Let's talk about Alkalinity, Calcium and Magnesium in an SPS Tank - Page 5

DocG · 08/13/2007, 09:35 PM

Capn,

You have to go over to the states and sneak it back into Canada. You cannot buy pickling lime in Canada.

I have used the slurry method for a while now. On a system with 450 gallons of water I add one or two teaspoons of kalk in a 1 litre jug and stir it up really well and dump it into the high flow area of the sump. On my system the 1-2 teaspoons a day (not every day but more often then not) does not really affect the Calcium or alkalinity levels at all but it does keep the pH from dipping under 8.0 and generally keeps the pH more stable, which is why I started doing it.

TwistedTiger · 08/14/2007, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DocG
Capn,

You have to go over to the states and sneak it back into Canada. You cannot buy pickling lime in Canada.

Can't you just order calcium hydroxide from two parts? It's pretty cheap. http://www.twopartsolution.com/index...64decc6ee46a02

Aquarist007 · 08/14/2007, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TwistedTiger
Can't you just order calcium hydroxide from two parts? It's pretty cheap. http://www.twopartsolution.com/index...64decc6ee46a02

when I asked my supplier he convinced me not to use kalk without dripping--said it was messy and easy to error?
After talking to you guys --I don't see a problem with this?

TwistedTiger · 08/14/2007, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
when I asked my supplier he convinced me not to use kalk without dripping--said it was messy and easy to error?
After talking to you guys --I don't see a problem with this?

I've been using mine with an auto topoff for about 3 years with no problems. Much much easier than dripping and much more consistent. Just make sure you use an auto topoff system that adds small amounts at a time.

JetCat USA · 08/14/2007, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
..........said it was messy and easy to error?

it's messy if you're so inclined to slosh the heck out of it when making up a slurry, 99% of people are capable of doing it with minimal to no mess at all and if you test your system, find the proper dose and then add that much it's no different then any other additive/supplement you add to the system 99% of people are talented enough to do that as well, i guess your supplier is that 1%

Aquarist007 · 08/14/2007, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JetCat USA
it's messy if you're so inclined to slosh the heck out of it when making up a slurry, 99% of people are capable of doing it with minimal to no mess at all and if you test your system, find the proper dose and then add that much it's no different then any other additive/supplement you add to the system 99% of people are talented enough to do that as well, i guess your supplier is that 1%

thanks--I'll start using it---he knows I am a chemistry/biology teacher----we only slosh the heck out of our tim hortons coffee

TwistedTiger · 08/14/2007, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JetCat USA
99% of people are talented enough to do that as well, i guess your supplier is that 1%

Or could it be that I just bought 4.5 pounds of kalc for $9.99 which should last me well over a year and there is more profit to be made from other alk/calc supplements?

JetCat USA · 08/14/2007, 08:31 AM

With the advent of the internet and a computer connected to it in most homes these days LFS owners who consistently give poor advice will find that their margin of profit would be much higher if they actually gave educated advice rather then discouraging their customers to the point they take their business elsewhere.

I'm sure if capn's supplier had been so kind as to say "Yeah, that Kalk stuff works just as good as any other additive, it can be messy and you need to be careful getting the right dose", he'd of bought some that day

Aquarist007 · 08/14/2007, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JetCat USA
With the advent of the internet and a computer connected to it in most homes these days LFS owners who consistently give poor advice will find that their margin of profit would be much higher if they actually gave educated advice rather then discouraging their customers to the point they take their business elsewhere.

I'm sure if capn's supplier had been so kind as to say "Yeah, that Kalk stuff works just as good as any other additive, it can be messy and you need to be careful getting the right dose", he'd of bought some that day

actually he is a mail order supplier--not live fish---and one of the guys I trust---maybe he doesn't trust me cause of the coffee stains on my shirts _LOL

LFS---that's a hole ball of worms---criticism of them got me in hot water with my local reef site. I don't know if I should get into that here say I agree 200 per cent what you said above.---and I have learned the value of a guarantine tank for many reasons.

five.five-six · 08/14/2007, 12:46 PM

ok, I use my ACIII to pump my kalkwasser at 8.13. after messing around with the sump fan speed and the lower limit ph I have gotten it to about match evaporation at 5 gal ~3.5 days. currently I am adding iodine to the kalkwasser. is there any reason I can not add Mg to the kalkwasser. ie: test, do the chart, add X amount of mg to kalkwasser, test again in 3 days? or can I just dump it in my sump..

The Reefer91 · 08/18/2007, 08:53 AM

i have a question. if you use a calcium reactor without a pH monitor and simply have it on a timer, is there anything else you should be supplementing, like randy's two part?

sorry if it's a dumb question.

TwistedTiger · 08/18/2007, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Reefer91
i have a question. if you use a calcium reactor without a pH monitor and simply have it on a timer,

Are you talking about running the CO2 on a timer? If so that's not a good idea IMO. Without a controller you just need to set your bubbles count and drip rate at a reasonable rate for your tank volume and then test ALK/Calc daily until you get it set where you need it.

