PLEASE check out your intended fish purchases here first!

[Molli]

Originally Posted by snorvich

Well, you can get bonding behavior with firefish, but it is more complex as you must get a M/F and they must bond which does not always happen. You can also get it more easily with a pair of gobies that are bonded along with one or a pair (the pistol shrimp do not have to bond/pair) of pistol shrimp. And, of course a M/F pair of banggai cardinals will bond and mate. I see people wanting clowns but I personally find them to be boring relative to their aggressiveness "cost". It is very, very difficult to recommend. I can relate issues associated with choices, however.

I read that you can observe a tank of firefish and chose the pair that seem to be hanging out together for the best chance of a M/F (did I read that here in your thread or elsewhere?) I'll just have to be super picky, and not lose track of the pair when the net goes in the tank...
Oh a pair of gobies! I've read that the female watchmen are olive with blue spots, that would be very nice. Maybe I can find one. Are they picky about choosing mates or will a male and female eventually become a pair?
I love the patterning of the banggai cardinals but I've watched them in stores and they just seem.. I don't know, inactive?
I will certainly nix the clowns in favor of a pair of gobies, thank you very much

Originally Posted by snorvich

It is a recollection rather than an experience with them. As I personally keep a Candy Basslet I know that basslets don't really mix so I never kept a chalk basslet. If you are looking for an interesting fish look at the various possum wrasses available (yes I violated my own rule) as I feel they are much more interesting.

Now I feel special I'll go read about possum wrasses right now!

Originally Posted by snorvich

Actually I think you research your choices well and I commend you for that.

A real compliment coming from you, sir.

Do you see any issue with the revised list?
2 Firefish - M and F
2 Watchmen Gobies -M and F
1-2 Pistol Shrimp
1 Orange back fairy wrasse
1 Possum wrasse (pending research)
1 (far in the future) Mandarin Goby

and also, I want to stay back from the bio limit for the tank, am I safe?

Thank you very much for your time, and I'll probably be back again.

[bongarone]

I'm new to reefs, currently setting up a 110 gallon tall (48 x 18 x 31) with:

Corner overflow, 1.5" drain, 2 x 1.0" returns on back
Sock filter on drain pipe
29 gallon sump baffled for skimmer and refugium w/ macro
Reef Octopus 6 skimmer
2 x Mag Drive 12 pumps
6-bulb, 48" T5 fixture


I'm going for a minimalistic approach. Maybe something like THIS.

With a relatively small amount of live rock, how would I do with one clown (clarkii or similar), one powder blue tang, one yellow tang, and a dozen assorted damsels/chromis?

Thanks.

[shawn.short]

Originally Posted by snorvich

My concern is that you are adding fish that are highly susceptible to parasites with no quarantine protocol.

i have been doing this for approx 7 years and never did a QT tank. with that said i aslo have never had such an expensive system either. I visited the forum u spoke of and i am in the process of getting that check list done. so from now on i will do that if u recommend it.
why do u think my LFS, told me about adding fish all at once? Can i in fact get those fish(ie LT tang,Yellow), later on? or will they fight with the powder blue?

[geezers11]

Okay, how about a trio of scissortail dartfish and a linespot or filamented wrasse in an established 28g nano? I have about 2 inches of sand for the scissortails to burrow in.

Its either that or one of the wrasses and a helfrichi OR a pair of fancy occelaris clowns...

Thanks in advance.

Originally Posted by snorvich

What fish are already there?

Aurora Goby/Pistol Shrimp.

Could I put in a trio of Zebra Barred Dartfish and then a male Blue Flasher Wrasse when it becomes available? I really enjoy the open swimming fish.

Other considerations including those above (I'm interested in the lowest risk combos)

White Banded Possum Wrasse
Helfrichi Firefish
Purple Firefish
Filamented Wrasse (Male)
Pair of Fancy Ocellaris
Zebra Barred Dartfish
Blue Flasher Wrasse

Thanks Steve. Your advice is incredibly helpful to talk us off the ledge of pushing the envelope based on beauty rather than good husbandry.

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by geezers11

Steve,

Only an Orange Stripe Goby/Pistol Shrimp.

should not interfere as it is not water column living

Also saw a trio of Zebra Barred Dartfish that intrigue me as they look similar to the ScissorTail and don't get quite as big (4" vs 5.5").

I think they would do fine

I've read your recommendations for Possum Wrasses and they caught my eye as well. But I worry it will be too reclusive. I do like seeing fish rather than hunting for them :-)

Well, they are somewhat reclusive but I see mine every day and their behavior is peaceful albeit interesting. Ideal for a nano.

Big question is can I also fit in a Line Spot or Filamented Wrasse with the group above? They all appear pretty peaceful and unique.

