Nice and even spread. I thought PAR would be higher at 12". I guess I should get a second A360 over my 54 corner tank at some point. I also don't understand why most people say they don't go over 75% intensity when those results were at 100%?

[oseymour]

Took some screenshots of the A360 par readings.

If these numbers are at 100% intensity then I've probably been starving my corals a little(especially my euphyllia). I have a lot of corals on or close to my sandbed, about 16 or so inches deep and I'm running at 50% max.

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[jumplittlechloe]

I watched this earlier today. I have lights hung around 5-6 inches above water line and have 3 a360we on and 120 (48x24x24) my highest setting is 70% for 4hrs. I have a pearlberry acro about 6" below water line and a slimmer 12-18" below water line. They coloring up and doing fine. These readings make me feel like the a360n would be better par wise however from past experience with led's I feel like 3 a360n over a 24" depth tank would give me some fried corals. Still not sure what to think about the BRS video.

[manilaboy1vic]

Originally Posted by oseymour

Took some screenshots of the A360 par readings.

If these numbers are at 100% intensity then I've probably been starving my corals a little(especially my euphyllia). I have a lot of corals on or close to my sandbed, about 16 or so inches deep and I'm running at 50% max.

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So these are the lights at 6" 12" 18" above the water line???

I read the comments in the video.. and he did say they tested at 100%.


"BulkReefSupplyCom 15 hours ago
+Oral Seymour Yup, each channel to 100%, verified via the software, PAR, and wattage. The mesh might have a minor effect on PAR (depending on size), but it likely wouldn't be noticeable."

i been slowly raising my intensity.. currently at 85%.. and i use low color, 40%.

heres my tank: 68g 35.5 x 19.5 x 21.5

i have a new bta on the sand.. had him for 2wks now.. started at about 75%.. hes not moving around.. seems happy there....

i think im gonna bump up another 5% in a couple weeks tho.


im running 3 kessils on this tank.. 1x360we 2x160we, about the equivalent of 2 360s.

i am seeing noticeable growth on my zoas/yuma/toadstool.. ive had my maxima on top for over 5months.. but it seems like i could probably be running these at 100% over time...

my buddy at the LFS has a 2x360we over a smaller tank than mine.. he said they run those at 100% all day.


Im not really understanding the left column and bottom row inches scale.

[ERIC85854]

Originally Posted by manilaboy1vic

So these are the lights at 6" 12" 18" above the water line???

No that's below the water line. The lights were ~8 inches off the water according to the comments section.

[manilaboy1vic]

Originally Posted by ERIC85854

No that's below the water line. The lights were ~8 inches off the water according to the comments section.

oh ok.. so ill be increasing to 100% over a few weeks then..

ramp up to 100% then ramp down to 90% for 3hrs, then ramp down to off..

9hr photoperiod

my LPS/BTA/YUMA are on the bottom.. yuma is growing pretty good tho.. i bet with more light, it will just be faster currently, its multiplying but slowly.

[ERIC85854]

I think I fried an anemone at 50% 10-12 inches below surface.

[manilaboy1vic]

Originally Posted by ERIC85854

I think I fried an anemone at 50% 10-12 inches below surface.

wow.. i would think the anemone would move if the light bothered it....

was the NEM healthy from the start?? It very well could have bleached due to NOT enough light.

i have had my kessils set to 70% for months on end.. and all the coral i have on the sand are totally fine.. my zoas a up a little bit more and are growing excellent,, eagle eyes and goblins on fire exploded..

ive never seen any zoa grow as fast as these goblins.. i got them with 2 polyps and now there are about 10 in total. extremely pleased with the growth rate on my zoas

This guy claims he has his 360 at max intensity for 9hrs a day.. this looks good to me:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...55&postcount=8

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...9&postcount=15

I def. will be maxing my over time.. not gonna do it overnight.

[Esage]

Originally Posted by oseymour

Took some screenshots of the A360 par readings.

If these numbers are at 100% intensity then I've probably been starving my corals a little(especially my euphyllia). I have a lot of corals on or close to my sandbed, about 16 or so inches deep and I'm running at 50% max.

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You're not going to get accurate par readings with the kessil lights

[oseymour]

Originally Posted by Esage

You're not going to get accurate par readings with the kessil lights

What do you mean?

[jumplittlechloe]

I have heard this said also (hard to get accurate par readings). I wish they would have measured pur not par on the lights they tested (usable light for corals). This is why I went Kessil cause the color spectrum stays consistent no matter where you dial in color (talked about in video). I have also heard the uv the kessils give off cannot be measured accurately. They did use a different meter than I have seen used before in the BRS video.

[ERIC85854]

Yes I think they were bleached because my uncle's Kessils turn off and on all day sporadically because they're overheating or something. I think he has the originals (34W x3) with no adjustment knobs.