As far as a PH monitor you should have some way to check PH in a reef tank even if you are not running a calcium reactor, but neither a ph controller or a ph monitor are required equipment for a reactor.

The Reefer91 · 08/18/2007, 09:24 AM

wait, but wouldn't that mean i would need to continously run the reactor? or would the CO2 just pool up inside the reactor?

TwistedTiger · 08/18/2007, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Reefer91
wait, but wouldn't that mean i would need to continously run the reactor? or would the CO2 just pool up inside the reactor?

A calcium reactor is a continuous operation piece of equipment.

TwistedTiger · 08/18/2007, 09:33 AM

Try this article and see if it helps you any.

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/20...ture/index.php

The Reefer91 · 08/18/2007, 09:58 AM

thanks!

apbt217 · 08/20/2007, 03:25 PM

My Calcium levels are pretty steady anywhere from 425-455ppm, my Alkanity is running pretty high dKH 14 (is this bad) and my Magnesium is at 1350ppm. I'm topping off with R/O water trying to get the dKH to come down a bit and I heard that with higher Mag levels you get better Coraline growth? Is there any truth to that?

apbt217 · 08/20/2007, 03:25 PM

My Calcium levels are pretty steady anywhere from 425-455ppm, my Alkanity is running pretty high dKH 14 (is this bad) and my Magnesium is at 1350ppm. I'm topping off with R/O water trying to get the dKH to come down a bit and I heard that with higher Mag levels you get better Coraline growth? Is there any truth to that?

JB NY · 08/20/2007, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by apbt217
My Calcium levels are pretty steady anywhere from 425-455ppm, my Alkanity is running pretty high dKH 14 (is this bad) and my Magnesium is at 1350ppm. I'm topping off with R/O water trying to get the dKH to come down a bit and I heard that with higher Mag levels you get better Coraline growth? Is there any truth to that?

14 dKH is a little high. I try to run it around 8.

Topping off with r/o water is what you should be doing. You need to stop dosing to get your alk down.

I did not notice any change in coralline growth when I had higher mg levels.

Aquarist007 · 08/21/2007, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JB NY
14 dKH is a little high. I try to run it around 8.

Topping off with r/o water is what you should be doing. You need to stop dosing to get your alk down.

I did not notice any change in coralline growth when I had higher mg levels.

the question becomes--why is your dkH so high-----
Are you using buffers to control your pH----- most contain boron which will up your dkH readings.

MJAnderson · 08/21/2007, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by five.five-six
ok, I use my ACIII to pump my kalkwasser at 8.13. after messing around with the sump fan speed and the lower limit ph I have gotten it to about match evaporation at 5 gal ~3.5 days. currently I am adding iodine to the kalkwasser. is there any reason I can not add Mg to the kalkwasser. ie: test, do the chart, add X amount of mg to kalkwasser, test again in 3 days? or can I just dump it in my sump..

One of the nice (or not so nice) things about Kalkwasser is that several heavy metals precipitate out of a solution with a PH of 12.4 (2 tsb per gallon of RO). Mag is one of them. Whatever you add will just end up in the bottom of the bucket (assuming you let it settle and just add clear limewater. A quote from Randy:

"Regardless of how much magnesium is present in the limewater to begin with, it will nearly all precipitate from solution, and clear limewater is not a source of magnesium for an aquarium. "

From this article:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/may2003/chem.htm

I can't find it now, but one of Randy's articles talked about what you can dose in kalk. I THINK one of them was Strontium.

dheinze · 08/21/2007, 12:09 PM

Hi all, I just skimmed through this so sorry if this question has already been asked. My alk is low (about 1.6 meq/L), and I want to raise it with baking soda. How fast can I change the alk and not stress my corals? FYI, I run kalkwasser in the ATO for balanced sumplement; I got into this (low alk) situation by dosing only calcium early on in my reefing career.

Aquarist007 · 08/22/2007, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dheinze
Hi all, I just skimmed through this so sorry if this question has already been asked. My alk is low (about 1.6 meq/L), and I want to raise it with baking soda. How fast can I change the alk and not stress my corals? FYI, I run kalkwasser in the ATO for balanced sumplement; I got into this (low alk) situation by dosing only calcium early on in my reefing career.

what's your pH, calcium and magnesium at?

dheinze · 08/22/2007, 03:15 PM

Since I use kalk, my pH runs on the high side~8.4; Ca at last test was 425ppm, and I have yet to test Mg (no test kit right now).

Aquarist007 · 08/22/2007, 05:12 PM

Imo---do a few water changes and see if this brings back the normal seawater chemistry.