They are peaceful but very active. If you do this, it would have to be the last fish introduced

So I guess the choices I've whittled down to for a well-established 28g nano with LPS corals and some CUC are...

Filamented or Line Spot Wrasse
Trio of either Zebra Barred or ScissorTail Dartfish
Helfrichi Goby Well, the helfrichi firefish would have to be introduced before any others. Note that you have a lot of prolific jumpers so a covered top with 1/4 inch holes is a must
Possum Wrasse there are various ones in this group, all are superb

Thanks again for all your attentive responses on here. I'm sure its saved some anguish, money and fish lives.

If you are successful, that is my reward!

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by shawn.short

i have been doing this for approx 7 years and never did a QT tank. with that said i aslo have never had such an expensive system either.

Fixing problems in large systems is expensive and difficult. Prevention is the key!

I visited the forum u spoke of and i am in the process of getting that check list done. so from now on i will do that if u recommend it.
why do u think my LFS, told me about adding fish all at once?

Well, they sell fish! And if yours die, replacements will be needed. This thread is because LFS have an inherent conflict of interest. We do not sell anything here.

Can i in fact get those fish(ie LT tang,Yellow), later on? or will they fight with the powder blue?

Well, mixing tangs, even in your sized system is always a gamble. Tangs will reduce their number if they feel cramped.

[shawn.short]

Originally Posted by snorvich

Well, mixing tangs, even in your sized system is always a gamble. Tangs will reduce their number if they feel cramped.

well as always i am thankful for the knowledge, I am sure it will save me thousands lol.

After a couple 3 or 4 months ill be shopping again for fish. In your opinion, what are some good choices in fish for my tank?

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Molli

I read that you can observe a tank of firefish and chose the pair that seem to be hanging out together for the best chance of a M/F (did I read that here in your thread or elsewhere?)

Yes, that was likely me. NOT easy to do, however!

I'll just have to be super picky, and not lose track of the pair when the net goes in the tank...
Oh a pair of gobies! I've read that the female watchmen are olive with blue spots, that would be very nice. Maybe I can find one. Are they picky about choosing mates or will a male and female eventually become a pair?

I see them sold occasionally. If they do not bond, only one will survive.

I love the patterning of the banggai cardinals but I've watched them in stores and they just seem.. I don't know, inactive?

Correct. Most people do not realize that cardinals, in general, are more active at night

I will certainly nix the clowns in favor of a pair of gobies, thank you very much





Now I feel special I'll go read about possum wrasses right now!

There are actually a few different ones, and all share the same characteristics. I LOVE possum wrasses



A real compliment coming from you, sir. You do your homework so I feel more comfortable trying to understand where you are coming from!

Do you see any issue with the revised list?
2 Firefish - M and F Be sure to introduce them first
2 Watchmen Gobies -M and F
1-2 Pistol Shrimp
1 Orange back fairy wrasse
1 Possum wrasse (pending research)
1 (far in the future) Mandarin Goby You need about 7-8 months maturity, ideally with a producing refugium

and also, I want to stay back from the bio limit for the tank, am I safe?

Yes.

Thank you very much for your time, and I'll probably be back again.

My advice, which most people ignore, is to read, read, and read, then ask questions. If you want some superb, but heavy duty reading, look up work by Stephen Spotte. Unfortunately only in hard back, but used is occasionally available.

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by shawn.short

well as always i am thankful for the knowledge, I am sure it will save me thousands lol.

After a couple 3 or 4 months ill be shopping again for fish. In your opinion, what are some good choices in fish for my tank?

I have largish tanks. I personally only have one boss fish per tank, but many and diverse smaller fish. And I love the activity and color of anthias. However I normally do not make recommendations as our tastes will differ.

[shawn.short]

anthias i love, how many can one have ? dispar? with lyratails?

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by shawn.short

anthias i love, how many can one have ? dispar? with lyratails?

I do not recommend lyretails as they are among the semiaggressive ones. In my 350, I have 12 carberryi with no problem. Select among the peaceful ones and you can mix and match to some degree.

[Joe0813]

well its almost time for my shopping to begin with some fish.... my 75 gal is cycling. it will be a full reef tank. i posted here before but im going to change my list around and see if it will work out.

- Ocellaris clowns. (Pair)
- Kole tang or a Tomini Tang
- Bicolor Angelfish
- Scooter blenny
- watchmen goby/pistol shrimp
- Blue mandarin.... only if my tank has pods for it to eat
- Maybe 2 or 3 fish that will school together... if theres room

Inverts
- Bubble tip Anemone
- Red sea star
- Maxima Clam

Clean up crew
- 20 scarlet reef hermit crabs
- 15 astraea turbo snails
- 20 Dwarf blue leg hermit crabs
- 1 fighting conch
- 1 Arrow crab
- 2 Emerald Crab
- 3 Peppermint shrimp
- 1 Coral banded shrimp
- 10 Nassarius snails

[Mutz]

Originally Posted by snorvich

I am a huge fan of the possum wrasses. Have you considered any of them?