Originally Posted by manilaboy1vic

wow.. i would think the anemone would move if the light bothered it....

was the NEM healthy from the start?? It very well could have bleached due to NOT enough light.

i have had my kessils set to 70% for months on end.. and all the coral i have on the sand are totally fine.. my zoas a up a little bit more and are growing excellent,, eagle eyes and goblins on fire exploded..

ive never seen any zoa grow as fast as these goblins.. i got them with 2 polyps and now there are about 10 in total. extremely pleased with the growth rate on my zoas

This guy claims he has his 360 at max intensity for 9hrs a day.. this looks good to me:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...55&postcount=8

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...9&postcount=15

I def. will be maxing my over time.. not gonna do it overnight.

[ERIC85854]

I thought that was with cheaper consumer grade equipment? They said the meter they used cost thousands of dollars

Originally Posted by jumplittlechloe

I have heard this said also (hard to get accurate par readings). I wish they would have measured pur not par on the lights they tested (usable light for corals). This is why I went Kessil cause the color spectrum stays consistent no matter where you dial in color (talked about in video). I have also heard the uv the kessils give off cannot be measured accurately. They did use a different meter than I have seen used before in the BRS video.

[Bpb]

Par is par. But a significant portion of the output of the chip is in a range not detected by par meters...nor should it be, since theyre not technically photosynthetically relevant wavelengths. But otherwise the kessil lights should just technically suffer from the same weakness any light source does in the fact that they under state output in the 400-450 nm range (as well as above 650nm, planted tank folks have the same woes we do, just on the opposite end).

[jumplittlechloe]

Originally Posted by ERIC85854

I thought that was with cheaper consumer grade equipment? They said the meter they used cost thousands of dollars

Yes it was, however from my understanding PAR is all the light energy between 400nm and 700nm. PUR (Photosynthetically Usable Radiation) looks at light energy over the same wavelengths, but only the spectrum where the chlorophyll in coral utilizes the energy. The best example is the green spectrum. Green is not very well utilized by chlorophyll - so if you had a light that only produced green light you could have very high PAR values, but very little PUR because the light can't be used for making energy by the chlorophyll very well. This is where I feel like the Kessil light shines because you can't screw up the spectrum like you can on other led fixtures (i.e. Kessil logic). So for instance you can increase par by turning up the white however the useable pur wavelength may be lacking (i.e. higher par is not necessarily better).

[oseymour]

Originally Posted by jumplittlechloe

Yes it was, however from my understanding PAR is all the light energy between 400nm and 700nm. PUR (Photosynthetically Usable Radiation) looks at light energy over the same wavelengths, but only the spectrum where the chlorophyll in coral utilizes the energy. The best example is the green spectrum. Green is not very well utilized by chlorophyll - so if you had a light that only produced green light you could have very high PAR values, but very little PUR because the light can't be used for making energy by the chlorophyll very well. This is where I feel like the Kessil light shines because you can't screw up the spectrum like you can on other led fixtures (i.e. Kessil logic). So for instance you can increase par by turning up the white however the useable pur wavelength may be lacking (i.e. higher par is not necessarily better).

In the video they made it clear that higher par doesn't necessarily equal better.

Ryan also mentioned that he was initially skeptical of Kessils claims of keeping the spectrum usable by corals white the colors changed and now he's a believer based on his tests. (I'm not sure where in the video he said this, I'm on mobile and I'll try to find it later)

This is the first test that is standardized across different types of lights and is a good baseline for us to start experimenting with tuning. I'm know I learned a lot here.

Maybe we should see if they took PUR numbers for all the LEDs and if they can post the results. I'll ask in the video comments.

[jumplittlechloe]

Originally Posted by oseymour

Maybe we should see if they took PUR numbers for all the LEDs and if they can post the results. I'll ask in the video comments.

That would be something I would be very interested in knowing! However with the other lights wouldn't that change significantly as kessils have limited spectrum change and there are multiple adjustments/settings on other lights?

[Scorpius]

Whatever you do please only increase intensity once every two weeks at minimum as these lights are deceptively intense. It's taken me since May 2015 till now to get my Kessil's at 40% intensity. Mainly LPS with some softies. Slow and steady folks cannot be stressed enough.

[manilaboy1vic]

Originally Posted by Scorpius

Whatever you do please only increase intensity once every two weeks at minimum as these lights are deceptively intense. It's taken me since May 2015 till now to get my Kessil's at 40% intensity. Mainly LPS with some softies. Slow and steady folks cannot be stressed enough.

40% ?! What's your dimension top to bottom? Softies and lps are pretty resilient .. I'm at 85% peak. Then it drops to 75% over 4hrs period. Then ramp off.

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by manilaboy1vic

40% ?! What's your dimension top to bottom? Softies and lps are pretty resilient .. I'm at 85% peak. Then it drops to 75% over 4hrs period. Then ramp off.

DSA 65 Neo 37in length 21in width 22in height. Lights approximately 10in off the water. I have two Kessil A360we's. Everyone's water chemistry is different and I've burned many corals to death with these lights. I couldn't begin to think of running that high of an intensity for a long while.

[minus9]

^^^^^^^^^^Agreed! Take it slow, very slow. These lights pack a punch.