08/14/2007, 12:46 PM	#110
five.five-six Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Corona Posts: 7,827 Blog Entries: 6	ok, I use my ACIII to pump my kalkwasser at 8.13. after messing around with the sump fan speed and the lower limit ph I have gotten it to about match evaporation at 5 gal ~3.5 days. currently I am adding iodine to the kalkwasser. is there any reason I can not add Mg to the kalkwasser. ie: test, do the chart, add X amount of mg to kalkwasser, test again in 3 days? or can I just dump it in my sump.. __________________ Originally posted by yellowslayer13: "I hate that hole" Current Tank Info: SCMAS Member 225 peninsula euroreef RS180 Apex 400W X 3 20k radiums / Spectra mixed SPS

08/18/2007, 08:53 AM	#111
The Reefer91 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 1,250	i have a question. if you use a calcium reactor without a pH monitor and simply have it on a timer, is there anything else you should be supplementing, like randy's two part? sorry if it's a dumb question. __________________ Dan "Every day we fade little by little, 'till there's nothing left of us but the lies we've sown." Current Tank Info: 20g L display: 2x65watt Coralife light, Octopus 150 needle wheel protein skimmer, 1 Koralia 2 and 2 powersweeps, and a DIY sump/fuge.....120G in the works!!!

08/18/2007, 09:24 AM	#113
The Reefer91 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 1,250	wait, but wouldn't that mean i would need to continously run the reactor? or would the CO2 just pool up inside the reactor? __________________ Dan "Every day we fade little by little, 'till there's nothing left of us but the lies we've sown." Current Tank Info: 20g L display: 2x65watt Coralife light, Octopus 150 needle wheel protein skimmer, 1 Koralia 2 and 2 powersweeps, and a DIY sump/fuge.....120G in the works!!!

08/18/2007, 09:58 AM	#116
The Reefer91 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 1,250	thanks! __________________ Dan "Every day we fade little by little, 'till there's nothing left of us but the lies we've sown." Current Tank Info: 20g L display: 2x65watt Coralife light, Octopus 150 needle wheel protein skimmer, 1 Koralia 2 and 2 powersweeps, and a DIY sump/fuge.....120G in the works!!!

08/22/2007, 05:12 PM	#125
Aquarist007 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, Canada Posts: 28,240 Blog Entries: 1	Imo---do a few water changes and see if this brings back the normal seawater chemistry. __________________ I prefer my substrates stirred but not shaken Current Tank Info: 150gal long mixed reef, 90gal sump, 60 gal refugium with 200 lbs live rock

08/13/2007, 09:35 PM	#101
DocG Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sarnia, Ontario Posts: 561	Capn, You have to go over to the states and sneak it back into Canada. You cannot buy pickling lime in Canada. I have used the slurry method for a while now. On a system with 450 gallons of water I add one or two teaspoons of kalk in a 1 litre jug and stir it up really well and dump it into the high flow area of the sump. On my system the 1-2 teaspoons a day (not every day but more often then not) does not really affect the Calcium or alkalinity levels at all but it does keep the pH from dipping under 8.0 and generally keeps the pH more stable, which is why I started doing it.

08/14/2007, 08:31 AM	#108
JetCat USA Moved On Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 2,847	With the advent of the internet and a computer connected to it in most homes these days LFS owners who consistently give poor advice will find that their margin of profit would be much higher if they actually gave educated advice rather then discouraging their customers to the point they take their business elsewhere. I'm sure if capn's supplier had been so kind as to say "Yeah, that Kalk stuff works just as good as any other additive, it can be messy and you need to be careful getting the right dose", he'd of bought some that day

08/18/2007, 09:33 AM	#115
TwistedTiger Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: B.R. La. Posts: 925	Try this article and see if it helps you any. http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/20...ture/index.php

08/20/2007, 03:25 PM	#117
apbt217 Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 46	My Calcium levels are pretty steady anywhere from 425-455ppm, my Alkanity is running pretty high dKH 14 (is this bad) and my Magnesium is at 1350ppm. I'm topping off with R/O water trying to get the dKH to come down a bit and I heard that with higher Mag levels you get better Coraline growth? Is there any truth to that?

08/20/2007, 03:25 PM	#118
apbt217 Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 46	My Calcium levels are pretty steady anywhere from 425-455ppm, my Alkanity is running pretty high dKH 14 (is this bad) and my Magnesium is at 1350ppm. I'm topping off with R/O water trying to get the dKH to come down a bit and I heard that with higher Mag levels you get better Coraline growth? Is there any truth to that?

08/21/2007, 12:09 PM	#122
dheinze Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Galveston, TX Posts: 106	Hi all, I just skimmed through this so sorry if this question has already been asked. My alk is low (about 1.6 meq/L), and I want to raise it with baking soda. How fast can I change the alk and not stress my corals? FYI, I run kalkwasser in the ATO for balanced sumplement; I got into this (low alk) situation by dosing only calcium early on in my reefing career.

08/22/2007, 03:15 PM	#124
dheinze Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Galveston, TX Posts: 106	Since I use kalk, my pH runs on the high side~8.4; Ca at last test was 425ppm, and I have yet to test Mg (no test kit right now).