OK this is my updated list

55gal reef tank, about 3 months old at this point.
I have 2 percula clownfish in there, 3-4 corals (yelllow polyps+mystery coral, flowerpot, hammer).

FIRST ---> Purple Firefish Goby
Spotted Cardinalfish (2-4)
Royal Gramma
Golden Assessor
Possum Wrasse (not sure which yet)

I don't know if this is the correct place to ask but you mentioned the Purple Goby being introduced first. Should I remove my Clown pair and put the Goby in solo? then reintroduce the clowns later? Or can I just put the Purple Goby in now. I have been reading about quarantine tanks and was going to start it with the purple goby. If fish order is important are there any others on this list that order matters? I want to ask my LFS to get me a purple goby soon. Then get 1 or 2 more after each quarantine period.

[tangs_tank]

Hi everyone,

As my system is cycling I thought I'd do some fish planning. I have a 180 gal DT, 75gal sump w refugium, skimmer, chiller, calcium reactor, phosban reactor, 200lbs all live rocks. I was thinking of the following, probably in the listed order unless otherwise suggested. I will hope to keep SPS and LPS too.

Ocel. Clowns x2
One spot Foxface
Royal gramma Basslet
Flasher Wrasse
Lyretail Anthias x2
Black Axil Chromis
Harptail Blenny
Flame Angel???
Powder Brown Tang
Regal Blue Tang
Mandarin

Thanks

[reeferstace]

For tangs tank:

Wait until your tank is established with a large live amphipod/copepod supply before you get a mandarin.

Many flame angels will nip at corals.

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Joe0813

well its almost time for my shopping to begin with some fish.... my 75 gal is cycling. it will be a full reef tank. i posted here before but im going to change my list around and see if it will work out.

- Ocellaris clowns. (Pair)
- Kole tang or a Tomini Tang both are excellent, personally I like the Kole Tang
- Bicolor Angelfish Not reef safe
- Scooter blenny
- watchmen goby/pistol shrimp
- Blue mandarin.... only if my tank has pods for it to eat
- Maybe 2 or 3 fish that will school together... if theres room

Unlikely to find fish that will shoal in a 75 gallon tank

Inverts
- Bubble tip Anemone
- Red sea star star fish most often starve to death except in very large tanks
- Maxima Clam

Clean up crew
- 20 scarlet reef hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 15 astraea turbo snails
- 20 Dwarf blue leg hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 1 fighting conch excellent
- 1 Arrow crab definitely not
- 2 Emerald Crab I do not recommend crabs as they are opportunistic feeders
- 3 Peppermint shrimp
- 1 Coral banded shrimp can take fish and invertebrates
- 10 Nassarius snails

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Mutz

OK this is my updated list

55gal reef tank, about 3 months old at this point.
I have 2 percula clownfish in there, 3-4 corals (yelllow polyps+mystery coral, flowerpot, hammer).

FIRST ---> Purple Firefish Goby
Spotted Cardinalfish (2-4)
Royal Gramma
Golden Assessor
Possum Wrasse (not sure which yet)

I don't know if this is the correct place to ask but you mentioned the Purple Goby being introduced first. Should I remove my Clown pair and put the Goby in solo? then reintroduce the clowns later? Or can I just put the Purple Goby in now. I have been reading about quarantine tanks and was going to start it with the purple goby. If fish order is important are there any others on this list that order matters? I want to ask my LFS to get me a purple goby soon. Then get 1 or 2 more after each quarantine period.

QT is essential for long term success in this hobby. If the clowns are not already sexually mature, you will be fine with introducing the firefish after QT.

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by tangs_tank

Hi everyone,

As my system is cycling I thought I'd do some fish planning. I have a 180 gal DT, 75gal sump w refugium, skimmer, chiller, calcium reactor, phosban reactor, 200lbs all live rocks. I was thinking of the following, probably in the listed order unless otherwise suggested. I will hope to keep SPS and LPS too.

Ocel. Clowns x2
One spot Foxface
Royal gramma Basslet
Flasher Wrasse
Lyretail Anthias x2 These are semi aggressive, would you consider peaceful anthias?
Black Axil Chromis
Harptail Blenny
Flame Angel??? Not reef safe the vast majority of the time
Powder Brown Tang
Regal Blue Tang In the long run, really needs an 8 foot tank
Mandarin seven months maturity

Thanks

[Joe0813]

well its almost time for my shopping to begin with some fish.... my 75 gal is cycling. it will be a full reef tank. i posted here before but im going to change my list around and see if it will work out.

- Ocellaris clowns. (Pair)
- Kole tang or a Tomini Tang both are excellent, personally I like the Kole Tang
- Bicolor Angelfish Not reef safe
- Scooter blenny
- watchmen goby/pistol shrimp
- Blue mandarin.... only if my tank has pods for it to eat
- Maybe 2 or 3 fish that will school together... if theres room

Unlikely to find fish that will shoal in a 75 gallon tank

Inverts
- Bubble tip Anemone
- Red sea star star fish most often starve to death except in very large tanks
- Maxima Clam

Clean up crew
- 20 scarlet reef hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 15 astraea turbo snails
- 20 Dwarf blue leg hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 1 fighting conch excellent
- 1 Arrow crab definitely not
- 2 Emerald Crab I do not recommend crabs as they are opportunistic feeders
- 3 Peppermint shrimp
- 1 Coral banded shrimp can take fish and invertebrates
- 10 Nassarius snails.............

so instead of the angel ill do disbar and a purple anthias...
for a clean up crew instead of all the crabs should i just up the number of snails?

[sneaton]

in a 48l x 24w x 12h frag tank could i keep a yellow coris wrasse and a kole tang?

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Joe0813

well its almost time for my shopping to begin with some fish.... my 75 gal is cycling. it will be a full reef tank. i posted here before but im going to change my list around and see if it will work out.

- Ocellaris clowns. (Pair)
- Kole tang or a Tomini Tang both are excellent, personally I like the Kole Tang
- Bicolor Angelfish Not reef safe
- Scooter blenny
- watchmen goby/pistol shrimp
- Blue mandarin.... only if my tank has pods for it to eat
- Maybe 2 or 3 fish that will school together... if theres room

Unlikely to find fish that will shoal in a 75 gallon tank

Inverts
- Bubble tip Anemone
- Red sea star star fish most often starve to death except in very large tanks
- Maxima Clam

Clean up crew
- 20 scarlet reef hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 15 astraea turbo snails
- 20 Dwarf blue leg hermit crabs I am not a fan of hermits as they are opportunistic feeders and will kill snails
- 1 fighting conch excellent
- 1 Arrow crab definitely not
- 2 Emerald Crab I do not recommend crabs as they are opportunistic feeders
- 3 Peppermint shrimp
- 1 Coral banded shrimp can take fish and invertebrates
- 10 Nassarius snails.............

so instead of the angel ill do disbar and a purple anthias...

A purple queen anthias is an expert level fish and should not be tried unless you have that level of experience

for a clean up crew instead of all the crabs should i just up the number of snails?

I suggest no crabs and a great variety of snails as well as a fighting conch

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by sneaton

in a 48l x 24w x 12h frag tank could i keep a yellow coris wrasse and a kole tang?

The tang might be a bit iffy as it is an algae eater, the wrasse will be fine.

[tangs_tank]

Hi Steve,

I'm open to Anthias that are peaceful. If you can point me towards a couple so I can research them.

Thanks
Peter

[milkyboy]

I'm setting up a nano tank dedicated to a watchman goby and pistol shrimp pair. The setup consists of the following;

• Tank: 45cm rectangular tank, roughly 32 litres (excluding live rock).
• Filtration: ~4kg Live rock, live sand bed, circulation & skimmer
• Circulation will come from a single 1600 Koralia powerhead, with the possibility of adding additional pumps later.
• A sand bed 2-3" thick consisting of varied grades of coral sand; from 1mm grains to 5mm bones will be supplied for the goby and shrimp to dig in. This will be seeded from several cups of live sand from the fuges at work to get some life into it!
• Skimmer will be an AquaC nano Remora, a skimmer rated up to ~100L, they are highly appraised by the majority of reefers. Nitrate and Phosphate reduction will be done through regular water changes and RedSea NO3-PO4-X liquid carbon additive; this is why a good skimmer is key!
• Lighting is a 12w Aqua Medic LED bulb, accompanied by an AquaRay flexi blue LED strip. Both will be on timers to gradually decrease light intensity so as not to freak the fish out
• Corals will include zoos, morphs, rics, xenia and other softies.

Was hoping to add something else other than just the goby/fish pair, was thinking perhaps a pair of red line cleaner shrimp or a Royal Gramma?

Thanks, Milky

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by tangs_tank

Hi Steve,

I'm open to Anthias that are peaceful. If you can point me towards a couple so I can research them.

Thanks
Peter

Carberryi and Resplendent are superb and not difficult